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  #1  
Old 02-09-2011, 10:22 AM
fischsemmel fischsemmel is offline
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Default Warrior or Shadow Knight?

For any of you who have the inclination, please help me figure out which I should play!

I'm feeling right now like I'd rather play a warrior... but please don't reply with "well then you should play your warrior." After all, a week ago I "felt" like playing a rogue... and now I have quite a dislike for him.


1. The character will never be played solo.
2. The vast majority of its playtime will be duo with a shaman.
3. Once in a while the two of us might get into a full group.
4. I will almost certainly never raid with the character.
5. I have a 50 necro to farm gear/plat for my warrior.


It seems to me, being uneducated in the ways of both SKs and warriors alike, that SKs have a lot of tools that allow them to solo decently (as well as any melee can really solo): lifetaps, fearkite potential, invis and ivu, and feign death. But I will never be solo.

Warriors end up with higher skill caps (off, def, weapons, dodge, parry, etc.) right? Or is that only once Kunark raises stat caps? Plus warriors have berserk, have disciplines, and can choose to dual wield or 2h or sword+board.


I can't decide [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
  #2  
Old 02-09-2011, 10:24 AM
azeth azeth is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fischsemmel [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
2. The vast majority of its playtime will be duo with a shaman.
Exclusively based on that point I'd roll an SK. Between lifetaps, slows, FD pulling and Torpor you pretty much win.
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Originally Posted by michinz2 View Post
You can't deal with VPN on VM and i know it, you can denie it as you want and if you really belive in it, you have a dove-brain. if i would "boxing" i would do this and wouldn't wait so long for my petition to get ip approved, i know it work and i know some ppl using it, you are just denying it cause you have no argue about this only reiterate "against rules" like a "perfect soldier".

I release my hatred against this stupid thing
Baalette.
  #3  
Old 02-09-2011, 10:25 AM
fischsemmel fischsemmel is offline
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Just realized in number 5 I said "for my warrior" instead of "for my new character" or "for my SK/warrior."

Wonder if it's a sign.
  #4  
Old 02-09-2011, 10:27 AM
fischsemmel fischsemmel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by azeth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Exclusively based on that point I'd roll an SK. Between lifetaps, slows, FD pulling and Torpor you pretty much win.
Somewhat-crappy lifetaps and FD pulling are more valuable than better skill caps, berserk, disciplines, and more weapons options?
  #5  
Old 02-09-2011, 10:31 AM
azeth azeth is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fischsemmel [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Somewhat-crappy lifetaps and FD pulling are more valuable than better skill caps, berserk, disciplines, and more weapons options?
1. "better skill caps" <- What does this have to do with anything? Doing damage in a SK or War / Sham duo has no baring on whether or not you win or lose.

2. berserk? With a shaman healing you exclusively you had better hope you're not relying on running low HP. Not to mention Shaman heals are incredibly inefficient except for Torpor which negates your damage dealing ability anyways.

3. Disciplines - useful, but for warriors their pretty much designed for raid situations or at least not at all attune to duoing with a shaman.

4. More weapon choices - true, but again no baring on whether or not you can effectively duo with a shaman.

5. Since when are SK life taps crappy? Torpor + life tap on any non-Int caster type mob is a legit win button.


It sounds like you've already made up your mind, but I'm not exactly breaking the story here when I say the best melee/healer duo is Monk/Shaman followed extremely closely by Sk/Shaman.

Also, I'm interested to know how you plan to break camps without Lull or FD? I suppose you could root, but doesn't sound very efficient.
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Originally Posted by michinz2 View Post
You can't deal with VPN on VM and i know it, you can denie it as you want and if you really belive in it, you have a dove-brain. if i would "boxing" i would do this and wouldn't wait so long for my petition to get ip approved, i know it work and i know some ppl using it, you are just denying it cause you have no argue about this only reiterate "against rules" like a "perfect soldier".

I release my hatred against this stupid thing
Baalette.
Last edited by azeth; 02-09-2011 at 10:35 AM..
  #6  
Old 02-09-2011, 10:52 AM
fischsemmel fischsemmel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by azeth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
1. "better skill caps" <- What does this have to do with anything? Doing damage in a SK or War / Sham duo has no baring on whether or not you win or lose.

2. berserk? With a shaman healing you exclusively you had better hope you're not relying on running low HP. Not to mention Shaman heals are incredibly inefficient except for Torpor which negates your damage dealing ability anyways.

3. Disciplines - useful, but for warriors their pretty much designed for raid situations or at least not at all attune to duoing with a shaman.

4. More weapon choices - true, but again no baring on whether or not you can effectively duo with a shaman.

5. Since when are SK life taps crappy? Torpor + life tap on any non-Int caster type mob is a legit win button.


It sounds like you've already made up your mind, but I'm not exactly breaking the story here when I say the best melee/healer duo is Monk/Shaman followed extremely closely by Sk/Shaman.

Also, I'm interested to know how you plan to break camps without Lull or FD? I suppose you could root, but doesn't sound very efficient.

Remember I came here asking for advice because I didn't know the answers to these things myself, and that I specifically mentioned that I knew little about SKs and warriors right off the bat. Given that, I would be better served with a post explaining why things work in a given way (such as "Warriors do more damage than shadowknights, sure, but because of X, Y, and Z, that doesn't actually make them work better when paired with a shaman") rather than asking me what more damage has to do with killing things better.

DERRRR, what was I thinking, eh? Imagine that, someone who is self-professed to not know the details of a class, going and thinking that doing more damage is a good thing when it comes to killing stuff.


I haven't already made up my mind, I just don't fall all over myself to let advice from others make up my mind for me, especially if it doesn't tell me WHY something is true rather just that it is.
  #7  
Old 02-09-2011, 11:04 AM
fischsemmel fischsemmel is offline
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I'll try to be more specific.

Quote:
Originally Posted by azeth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
1. "better skill caps" <- What does this have to do with anything? Doing damage in a SK or War / Sham duo has no baring on whether or not you win or lose.
Why is this the case?

Also, higher defense, parry, dodge, riposte, and disarm would help a warrior take less damage than a SK, right? Is this difference truly entirely insignificant?


Quote:
Originally Posted by azeth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
2. berserk? With a shaman healing you exclusively you had better hope you're not relying on running low HP.
Why?


Quote:
Originally Posted by azeth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Not to mention Shaman heals are incredibly inefficient except for Torpor which negates your damage dealing ability anyways.
Incredibly efficient compared to what? Complete heal? What ISN'T? Also, so what? Slow + chloro + less-than-efficient heals seems == to efficient heals without slow or chloro to me. Is it? Is it not?


Quote:
Originally Posted by azeth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
3. Disciplines - useful, but for warriors their pretty much designed for raid situations or at least not at all attune to duoing with a shaman.
Fair enough. I know disciplines tend to have pretty long CDs, also, so wasn't really thinking they'd be a staple of my play... more like oh-shit buttons, or something to assist in breaking a camp. Do they not work in these ways at least passably?


Quote:
Originally Posted by azeth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
4. More weapon choices - true, but again no baring on whether or not you can effectively duo with a shaman.
As with #1, why is more damage not a factor in the effectiveness of a SK/war+sham duo? Seems pretty darn unintuitive to me.


Quote:
Originally Posted by azeth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
5. Since when are SK life taps crappy?
I don't know, remember? We aren't in law school. Enough with the socratic method, eh? It makes sense for someone who doesn't know about SKs to assume that lifetaps a necro would have gotten 20 levels earlier, which are drawing on a smaller mana pool to replenish a larger HP pool that is being decreased more rapidly... are crappy.


Quote:
Originally Posted by azeth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Torpor + life tap on any non-Int caster type mob is a legit win button.
Explain it to me please. This whole...
1. Big healing
2. Little healing coupled with little damage
3. ???
4. THINGS DIE!!!

... thing doesn't really do it for me.


Quote:
Originally Posted by azeth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Also, I'm interested to know how you plan to break camps without Lull or FD? I suppose you could root, but doesn't sound very efficient.
I don't know, again. Seems like root + pet + slows + disc + blind would make for a decent way to break small camps to me. Would it not work?
Last edited by fischsemmel; 02-09-2011 at 11:06 AM..
  #8  
Old 02-09-2011, 11:07 AM
azeth azeth is offline
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All right man, good luck.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by michinz2 View Post
You can't deal with VPN on VM and i know it, you can denie it as you want and if you really belive in it, you have a dove-brain. if i would "boxing" i would do this and wouldn't wait so long for my petition to get ip approved, i know it work and i know some ppl using it, you are just denying it cause you have no argue about this only reiterate "against rules" like a "perfect soldier".

I release my hatred against this stupid thing
Baalette.
  #9  
Old 02-09-2011, 11:08 AM
fischsemmel fischsemmel is offline
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I'm not trying to be a dick, just like I said, I'm not the sort of person who just believes something because someone says it's true. And even if I were, I still like knowing the why and how of things.
  #10  
Old 02-09-2011, 11:08 AM
fischsemmel fischsemmel is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by azeth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
All right man, good luck.
Np. Sorry you couldn't help answer some questions before getting annoyed that I'm not a lemming. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
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