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Old 09-24-2018, 08:37 PM
Solist Solist is offline

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They could have added a 3 second cast time to ivandyrs at the time and not affected anything at all.
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Old 09-24-2018, 10:59 PM
Rygar Rygar is offline
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So... just want to add to some discussion on the 6+ level rule. It is actually only a half truth, it is really 1.3x your level OR +6 levels (whichever is higher) where mobs get near perfect immunity. I personally think original devs shit the bed on this and had a real hard on for gimping casters with weak justification for not limiting melee.
7) Why is there a 6 level limit for what a caster can land spells on, but no apparent cap exists for melee? –Eandori

A) There isn't really a six level limit. Here's how it works: There is a level limit for spell effects that has a minimum of six levels. A spell will not affect an NPC that is more than 1.3 times your level, or 6 levels higher, which ever is greater. So at 15th level it's 6 levels. At 40th it's 12 levels. Now, how often is a 40th level warrior going to actually hit while attacking a 53rd level NPC?
Well dude, most would argue that level 40 warrior can hit the 53rd mob for a hell of a lot more damage than a level 40 wizard. But I digress...

Here are some dated mentions of this rule in place:
Are they red to you? It's possible that they are above the
5 (or is it 6) level span that you can affect with spells.

In oasis, at 15 my shaman couldn't land *any* spells on
a level 20-21 'A' orc warrior. At 16, suddenly, my slow
and poison spells were working (and T'ing them off
royally too [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Mobs that are higher in level will incrementally have higher resistances.
Mobs more than 6 levels higher than you will resist about 100% of your
spells. If in doubt, cast Lifetap first. If it resists Lifetap, it will
resist just about any other attack spell you cast on it.
If you really want some excitement, kill the named Giant, with the last name Bluehammer. (I would wait until 31 though...according to Allakhazam's, he can be up to 37, and you don't want to be caught by the 6-level rule)
I've always wondered; is Harmony restricted by the 6 level rule? In
other words, can you harmony mobs that are more than 6 levels higher
than you?
Harmony is considered a non-offensive spell, therefore the 6 level
rule doesn't apply.
>Harmony can fail. The difference is that the mob doesn't aggro when
>it does.
I've never seen it fail on a mob less than 5 - 6 levels above you.
You are incorrect. Harmony never fails. In fact, it works on 100% resistant
critters (Black Reavers in City of Mist). I also suspect that the 6 level
restiction doesn't apply.
Mar 22 2000
Vangor, time to buy a clue. The level casting cap does exist. Make a level one, go cast on a guard or young kodiak. Notice that you get resisted every time. If a mob is either 6+ levels above you, or 120%+ of your level, his resist rate to you is approximately 99.999%. I play a level 50 enchanter, I know this for a fact.

At level 50, I can affect mobs up to level 60. And you want to know something? Dojorn sheds spells from mere level 50's like a duck does water. The way he is killed is that a group throws a bunch of tanks at him while the healers try to keep up with the damage he's causing.
Mar 03 2000
It is not a hard six level limit but a percentage of your current level that you may cast above. GZ has stated this several times. So yes at level one you will not even be able to go up 6 levels pobly, but at 50 since that percentage is much higher you could potentially go up the 13 levels nessasary to get a few spells off on him. ShowEQ is right, and there is no use argueing about it since it is pretty much proof.
Feb 28 2000
Hey Anon, um... the lvl 6 thing you said was wrong because I started helping my guild hunt Allizewsaur at lvl 42 and he is lvl 50. I could lifedraw without Tash on him and when tashed I could sometimes get fear, darkness, scourge, and VOS off on him. So your little thing about lvl 6 is wrong.
Feb 26 2000
I happen to know for a fact that the game is set up so that any mob exactly 6 levels higher than you will resist every spell you cast on them. Not CT, not Innoruk, not Nagafin, noone is higher than level 55. I also have inside GM information on this. Try it once, make a level 1 character and try to cast on a skeliton, it wont work, I dont care if its tashened to have -500magic sv u CANT CAST ON IT lol.
So there I have at the very earliest found a February 26, 2000 mention of this rule in place. So that level 56 necro that Daldaen linked about not being able to land on CT is either bogus (some guy talking smack about raiding CT), thought CT was too high and that he could only land at level 57 and really didn't try at 56, CT is level 73, or the formula given is wrong.

There's mention of GZ giving interviews on a percentage, comments of a level 42 landing on a level 50 mob (possible), and lower level mentions of 6 level limit (so def feel that necro post is inaccurate). There was a mention of 120% instead of 130%, so maybe it is possible GZ tuned this over time behind the scenes, but who knows the truth... lost to the sands of time.

But back on topic... I think the Hoop nerf is indeed a bit dated. I think an accurate solution would be to simply add a 3-5 second casting time while also preventing recharge. This would prevent zerging and not affect the spell when cast by players in any way.

Or, go further down the rabbit hole. Nerf mallets to race/class usable only, remove vendor buyback from Bladestopper, Puppet Strings, Prayers, and Spider Silk Nets (and any other agro management clickie). That would certainly make the experience more classic in nature, those tactics were not known by the widespread masses and only serve to bastardize and trivialize end game encounters further.
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Old 09-25-2018, 03:44 AM
Dolalin Dolalin is offline
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There's some sort of veto squad amongst Rogean/Nilbog/etc that game mechanics changes like this would have to pass through. I wouldn't get my hopes up but who knows.
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Old 02-10-2019, 09:02 AM
Xadion Xadion is offline
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Bumping this thread, will bump alll of others in discussion of this and HT + unholy disc info if needed.

Lifetaps should be returned to classic, to how they SHOULD be and to how they should have been for YEARS on this "classic" server.

Lifetaps and unholy disc HT are practically useless right now - there have been posts and posts of evidence and other material showing how it should be - yet EQ's own patch notes have been disregarded for years here, why?

This needs to be fixed and put in with the later half of the patch we got- it will truely fix knights and necros then.
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Old 06-16-2019, 06:41 AM
drelk001 drelk001 is offline
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All for that whole "Not Classic"

Yeah... Let's do this... Bring back old Lifetaps.
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Old 01-25-2020, 11:55 PM
Pyrocat Pyrocat is offline
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Pyrocat the Protector of Vul
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Old 01-26-2020, 12:27 AM
DMN DMN is offline
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if they don't change taps they should at least change the hoop to be rechargeable. Nerf recharge on something you already nerfed the effect of?
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Old 01-26-2020, 12:40 AM
Nirgon Nirgon is offline

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Put a spell with the same name as spirit tap on the hoop and make the raid mobs immune to it if you have to prevent it

Better idea is end the non classic item experience of all this item recharging
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Old 01-26-2020, 05:51 AM
Dolalin Dolalin is offline
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I do think this is a higher impact fix than needed to be done. Nerfing this one item should ideally involve a change only to the one item: change its effect to a new spell that is resistable, and move necro/sk taps back to what they were (unless there's some other issue with them that I'm not aware of).
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Old 01-26-2020, 06:25 AM
Dolalin Dolalin is offline
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I'm fact, after the lifetap nerf in Fall of 1999 (to stop groups of level 20 necros from taking down Hill Giants), necro lifetaps wouldn't land on dragons, at least into late Velious, since they were all 100% magic immune to prevent them being slowed. At least this is my impression from reading newsgroups.

So maybe the real problem here is that lifetap lands on dragons at all.


The problem with the lifedrain nerf is that it is an all-or-nothing
resist. Also, the life drain's resist rate has a much narrower range
of levels affected as opposed to ice comet at upper levels.

Here's an example: Several L50 necromancers complained that they could
no longer land a single spell on Lord Nagafen even when standing under
his belly. One L50 necro was 0 for 12 with the L49 drain in a row,
which is utterly ridiculous. However, other caster (druids, wizards,
magician, etc.) were casting at normal effectiveness, with some spells
landing or partially resisted. One druid had all spells land without a
single resist.
Last edited by Dolalin; 01-26-2020 at 06:28 AM..
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