#21
|
||||
|
Quote:
Torpor: 200 mana for 1500 HP Cann IV: 148 HP for 82 mana Iksar/Troll Sitting Regen Diff vs. Barbs/Ogres: 12 HP The regen diff is literally a small fraction of both what Cannibalize consumes, or what Torpor replenishes. Oh, and you're also correct about the sitting thing. The live advice for Shaman was to "Cann-dance", and that did involve lots of sitting, but Shaman here understand the mechanics of clickies refreshing spells (eg. Shrunken Goblin Skull Earring), and they've realized that it's faster to just spam Cannibalize while standing than to bother with the dance. I used the sitting numbers for two reasons. One, lower-level Shaman do sit a lot (whether or not they Cann-dance), and this discussion was very much about not just level 60, but the path to 60. Also, I was trying to make a point (that the regen wasn't a big deal), and I didn't want to "cheat" to make that point by using the less impressive standing regen numbers.
__________________
Loramin Frostseer, Oracle of the Tribunal <Anonymous> and Fan of the "Where To Go For XP/For Treasure?" Guides Anyone can improve the wiki! If you are new to the Blue server, you can improve the wiki to earn a "welcome package" of up to 2k+ platinum! Message me for details. | |||
Last edited by loramin; 01-22-2019 at 08:40 PM..
|
|
#22
|
|||
|
The road to 60 is long and the price of torpor is steep.
I spent about 60-70x longer NOT at 60 than I have at 60 on my shaman. Prior to 60 and torpor racial regen is clutch.
__________________
| ||
|
#23
|
|||
|
I had fun playing a barbarian shaman to 57.
Now I am playing a troll shaman and hit 50 today. I am having even more fun this time around. 1. Evil races get the best Antonica dungeons nearby. I levelled to 48 in Upper Guk, Najena, Sol A and Sol B, almost exclusively (except see #3) - I prefer dungeons, and they are close to Grobb/Neriak so I could spend less time traveling to and from vendors/bank/playground and more time having fun. 2. Snare necklace. Got it at 19 by using a higher character to kill the Steamfont mob. Snare has been fantastic for the past 30 levels. Right now I am leveling in a spot which was good for the barb, but somewhat annoying when the mobs start deathmarch mode - to the point where I would sometimes have to gate out from adds if root resisted. With snare, it's a night and day comparison in terms of efficiency, safety, and enjoyment. 3. I took 4 levels out in Overthere L37-41 and got myself the Hammer whilst xp-ing and saving myself a future 2k. OK for some folks that's pocket change, but the point being an evil can do this quest legit, I believe a barb has to pay for MQ. Versus ogre: Never once on either character have I noticed stuns being a big deal, in fact I barely notice them at all, and I tank everything I kill solo. I get the big timpani crash and duration stun maybe one fight in 10. Then I recast whatever spell and get on with it. I guess if it matters at all it might be at L60, but I can't speak to that. | ||
|
#24
|
|||
|
Troll shaman = regen, slam, exceptional base physical stats, snare necklace, repeatable Halfling illusion for quest faction hacks, an amazing smile and a scratchy butt. It blows my mind that people overlook the fact that the Halfling illusion item is repeatable.
| ||
|
#25
|
|||||||
|
Quote:
Quote:
Ultimately I think you'll push 1-54 much faster then the other races. 54-59 might be a toss up - but you got there faster anyway. 60 all the leveling advantages don't matter anymore. As 60 barbarian shaman, I sometimes wonder if I had the regen advantage. Sometimes I wear fungi, and while it helps, it doesn't change what happens a ton. It's a small edge. Racial is the same, just even smaller. Quote:
Quote:
It's been hashed to death, but if you want to fill your face with a bunch of ranty math: TLDR; Mid 50s or above Troll/Iksar Shamans gain the equivalent HP value of somewhere around 1.8 mana/tick to 4.4 mana/tick over Barbarian/Ogre shamans. This value is based on standing regen figures, and improves in the favor of Iksars and Trolls even more when sitting. Sitting or standing, this decently powerful advantage is severely eclipsed by Torpor at 60. | ||||||
|
#26
|
|||
|
Ogre stun immune is hugely overrated.
Iksar is HAWT! Troll snare neck is super nice. Barbarians are aids race. The only true reason to pick one race over another is fashion. Just say you picked barbarian for polar bear hat and illusion and we can move on and not laugh at you. These silly stretch reasons like faction and xp penalty are sad. Every race can fix faction super easily, and can bank in any city even without fixing faction. My shaman is Iksar for sweet robe graphic and racial superiority. Have access to friends Ogre and another friends Troll. No reason to ever play the Ogre, the Troll is nice because of snare necklace. | ||
|
#27
|
|||
|
Play what you want to look at the most. If you like all equally, troll is the best shaman. Regen, snare neck, and jbb. FSI on ogre overrated. By the time you hit 60 and get torpor and don’t want to make a new alt? Still would take Regen over FSI.
| ||
|
#28
|
||||||
|
Quote:
Think of it this way: how many Torpor Shaman do you see wearing fungis? Not many, and if you asked I'd guess most are still wearing them from their pre-Torpor days and just haven't gotten anything better yet. A fungi adds more regen than Iksar/Troll racial adds, and yet the vast majority of Torpor Shaman I know don't wear one because the regen is less useful to them than some stats or a clickie (eg. the one from the Velious Armor chest piece). But in contrast if you're soloing a Western Wastes dragon, or a named in the Crypt in Seb, or any other hard mob, reducing the chance of being stunned does matter. Even if it doesn't reduce that chance by that much (there's still other ways Ogres can be stunned), stuns are scary. When Torpor Shaman solo they need to keep re-casting Torpor periodically or they die, and a single stun can be all it takes to turn a successful solo for some phat lewtz into a long annoying corpse run. And I say all this as a Barbarian Shaman with zero skin in the game (of Iksar/Troll vs. Ogre). Quote:
Quote:
This is why spamming Cann with a Shrunken Goblin Skull Earring (or similar clickie) is so much better than Cann-dancing for a Torpor Shaman (and arguably even before). Dancing is more efficient, but spamming gets you more mana to win the fight when you need it. To put it another way, in a fight speed matters and efficiency doesn't, and after a fight when you have infinite time it really doesn't matter if you spam, cann-dance, or just sit on your ass and meditate [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
__________________
Loramin Frostseer, Oracle of the Tribunal <Anonymous> and Fan of the "Where To Go For XP/For Treasure?" Guides Anyone can improve the wiki! If you are new to the Blue server, you can improve the wiki to earn a "welcome package" of up to 2k+ platinum! Message me for details. | |||||
|
#29
|
||||
|
Quote:
I really just wanted to to get a sense of the importance of racial regen relative to a fungi tunic for a shaman. In hindsight, this is easily obtainable information on the wiki (+15 for fungi vs the standing/sitting regen table on the shaman page), but this has been a fun, informative thread regardless. I did enjoy how one person listed all the pros for troll shamans and included their goofy smiles and butt scratching, when those are the two biggest cons I can think of (along with the way they run). Just so cartoonish... To each their own! | |||
|
#30
|
|||
|
If a shaman had a fungi, they’d wear it.
They all have regen spells and only the worst of them don’t keep it up constantly (caveat being the 60 shaman who has torpor and isn’t super worried about min/maxing.) Regeneration is clutch to the shaman classes. We all know and acknowledge this but the discussion always breaks down with people doing mental gymnastics trying to rationalize racial regen not being important. 1-50 troll/iksar regen is double. After 51 it takes off exponentially. Make no mistake, it’s a big deal. Twinking out with a fungi mitigates this difference but does not eliminate it. Fungi or no fungi racial regen stacks and this still has value. For those who only care about performance at 60 with torpor or for those who’ve had torpor for longer than they can remember just know that lv 1-59.99 takes a long time. Balancing mana and regen while being expected to drop expensive slow bombs pull after pull all while buffing and healing is an art. Racial regen makes this job so much easier especially for those not supertwinking at a low level. At the end of the day the most important thing is liking how you look. There are other reasons to pick other races (faction, leveling speed, FSI). They’re all right reasons. That’s cool and all, but don’t be obtuse and try to strip away the logical value of racial regen with mental gymnastics. If regen wasn’t important, you wouldn’t fork over huge cash for a fungi and you wouldn’t obsessively refresh your regen buff every time it fell. EQ is a game of small but mounting incremental gains. Racial regen isn’t a small gain.
__________________
| ||
|
|
|