Game Mechanics: Nihilist Zeegarn / Nihilist Yeegarn incorrect item drop table

[Agatha]

thank you for everyone trying to get this worked out, i admit this is way beyond my scope.

[oricalum]

Originally Posted by Agatha [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

thank you for everyone trying to get this worked out, i admit this is way beyond my scope.

Breathing alone is almost beyond your scope, thank the gods you figured it out though.

[pasi]

Ok, so I did a guru search on the idfile of the weapon. Basically, this will return any item that shares the same graphics.

Search Results of Items with Similar Graphics

The only items that would have this graphic in Kunark were the Rod of Battle and the Nihilist Battlestaff. So, it's definitely one of those two items.

However, I would like to re-visit Nihilist Battle Staff. The item IDs that you originally posted were Allakhazam's IDs. Allakhazam assigns IDs based on when they get added to Allakhazam. A better indicator of when an item was added to the game would be the actual in-game ID which you can find on Lucy. For the Nihilist Battlestaff, that ID would be 12842.

http://lucy.allakhazam.com/item.html?id=12842

The IDs of 12840 to 12842 puts these items in the time-line of added at launch with Kunark. You can look at items with similar numbers Here

Item IDs are not fullproof as occasionally an item ID will get modified instead of creating a new ID such as in the case of these bad boys. Overall though, it's a pretty accurate way of assessing when an item was added to the game (different from it being acquired).

My opinion of this (for what it's worth) is that it seems to be the case that these Nihilists should be dropping their Nihilist gear at this stage.

[tristantio]

Well, I hope they do without being made too strong, as I want the robe

[nilbog]

Originally Posted by pasi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ok, so I did a guru search on the idfile of the weapon. Basically, this will return any item that shares the same graphics.

Search Results of Items with Similar Graphics

The only items that would have this graphic in Kunark were the Rod of Battle and the Nihilist Battlestaff. So, it's definitely one of those two items.

However, I would like to re-visit Nihilist Battle Staff. The item IDs that you originally posted were Allakhazam's IDs. Allakhazam assigns IDs based on when they get added to Allakhazam. A better indicator of when an item was added to the game would be the actual in-game ID which you can find on Lucy. For the Nihilist Battlestaff, that ID would be 12842.

http://lucy.allakhazam.com/item.html?id=12842

The IDs of 12840 to 12842 puts these items in the time-line of added at launch with Kunark. You can look at items with similar numbers Here

Item IDs are not fullproof as occasionally an item ID will get modified instead of creating a new ID such as in the case of these bad boys. Overall though, it's a pretty accurate way of assessing when an item was added to the game (different from it being acquired).

My opinion of this (for what it's worth) is that it seems to be the case that these Nihilists should be dropping their Nihilist gear at this stage.

Initially I thought that was gonna be the quick and easy fix. My first thought was.. similar to yours, see what other items use the same graphic.

select id,name from items where idfile = 'IT111'

3677 Lady Zavo's Toothpick
6657 Rod of Battle
27927 Rubicite Staff
31797 A Sambata Tribal Club
32332 Goranga Tribal Club
83914 Lake Tamer Staff
89010 Studded Bashing Staff

Then I found the battlestaff didn't exist in the database. That is usually indicative of non classic. I did find a classic shot of the Nihilist npc with a staff with that graphic. (Either a classic shot, or a shot from a client using the old npc font in, at least.)

I am setting the Rod of Battle drop from Nihilists to 0, until this is completely figured out.

[pasi]

It's interesting that your database doesn't return Tnor'tesphi (an artifact) on the search since that should have been in the game before the Sambata and Goranga clubs.

Lucy usually requires an item to be seen in game by someone running the item collector. However, there's also a lot of stuff that was never acquirable in game up on Lucy. I don't know if your database would have require it to hit with item collector first (before it got uploaded a couple years ago).

The argument for Nihilist Battlestaff:
1) The NPC currently drops the staff, the robe, and the helmet, all of which she is showing graphically in screenshots.
2) The Battlestaff, Robe, and Helmet all have item IDs surrounded by other Kunark-launch items.
3) The fact that the item IDs are all consecutive (12840, 12841, 12842) even further supports that these items were ADDED with Kunark as opposed to developers adding new items by MODIFYING old item IDs. I posted the Askr's Gauntlets example where a PoP item has a Kunark ID. When this happens, it's usually a single point mutation. The other Askr's items all have PoP item IDs.

The argument in favor of Rod of Battle:
1) The database did not have Nihilist Battlestaff until way later.
2) The only other item with that graphic is Rod of Battle

There's really no satisfying answer here.

For me, the most convincing argument is the consecutive item IDs between other Kunark items. Although, you wouldn't be wrong by going in either direction.

[Man0warr]

Even if not classic, adding in ~80k plat per day to the economy sounds damaging - this is way better raw plat generation than say Seafuries.

Should be removed for that alone, and is probably the reason it was changed on Live as well.

I never saw people farming them on Blue when going through Cabilis until recently (been someone there for last 3-4 weeks), so I'm guessing they saw someone on Red doing it where apparently it's been happening for months and months.

[pasi]

Originally Posted by Man0warr [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Should be removed for that alone, and is probably the reason it was changed on Live as well.

Just to avoid confusion here: There is no hard evidence showing that the Nihilists ever dropped the Rod of Battle on EQlive. You're not only making that claim, but also making the claim that it was probably changed due to abuse on EQlive. If we knew the first part of that equation, this thread wouldn't be on the bugs forum. If it was abused on live to the point of change, we would hopefully have anything (other than the graphic) to link the Rod of Battle to the Nihilists.

Anyhow, I will say that I do like the idea of giving some use to cities. I always liked that people exp'd in Oggok, fear kited in Freeport, grouped the instant spawn guard in Freeport, and even did 50-60 in Neriak and Felwithe.

While the plat generated is likely too high, the camp would still be useful with say ~10 minute respawns and a 50% droprate. It would still be about 1k/hour of pure plat and doable while semi-AFK.

Unfortunately, I don't think they ever did drop the Rod.

[tristantio]

I may have started the farm trend on blue as I did kill a few after making this thread, and I'm sure some people saw me or saw the rods on the vendor 1 building over, but I never saw them farming on red, I wanted the no drop robe shd usable since it saw it on alla (i tried killing them a year or so ago and got beat down at low 50s).

If this was a secret farm on red for guilds it was pure coincidence (and i suppose bad luck for them that I found on blue)

[tristantio]

Although even if it added 1 million plat a day should be irrelevant in the pursuit of classic (if we could show it was)