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Old 05-28-2020, 01:48 PM
Jimjam Jimjam is online now
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Default Disease dots should prevent mob regen

I found a few classic posts indicating that disease dots should neuter mob regen:


https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/...m9820935161310, https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/...00100892751713, https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/...#m999815671652 and https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/...99253902825801

The gist is Cazel had crazy regen unless a disease dot was put on him, in which case he became much more easy to deal with.

It is my recollection that DoTs also blocked (but didn't overwrite the buffs) regen - surely everyone remembers the frustration that was Rabies?


Currently you can't block mob regen using disease dots on blue (tested in Kael where the frosty berserkers regen 2% hp per tick, which was not blocked by disease cloud).


This seems a good starting point to accrue evidence for and against disease dots preventing regen for players and NPCs.
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Old 05-28-2020, 02:09 PM
DMN DMN is offline
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My SK on RZ had disease cloud permanently on him. And I'm quite sure it never blocked my trolls regen.

This sounds like it comes from the newb era of EQ where people believed they would stop regenerating health when they caught rabies.

Also since we know rabies in the orginal spdat did 1 point of damage, if it also blocked regen a lot of newbs would have been slowly dying from it when they got it. Instead of running around for an hour complaining about not regening HP, it would have been a death sentence they'd be frantically asking people for heals.
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Old 05-28-2020, 04:09 PM
Sunderfury Sunderfury is offline
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Interesting. Some further discussion is here. Dated May 2001.

I tried to organize the conversation, but it certainly seemed to affect mobs. PCs is up for debate, but it seems it at least could stop natural regen when standing, mentions of sitting working to regen HP (+bonus applied?). Buffs seem like they would still work, no clue about worn regen like Fungi (again not certain yet if PCs would be affected).

Quote:
The Disease based spells stop HP regen on the mobs you cast it on. If
you have a mob with fast regen, a disease spell will stop it cold
making it much easier to kill.

Whether or not it is worth it to cast these spells depends on the
situation.
Quote:
Try fighting in Cazic against those damn lizards, they regen like mad. Use
the disease spells to stop that and you now have manageable MOBs.
Quote:
I am not an expert on the disease based spells. I was merely pointing
out that one of the perks of these spells is that they stop the
natural regen on mobs.
Quote:
And as said before, disease spells aren't always resisted by some things
that resist everything else...
And as said before, it stops/slows critter regeneration...
And as a melee type- it makes a good taunt!
Quote:
Has anyone ever tested the 'stops target's regen' effect and been able
to prove that it works?
Quote:
Well, disease dots won't cancel regeneration, chloroplast or regrowth,
or any of the bard's healing songs... So I don't think they really
prevent regeneration, just counteract it somewhat
Quote:
No it counteracts natural regen, not those found from buffs--those you
don't use disease dots to neutralize, you use recant magic. :-)
Quote:
I was fooling around with a barb shaman last night (levelled to 5 very
quickly BTW). If I casr Sicken on myself I am hit for something like
5pts of damage. In addition my HP counter turns red and my natural
base regen does not increase my HP as long as the spell is in effect
and I am standing. Very similar to having Rabies.
Quote:
All that means is that the DoT was doing enough damage to keep up with
your natural healing.
Quote:
Go fight Cazel with a single group. First without a Disease DoT, then, after
CR, try it _with_ one [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Quote:
Counteracting regen is about the only use our necro/shamans have for
their disease dots. Against VP dragons with their retarded regen
rate, it's almost a requirement unless you bring along a LOT more
firepower.
Quote:
Ever been infected with rabies while hunting "rabid" wolves/bears?
Notice your natural hitpoint regen is completely gone during the time
you have rabies.

Rabies is a disease dot.
Quote:
Not exactly true.

Rabies is a 1 point per tick DoT. Your natural regeneration is 1 hit point
per tick, so you are getting no hit points back.

If you sit down so that your natural regeneration pops up to 2 per tick, you
get 1 hp back on each tick while infected with Rabies.

(Not challenging whether it works on mobs or not, it just doesn't apply to
players as in your example.)
Quote:
No you misunderstand. When DoTed you usually still regain HP at your normal regen rate. With a Disease DoT you don't, and you _also_ take the per-tick
damage from the disease DoT.
Quote:
Things sometimes work differently on PCs than on NPCs. I have the
feeling that this is one of them. My Iksar Necro cast Scourge on
himself to test it, and then sat down. He was still regaining
hitpoints due to his regeneration - just not very many per tick...
Quote:
If you really need convincing, use the lowest level dot against Cazel
(named sand giant in Oasis). He has an extremely high regen rate--far
in excess of any low level disease dot.

Before the disease dot, he's almost impossible to kill with a single
group. With the disease dot, he's a total push over.
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Old 05-28-2020, 04:18 PM
Sunderfury Sunderfury is offline
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July 1999 post, kind of sketchy but makes mention that disease dots were originally meant to only stop the healing process.

Quote:
I can only attest to one of the changes to the poison/disease DOT spells
(since my shaman is currently only level 8), but the good news is the one
change I can report is a nice one for low level shamans.
Sicken now actually does damage to your enemies instead of simply halting
the healing process (which I actually think did more harm than good when
dealing with runners). For my shaman it did an initial 8 damage and then 1
damage per tick up to a total of 31 points of damage. I was able to kill
polar bear cubs with two casts of the spell without using any additional
casts
June 1999 post of disease stopping mob regen
Quote:
Disease Cloud, besides doing 5 pts of damage per cast, diseases your
enemy and prevents it from healing normally.
Quote:
Disease Cloud does 5 damage and
also diseases the monster, meaning they don't regen hp during the battle.
Quote:
I think the real power of disease cloud is that it stops a mob from healing
itself. True, the 5 points of damage is almost nothing, but a high-level mob
can regenerate many times that number during the course of the fight. And it
only costs a measly 5 (or 10, I can't remember) mana.
November 1999 post
Quote:
When there's no druid around to help me out, I pull with sicken to
kill regen and do maybe 30 damage
, hit it with tainted breath before
it gets to me, melee, one more tainted breath when the first runs
out, melee, and it dies. This works up to yellow crocs no sweat. Reds
I can kite down to 66% HP then fight, but they're more trouble than
they're worth.
Quote:
Damn that seems such a long time ago but at level 16 I spent most of the
level in Oasis (seemed like the thing to do) and I used to DD crocs. could
take all of them except the Deepwater Crocs. Deepwater Caimans I'd
sometimes need to zone so I avoided.

Pretty inefficient but it was another 3 levels before anyone told me about
DoT spells...
April 2001 post, seems to mention high level and low level dot can both negate mob regen.
Quote:
Best Advice I can give...which works for me is the Root/dot/dot method.
Start with root. Head back to maximun range and cast your disease dot.
THAT stops them from healing back some of the damage over time
. Careful
though, because at higher lvls your DOT tends to break Root on contact.
Which is why you head to the maximum range to cast. If Root breaks you
should be able to recast before getting hit. If not, take the hit and get
the spell off. Go ahead and med while Root/DoTs are in effect. Remeber to
Have regen going on you at all times...and Canni to keep a ready supply of
mana. Always try to sit far enough away that when root breaks you have time
to stand and cast it again before getting hit. If you run low on
Mana...just keep rooting the MoB and med up. If need be...mem a lower lvl
disease buff to keep the mob from healing.
Last edited by Sunderfury; 05-28-2020 at 04:41 PM..
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  #5  
Old 05-28-2020, 04:22 PM
Dolalin Dolalin is offline
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In June/July 1999 the disease DoTs all had their damage increased but their duration reduced. Check the patch messages around that time on the wiki patch notes page, I found them a little while back.

That is probably what the above poster is referring to.
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  #6  
Old 05-28-2020, 04:29 PM
loramin loramin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dolalin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
In June/July 1999 the disease DoTs all had their damage increased but their duration reduced. Check the patch messages around that time on the wiki patch notes page, I found them a little while back.

That is probably what the above poster is referring to.
https://wiki.project1999.com/Patch_N...une_27.2C_1999
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  #7  
Old 05-28-2020, 04:52 PM
Nycon43 Nycon43 is offline
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I do remember the no regen thing from back in the day. I assumed that's how it was on P99 heh.
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