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  #21  
Old 09-23-2017, 04:35 PM
Lhancelot Lhancelot is offline
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Originally Posted by Mead [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Unfortunately, obtaining things like manastone, guise, and fungi staff has rarely been attainable for the casual player. That's part of what makes this game the way it is. Be prepared for that to not change.
Yep.
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  #22  
Old 09-23-2017, 04:52 PM
loramin loramin is offline
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Originally Posted by Mead [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Unfortunately, obtaining things like manastone, guise, and fungi staff has rarely been attainable for the casual player. That's part of what makes this game the way it is. Be prepared for that to not change.
I guess it depends on when you're talking about and what you mean by casual. Arguably everyone in classic was "casual": nobody was pooping in socks in '99. Also no one knew these items would get nerfed ... but that cat's out of the bag now, and there's no way to put it back in.

Still even with everyone knowing about these items now, there's a big difference between "you literally cannot get this item unless (maybe) you log in at 4AM several nights in a row" vs. "it will take you hours and hours of waiting in line to even get the camp, and then you've got the RNG to deal with once you do". Even the latter will prevent 90% of the player base from ever getting such an item, but when someone locks the camp down it means 99.9% of the server won't get to camp the item. I don't believe that is in any way classic or an unavoidable part of the game.

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Originally Posted by Mead [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
One of the biggest issues with this type of rule implementation is the stress placed on the GMs. They're already stretched thin with the raid scene and the million rules that require a p99 licensed attorney. The last thing you want to do is add more rules to this place when they're having a hard enough time enforcing or probably even understanding the current rules themselves.
Amen. As I said, even if lockdowns would have been prevented on live (and again, read that GM manual and I think you'll agree they probably would have), we're not on live and we don't have a paid GM staff. So if we're going to prevent lockdowns here it has to work for the staff.

So far the simplest, least staff effort idea that I've heard amounts to "new rule: you can only pass a camp off to the next person who has been waiting in line, in zone." Staff already have to deal with fights over camps today, and I would imagine they have a way to find out how long someone has been in a zone, so I don't think this rule would add a huge amount of work for them, Maybe when it first gets added, but pretty soon everyone would learn that if you don't pass the camp properly you get petitioned, and once people learn that I think the staff would have no more fights over camps than they already do.
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  #23  
Old 09-23-2017, 08:23 PM
Maner Maner is offline
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Even the elder bead line wasn't something the guides enforced and it was ignored multiple times by people locking the camp down within their own guilds.
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  #24  
Old 09-23-2017, 08:25 PM
Swish Swish is offline
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Originally Posted by Maner [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Even the elder bead line wasn't something the guides enforced and it was ignored multiple times by people locking the camp down within their own guilds.
That queue lol, reminds me of this >> [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
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  #25  
Old 09-23-2017, 08:28 PM
Maner Maner is offline
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Originally Posted by Swish [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
That queue lol, reminds me of this >> [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
i remember getting on the list friday night and having my turn come up on monday
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  #26  
Old 09-23-2017, 08:37 PM
Swish Swish is offline
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Originally Posted by Maner [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
i remember getting on the list friday night and having my turn come up on monday
[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Won't be any different if a new server hits. More people will be playing, I bet a bunch quit their jobs (or go sick) to get in on that manastone action :/
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  #27  
Old 09-24-2017, 12:51 AM
Kesselring Kesselring is offline
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Originally Posted by Mead [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
If anything you're realistic.







One of the biggest issues with this type of rule implementation is the stress placed on the GMs. They're already stretched thin with the raid scene and the million rules that require a p99 licensed attorney. The last thing you want to do is add more rules to this place when they're having a hard enough time enforcing or probably even understanding the current rules themselves.

Unfortunately, obtaining things like manastone, guise, and fungi staff has rarely been attainable for the casual player. That's part of what makes this game the way it is. Be prepared for that to not change.
There's no 'rule' that says you can pass the camp to whomever you want either. The rules state if someone else is trying to camp what you're camping or if you camping multiple things you have to compromise. So if you wait in line thats technically a player trying to get in on that camp and it has to be honored if theyve been waiting. Nothing in the rules say "you can pass camps to whoever you want". It should be a no brainer and theres no reason that GM's should have to be involved in on it as long as you act like a decent human being.
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  #28  
Old 09-24-2017, 12:58 AM
Kesselring Kesselring is offline
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Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
I guess it depends on when you're talking about and what you mean by casual. Arguably everyone in classic was "casual": nobody was pooping in socks in '99. Also no one knew these items would get nerfed ... but that cat's out of the bag now, and there's no way to put it back in.

Still even with everyone knowing about these items now, there's a big difference between "you literally cannot get this item unless (maybe) you log in at 4AM several nights in a row" vs. "it will take you hours and hours of waiting in line to even get the camp, and then you've got the RNG to deal with once you do". Even the latter will prevent 90% of the player base from ever getting such an item, but when someone locks the camp down it means 99.9% of the server won't get to camp the item. I don't believe that is in any way classic or an unavoidable part of the game.



Amen. As I said, even if lockdowns would have been prevented on live (and again, read that GM manual and I think you'll agree they probably would have), we're not on live and we don't have a paid GM staff. So if we're going to prevent lockdowns here it has to work for the staff.

So far the simplest, least staff effort idea that I've heard amounts to "new rule: you can only pass a camp off to the next person who has been waiting in line, in zone." Staff already have to deal with fights over camps today, and I would imagine they have a way to find out how long someone has been in a zone, so I don't think this rule would add a huge amount of work for them, Maybe when it first gets added, but pretty soon everyone would learn that if you don't pass the camp properly you get petitioned, and once people learn that I think the staff would have no more fights over camps than they already do.
Exactly that, GM's can see how long someone has been in zone. It's pretty easy to wait in line and pretty simple rule to follow. It's even more hardcore playstyle to physically wait in line for a camp. Nowhere would the rules imply passing a camp off to a friend is how it works. In fact I've been on frenzy in velks multiple times where this is exactly the case. Someone waits at the camp wanting to get it next, someone else tries to tell their friend to come take it from them and the ive seen the guy waiting in line win the GM's favor in a petition (at least so they told me, which i can't exactly confirm, but it makes sense).
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  #29  
Old 09-24-2017, 08:56 AM
jpetrick jpetrick is offline
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Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
I never even heard of such a thing on live during Velious (or even for awhile after). Plus, I feel like (based on everything else they did) GMs on live would have gotten involved if someone was preventing everyone else on a server from accessing (non-raid) content for weeks or months at a time.
There was a plat farmer on Tallon Zek that had Lodi on lock. If you wanted to finish your eyepatch you had to buy it from him. It was this dude's job so literally no one else got it.

GMs finally stopped him when whatever expansion after PoP came out.

Shit's classic. Lame. But classic.
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  #30  
Old 09-24-2017, 09:21 AM
gizmo gizmo is offline
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Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
None, that I'm aware of. The concern is more about when Green comes out someday
It's classic but if y'all are still playing when Green finally comes out then you got bigger concerns
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