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#71
12-05-2014, 07:18 PM
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[Grandmaster] Rawrartiz
[Defiler] Boweevil [Wanderer] Samwise Originally - Reiguy of Fennin Ro Tyvix Rex of Sullon Zek. | |||
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#72
12-05-2014, 10:58 PM
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It makes me feel warm that the community is starting to acknowledge that EQ is a very easy game that happens to be very punishing if you are bad at the game. Once you reach a basic level of competency, it stops being punishing.
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#74
12-05-2014, 11:20 PM
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#75
12-06-2014, 12:18 AM
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Would be an interesting experiment to transplant a WoW raid guild into P99 class C raiding. See if they can even pull a dragon to the entrance of VP. And that's the classic era, not even considering raids like The Rathe Council, PoTime Innoruuk, Quarm, etc. I haven't played a lot of WoW but I played enough to get a gist of their design philosophy and I'd be very willing to bet there's nothing that matches the difficulty of those raids + a bunch of others in EQ.
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#76
12-06-2014, 06:06 AM
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I hate when people try to turn a subjective statement into an objective one. What defines "difficult" to one person could be different to another.
EQ Raids EQ raids are more tedious and less forgiving than WoW raids. If you screw up, you're going to spend the next hour or more organizing and recovering, and everyone that dies loses experience permanently that must be regained. It's very accurate to say that the price of failure in an EQ raid is far, far greater. Worse still, if a raid does call for a specific tactic, such as a CH rotation, mob positioning, or specific resist gear, one mistake can end up blowing the entire raid for the rest of the night, because the recovery time may disqualify members that only had a limited amount of time to raid in. The flip side to this is that, for the most part, the class dynamics don't change much in a raid, and with a few exceptions like fear/AE and on later raids like the PoP ones, the same "pull, tank, heal" philosophy applies to every single raid. It's rare for raids to have any special or unusual mechanic like running around to pull switches, alternating between the groups inflicting damage, or such things. Typically, once your raid force knows what they're doing, classic EQ raids are mostly the same, and the only things that change are the preparation pulls and the timing. An EQ raid is basically a carefully laid-out plan that you lay out, communicate, and then watch as it's executed. If it goes off the rails, the raid can easily crash and destroy hours of preparation and cost hours more in recovery. WoW Raids WoW raids have an entirely different dynamic that is focused far more on active, careful control and constantly focusing on the action every second, but a lot of that comes from the game's mechanics themselves. Playing a healer in WoW isn't as simple as watching bars and playing whack-a-mole, because in order to get maximum effectiveness out of it, you have to set up combos and spell rotations, and that's true of every single class in the game, so timing and individual skill play into it a lot more, in contrast to EQ classes where most of them have a very basic, layered stacking mechanic for spells. Another aspect of WoW raids is that they're designed for a specific number of players. That's both good and bad. The good is that you know that your 20 or 40 man raid force will be able to complete the raid if your gear and tactics are sound. The bad is that you basically have to be properly geared and have sound tactics, because it's impossible to offset inferior equipment with greater numbers. The flip side for WoW is that there's really no penalty for failure. Wiping simply means reorganizing and charging in again. Your equipment might take damage, but by raiding level, the price of repairs is trivial. You're also limited as to who you can bring on a raid, so if your guild has 74 people, only 20 of those can do the 20-man raid, leaving 54 of them out on their asses. A WoW raid is an expedition where the players are kept constantly on their toes, highly focused on rotations and combinations, having to constantly adapt to changing conditions. IMHO It all depends on your play style. Both are hard, both are easy, depending on the individual. I find EQ raids easier to execute, but I also find they tend to take a lot longer to plan and prepare for, mostly because the cost of failure is so much higher. WoW raids, on the other hand, I find way easier to plan and prepare for, but execution is far more critical because the raids are set up and designed so that your raid force is supposed to be dancing on the edge of a blade, so one or two minor mistakes can cause a cascade failure, made worse by the fact that in WoW raids, the developers know exactly how many people you're bringing to the fight, and balance the difficulty accordingly. Ultimately, I totally agree that WoW raids seem more "difficult" during the actual battle since everyone is focusing on their DPS meters, and trying to optimize their carefully-balanced skill rotations, and watching for areas they have to dodge or avoid. It's a faster-paced fight. However, I think a lot of EQ players (including myself) feel that EQ raids are harder not because the actual fight is more difficult, or more critical of mistakes, but because the price of failure is so high. Just how high? Let's put it this way...my raiding guild on Luclin was shattered because of a single failed battle against the Rathe Council. One lost battle, and the hours it took us to prepare, was enough to fracture my entire guild to the point that it disbanded. I doubt that any WoW guilds have collapsed due to a single failed raid. | ||
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#77
12-06-2014, 07:10 AM
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^ has nothing to do what my statement
"wow raiding is takes alot more skill than eq" - SamwiseRed this is about skill. eq raiding, at least in trilogy, is no where close to anything i would remotely consider to be challenging. tedious != difficult or challenging.
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#78
12-06-2014, 07:11 AM
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*with my statement
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#79
12-06-2014, 10:29 AM
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Way to many people in thread trying hard to justify spending 10+ hours a day playing EQ or waking up at 5am for bat phones.
Also why are people using examples of broken and untuned encounters in EQ to make it seem like it was difficult? | ||
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#80
12-06-2014, 10:53 AM
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do trash mobs in WoW take skill, or time? they take time. hence, blizzard removed them because not everyone has 5 hours to clear NPCs that have tons of HP and pose no challenge. ps; trash is back in cata, mop, and warlords. dunno what game you were playing but soo and other zones had trash
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