Discussion: PvP Deaths (Item/Coin/XP Loot/Gain)

[SaveTheSack]

I'd rather item loot over experience loss. There's nothing worse than losing experience -- it just makes you feel like you've wasted your time. I already feel like I'm wasting time by playing EverQuest (kidding.. sorta), why magnify that feeling?

I mean, I suppose the same goes with item loot.. losing a piece of gear you've spent forever getting. But at the very least it makes PvP more interesting! Losing exp doesn't do anything for the PK'er other than that weird sense of satisfaction you get from griefing someone.

I'll play regardless, but I see myself avoiding player-confrontation at all costs (or just significantly more than I would otherwise) if several hours of exp is lost upon death.

Another thing to consider: if someone takes your item there's a bit of hope that maybe one day you'll find the bastard who killed you and you'll be able to take revenge and, in turn, take one of their prized items. Having the one who killed you lose experience doesn't seem nearly as rewarding or interesting.

For the record, I'm pro item/bag loot.

[SaveTheSack]

Also, why hasn't there been a poll for this?

A. Item Loot
B. No Item Loot

[Billbike]

Originally Posted by SaveTheSack [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Also, why hasn't there been a poll for this?

A. Item Loot
B. No Item Loot

There was, but the majority opinion is irrelevant. There will be some form of itemloot.

[Nirgon]

Hopefully worn/droppable only non weapon slot.

[jilena]

Teams = meh

Item Loot (without exp loss) = encourage naked players ganking geared players with no fear of loss themselves. Removing the risk and only allowing for reward. I think this is fail and should never be implemented.

Item Loot (with exp loss) = Provides more of a deterent for naked ganking of other players. I am okay with item loot only in this situation, though overall I am still indifferent to this feature as I don't really think it adds anything *THAT* exciting to gameplay.

Exp Loss = Best PvP penalty for Everquest. It effects all people in all states of clothing and in whatever situation equally. Does it make it easier to drive sissies to QQ when they get bind camped? Yep. But those same sissies are going to QQ when they get bind camped regardless.

Coin Loss = Who cares. It makes it annoying to have to go bank your coin every time you decide to move around but really has minimal effect on game play outside of the occasionally funny loading up your 200+ str ogre with copper so when some wizzie loots you they are unable to move.

Exp Gain = I am indifferent on this. I don't think anyone playing on a PvP server needs a reward or encouragement to kill people. People will kill each other because that's why most of them play there. *shrug*

[Bockscar]

Originally Posted by SaveTheSack [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Also, why hasn't there been a poll for this?

A. Item Loot
B. No Item Loot

There were a few, all pointed towards no item loot.

[Rust1d?]

Item loot has always been a killer of servers. People will play Red99 anyway. You will always have people not play/quit because of item loot. I would rather not have item loot and have a more robust population. Here are my suggestion:

- Coin loot only OR coin loot plus ring/earring loot
- Rez effects on death sans movement resrictions
- Small exp hit. Something that could be made up in 3-5 kills.

People will just remove their MVI (most valuable item) before they die anyway. I always took off my robe or armor if I knew I was gonna die.

[Runningfish]

Originally Posted by Rogean [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

We are leaning towards a server with no item or coin loot, however there will be an XP Loss on PvP Deaths. We are open to discussion on this.

I think people will be hiding from PvP rather than actively seeking it out due to these rules. Item loot if implemented well would be fine with me. Or coin loot helps add some extra incentive to PvP. Why would I take a risk killing someone when there is literally no reward and a good chance I will die and lose my hard earned exp. Not only losing exp from that death but putting myself into a potentially bad position to get killed again while on the CR.

To me you can't have just one of these things without the other. Not having exp loss from pvp is probably exploitable. So to have PvP exp loss in you have to also have a reward system in to make it worth the trouble of constantly losing exp from PvP'ing. I've seen other threads mention a token system, sounds reasonable but also like a lot more work. The problem with PvP exp gain is the amount of players a person actually kills is very small compared to grinding mobs. So the amount of exp gained when killing a player would have to be much greater to make it worth the risk of death. This then becomes exploitable unless preventative measures are put in.

Cash loot adds a level of danger without being too ridiculous. It also serves as at least some incentive to kill someone aside from the fun.

[vinx]

Originally Posted by Xareth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Good point. What if item loot didn't start until lvl 20 / 30 / something? Coin loot at whatever level pvp would start until then.

If full blown item loot will drop the population there are a lot of alternatives. Like I said in another post, item loot could be random, or could use a point system or both.

Or (whatever form of) item loot only in high end zones, pretty much the same zones that would have no lvl range for pvp.

Lots and lots of options.

I would think the opposite of this scenerio would benefit eg, unlootable at 46+

That way lowbie twinks have a reason to be weary about rushing a group for fear of losing a precious item.
and give the poor a chance at awesome gear
46+ is planar level and if you havent got at least a few no-drop items already you will get some soon = unlootable

Sure, all the high end items are worn here..good loots from a item loot standpoint
but loss of those high end items, are what would grief a few off server as they /ragequit
If your twinkin your alt, you prolly have cash or a means of recovering said items

[jilena]

Originally Posted by Runningfish [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I think people will be hiding from PvP rather than actively seeking it out due to these rules. Item loot if implemented well would be fine with me. Or coin loot helps add some extra incentive to PvP. Why would I take a risk killing someone when there is literally no reward and a good chance I will die and lose my hard earned exp. Not only losing exp from that death but putting myself into a potentially bad position to get killed again while on the CR.

To me you can't have just one of these things without the other. Not having exp loss from pvp is probably exploitable. So to have PvP exp loss in you have to also have a reward system in to make it worth the trouble of constantly losing exp from PvP'ing. I've seen other threads mention a token system, sounds reasonable but also like a lot more work. The problem with PvP exp gain is the amount of players a person actually kills is very small compared to grinding mobs. So the amount of exp gained when killing a player would have to be much greater to make it worth the risk of death. This then becomes exploitable unless preventative measures are put in.

Cash loot adds a level of danger without being too ridiculous. It also serves as at least some incentive to kill someone aside from the fun.

You do have reward already. You PvP for resources in the game or for the fun of killing. Resources being control of exp spots/dungeons/spawns/targets/quest items/whatever. Fun is obviously fun.

As items and exp are pretty much all the rewards there are in Everquest, you have the best incentive ever to fight over them. *shrug*