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  #41  
Old 05-12-2022, 02:22 AM
Ennewi Ennewi is offline
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Originally Posted by Naethyn [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Wow is that true? Because weapon skill matters a ton for dps and it would explain why paladins consistently parse higher at bis. Is it true that paladins have more piercing skill than even warriors?
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  #42  
Old 05-12-2022, 02:23 AM
mattydef mattydef is offline
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The piercing skill is a bigger deal than it seems since that makes both Lance of Thunder (52/46) and Great Spear of Dawn (53/46) more viable for paladins, and those two are the most accessible high end 2 handed weapons for knights.
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  #43  
Old 05-12-2022, 02:35 AM
Ennewi Ennewi is offline
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Originally Posted by mattydef [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
The piercing skill is a bigger deal than it seems since that makes both Lance of Thunder (52/46) and Great Spear of Dawn (53/46) more viable for paladins, and those two are the most accessible high end 2 handed weapons for knights.
True and the added delay doesn't hurt either. Worth mentioning for sure, but still shouldn't have the expectation of being super high on the charts, especially when DPS are asking for spot heals versus damage shields and AEs.

Warriors max out at 240 piercing skill according to the wiki. If correct, that's 15 points higher than paladins and 30/31 points higher than shadow knights.
Last edited by Ennewi; 05-12-2022 at 02:39 AM..
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  #44  
Old 05-12-2022, 02:57 AM
Jimjam Jimjam is online now
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Originally Posted by Naethyn [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Wow is that true? Because weapon skill matters a ton for dps and it would explain why paladins consistently parse higher at bis. Is it true that paladins have more piercing skill than even warriors?
Itís an interesting one as Paladinís didnít have piercing skill at all (shanking villains ainít noble) until lances came around (and tbh lances without horses make zero sense, neither does them being 2hp). So some dev just stuck what they thought would be a sensible value while ignoring previous design philosophy that plate melees somewhat shun practice of scabbiness.

I guess paladins and rogues not having overlap in piercing weapons, and lances being noble, justified paladins having a boosted pierce skill?
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  #45  
Old 05-12-2022, 03:10 AM
Ennewi Ennewi is offline
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Considering that both of the sk parent classes can equip and skill up with piercing weapons, and one of the pal classes cannot, it would have made more sense to give sks the edge.
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  #46  
Old 05-12-2022, 05:36 AM
Pint Pint is offline
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Originally Posted by mattydef [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Disease Cloud, Shadow Vortex, Blind and Stun are all 1.5 second cast times
You can't chain cast stun and blind is typically for lower level paladins. SK is arguably the better snap aggro but the difference is small
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  #47  
Old 05-12-2022, 09:10 AM
Allishia Allishia is offline
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Originally Posted by Naethyn [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Wow is that true? Because weapon skill matters a ton for dps and it would explain why paladins consistently parse higher at bis. Is it true that paladins have more piercing skill than even warriors?
Pretty sure war is 240. But I'm at work so can't really check [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
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  #48  
Old 05-12-2022, 02:19 PM
mattydef mattydef is offline
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Originally Posted by Pint [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
You can't chain cast stun and blind is typically for lower level paladins. SK is arguably the better snap aggro but the difference is small
You can't chain cast DC either. Weaving DC and SV may possibly end up beating out spamming blind with the occasional stun though, but even so, it'll never make a difference in a group/raid scenario unless the SK/Paladin are literally fighting for agro against each other for some odd reason. I'm curious why you think blind is for lower level paladins though since I personally tend to use that the most to generate threat at 59.
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  #49  
Old 05-12-2022, 03:59 PM
Danth Danth is offline
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Originally Posted by mattydef [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
You can't chain cast DC either. Weaving DC and SV may possibly end up beating out spamming blind with the occasional stun though, but even so, it'll never make a difference in a group/raid scenario unless the SK/Paladin are literally fighting for agro against each other for some odd reason.
I (60 SK) did exactly that trial some years ago with a 60 paladin. He mostly used flash of light mixed in with stun when it was up; I was using a mixture of disease cloud, clinging darkness, and the occasional AC debuff. Our result was we kept ping-ponging the target monster back and forth between us until we got bored and decided our normal threat generation was effectively equal. I didn't use heart flutter or asystole, two notoriously high-threat spells. I intend to give them a trial some day, but thus far I've never got around to it.

Years of experience tells me that on either class the occasional fizzle streak is the most common reason someone else might get whacked on an engage, followed by an inopportune bash or once in awhile someone might go overboard because he wants to rip aggro on purpose for fun.

--------------------------

Edit: My memory is that piercing was belatedly given to paladins because some folks used to complain to Verant that it made no sense for the paladin class not to have that skill since some of the paladins of our own real and quasi-real history used various types of spears.

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Last edited by Danth; 05-12-2022 at 04:28 PM..
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  #50  
Old 05-12-2022, 06:18 PM
Pint Pint is offline
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Originally Posted by mattydef [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
You can't chain cast DC either. Weaving DC and SV may possibly end up beating out spamming blind with the occasional stun though, but even so, it'll never make a difference in a group/raid scenario unless the SK/Paladin are literally fighting for agro against each other for some odd reason. I'm curious why you think blind is for lower level paladins though since I personally tend to use that the most to generate threat at 59.
It's been a minute but I remember by the time I was tanking the planes blind had to go bc it was more trouble then it was worth and it wasn't necessary. Never had to start using it in velious iirc but I guess if you know it can't land then maybe it's worth it?
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