Originally Posted by nilbog

[Frostback]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't have the evidence handy right now, but I know people have reported the zone having a good ZEM in clasic

Not good enough!

[Nirgon]

Let slate come to da tunnel

Increase his assist radius

Pras Lord Cazic Thule

[Darkfuneral]

Nilbog

[Ravage]

Kedge had the highest ZEM in EQ. Maybe almost 200 if I remember. Was hit by the nerf bat on P99 IRC because people couldn't play nice with the casual scum while power leveling at the zone in if i recall. Swordfishes n all.

[loramin]

Originally Posted by Ravage [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Kedge had the highest ZEM in EQ. Maybe almost 200 if I remember. Was hit by the nerf bat on P99 IRC because people couldn't play nice with the casual scum while power leveling at the zone in if i recall. Swordfishes n all.

A friend of mine played in the early days here, and he said Kedg exp was stupidly good ... like 3-4% per kill in the 40s good. That would fit a ZEM of 200, and that clearly doesn't seem classic.

But it seems like maybe there was an over-correction because of that, because as I said Kedge certainly didn't feel like even a ZEM 100 (140%), which is the wiki (presumably based on classic EQEmu data) shows.

Really, the frustrating part about this is ... why would I (or anyone) spend time trying to find evidence that it should have any particular ZEM, if Nilbog won't use it? I don't expect Nilbog to declare "the ZEM for every zone on P99 is _____", but if he could at least say
"I want classic ZEMs on Project 1999, and will consider evidence to make them more classic like I do with everything else", at least then there'd be a reason to.

I want to interpret:

Originally Posted by Nilbog

source?

that way, but maybe Nilbog still does want some unclassic ZEMs, and was just calling me out to see if I was complaining about some other ones? C'mon great beloved P99 dictator for life, please, give us those magic words: "Yes, I want classic ZEMs on Project 1999"! [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Dolalin]

They haven't even had a patch yet since I wrapped up the Classic ZEMs bug thread, maybe wait for that before you declare they aren't listening Loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Swish]

Just remember with every classic change comes people threatening to quit (and not quitting) or asking for some kind of other QoL upgrade like in game maps or something else irrelevant to classic EQ.

[loramin]

Originally Posted by Dolalin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

They haven't even had a patch yet since I wrapped up the Classic ZEMs bug thread, maybe wait for that before you declare they aren't listening Loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Please don't take this the wrong way, because I have immense respect for you, but ... you just rolled onto this scene. This is not "Loramin's crusade to insult the devs", this is just Loramin stating how it's been for over half a decade. Prior to your ZEM thread (from what, a month or two ago?), there was ZERO dev interest whatsoever in all things ZEM-related, and again it was "community knowledge" (since 2011!) that they were not interested.

Now to be fair, Nilbog never said "we're making ZEMS unclassic!" ... because Nilbog never says anything ... especially about ZEMS. I mean, even his post here was literally one word ... and it was a question! Literally no one but Nilbog knows what the word "classic" means to him, and whether ANY exception (ZEM or otherwise) qualifies. And he doesn't talk.

I've been a forum addict for five-plus years, plus at one point I went back through old dev posts to compile the Rulings page. I'm fairly confident that if there had been even a single word (even a "sources?") about this topic, I would have seen it ... but I didn't. If you see something (like Kedge's ZEM) stay unclassic on a classic project for that long, and the devs won't talk about it, the logical assumption is: they don't want to fix it (and that's even if I didn't have wiki and forum text going way way back that further supports the idea). And again, read old forum posts: I'm far from the only one to have believed this.

And if you go through those old posts you know what else you'll find? People didn't believe Green would ever exist (let alone Teal) ... and yet you will find me in giant one-sided RnF arguments with people (for years) saying "Blue is beta" with no one believing me.

So ... if I'm willing to argue with the entire rest of the forum community, because I took the dev's word and they didn't ... I really don't think it's fair to characterize me as someone who doesn't listen to, or doesn't believe the devs.

I just believe the proof is in the pudding. For a very long time everything the devs have said and done has at indicated a strong desire to keep the ZEM status quo. Now that the fire of Green and Teal in in Nilbog's belly I want to believe he's interested in classic evidence and classic ZEMs, because like all the other long-timers here I've drunk the classic kool-aid.

But I'm just not going to assume that my hopes and dreams have come true because Nilbog made a one word question post: I'm waiting for him to tell me off here, or (much better yet) answer your thread with a patch, and then I will absolutely believe. But look, four years ago there was more evidence that Green was coming, than there was just a few months back that Nilbog would even consider ZEM changes. Maybe forgive me for wanting to see something before I assume things have done a U-turn after five years?

[Glasken]

The ZEM values we have are not classic. As has been posted on the bug forums, ZEMs were pretty flat throughout the game until random ZEM mods were implemented in luclin.

By all evidence posted, ZEMs throughout most of the game should be 75, with dungeons being 80. Some specific areas went up to 100 such as Kedge Keep, but these were edge cases.

Random ZEMs, and ZEMs higher than 100 came about with the implementation of "Hot Zones", which would be changed frequently. The static, and crazy high ZEMs we have on P99 are like a Hot Zone patch stuck in time, and are out of era for the project.

[kelsoider]

I know it's not classic, but am I alone in thinking that rotating hot zones would be the best solution to the effect of ZEM on certain zones? Maybe it would take too much work to implement.