I've never played World of Warcraft

[Ciderpress]

Speaking of CH chains, I always wonder if those were an intended mechanic or just an emergent thing by the playerbase trying to figure out how to kill bosses. Were the devs really thinking "Okay so, for them to kill this boss they'll have to get 20 clerics and have each of them start casting CH one second apart"? Cause that seems like a pretty specific thing to design on purpose.

[Toxigen]

Originally Posted by Ciderpress [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Speaking of CH chains, I always wonder if those were an intended mechanic or just an emergent thing by the playerbase trying to figure out how to kill bosses. Were the devs really thinking "Okay so, for them to kill this boss they'll have to get 20 clerics and have each of them start casting CH one second apart"? Cause that seems like a pretty specific thing to design on purpose.

definitely not intended

[Trexller]

so then how the hell did they expect us to kill bosses

[Toxigen]

Originally Posted by Trexller [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

so then how the hell did they expect us to kill bosses

i think by velious with the drastic increase in mob hp and dmg, they were aware of the CH chain thing

classic and kunark can be killed without CH, 32k hp mobs wizzies go boom boom

[Ciderpress]

I seem to remember there was some kind of technical limitation that held mobs at 32khp, and then in velious they were able to get around that limit so there are like 1mhp bosses. They could have just kept the dragons at 32k and made them proc something that manataps only clerics or whatever.

I can't remember how long after velious release it took for aow to first be killed, anyone know that?

[Trexller]

Originally Posted by Ciderpress [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I seem to remember there was some kind of technical limitation that held mobs at 32khp, and then in velious they were able to get around that limit so there are like 1mhp bosses. They could have just kept the dragons at 32k and made them proc something that manataps only clerics or whatever.

I can't remember how long after velious release it took for aow to first be killed, anyone know that?

IIRC fires of heaven killed AoW on the day of luclin launch

[Duik]

Southern Armada on Prexus killed much of velious early on.
Dunno when though. I was just a wannabe at that stage. Early 50's wizzie.

[Iron Chob]

Originally Posted by Toxigen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

lol yeah ok bub

if you think bleeding edge raiders couldnt figure out a CH chain....just...lol

i was one of the few US players to kill M'uru 1.0 (negative energy spell pushback) and then went on and did all of wotlk hard modes (except Yogg 0 alone in the darkness)

EQ is childs play compared to top end WoW raiding

I love internet posts that self-aggrandize beneath a veil of conversation.

Top end WoW raiders (modern day) wouldn't make it to raid level in EQ is the point you missed in your haste to dickwave. And pretty much all of WoW's Vanilla raiders learnt their trade in EQ....and many of them no longer play.

But feel free to elucidate on your interwebz exploits, I'm sure somebody is impressed.

[Tnair]

the single biggest difference for me was the linear game design.

in original EQ you are dumped in a city to start. you have a note with a name. theres no maps. if youre a dark elf or wood elf you are already in a place people famously need assistance to navigate. the wood elf can just die immediately by walking ten steps the wrong direction. you can attack any npc, including your own guildmaster by accident while just trying to type. if you even find your guild, they may have some text giving you a very very basic task or two, five newbie critter parts or whatever. where are the critters? where are you even? you dont know. you wander around lost and possibly dying a few times. you slowly learn your surroundings. you finally find enough of newbie critter to return the parts to your guild, they give you a piece of literal garbage, like a 1 ac cloak or something. after at minimum an hour of this you are level 2. you have no other leads from your guild after you get your 1 ac cloak. after several more hours you are level 4 or 5 and you have no choice but to go further out into the darkness.... inevitably dying or fleeing in a panic repeatedly as you learn how to travel anywhere and try to find places to safely kill things and/or profit.

WoW dumps you two steps from a Giant Exclamation Point man, who begins a chain (later a network) of essentially unbroken quest guidance for the entire game. you cant accidentally walk off an edge nearby and die. theres a map with clear markers. the newbie critters are standing on your foot when you spawn, theres a lot of them, and they have almost no chance to kill you. you have an automatic quest log that mostly, combined with your automatic map, functions as just an arrow saying "go this way, stop here, collect 10 item you find there". compared with eq, gear upgrades rain from the sky, and are likewise made obsolete quickly while leveling (almost immediately below level 20). the dungeons are not places to explore; they are puzzles with correct answers. there is no talking in dungeon groups except to explain a puzzle solution ("next boss has shield, go to room edges when shield up"), blame someone for solving the puzzle wrong, or loot distribution. because of the "theres just one right way and all deviations are just less optimal" design, other people are very likely to be telling you exactly what you should be doing in any fight AND what gear to wear.. theres no flexibility about whats considered acceptable. some people are simply fine with you being substandard, and (mostly) others arent.

EQ was designed to explore, in some cases, was literally designed to be unbeatable, and even today theres a lot of roads to take.

WoW was designed to be beaten, and theres just the one, beaten, path.

[Toxigen]

Originally Posted by Iron Chob [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I love internet posts that self-aggrandize beneath a veil of conversation.

Top end WoW raiders (modern day) wouldn't make it to raid level in EQ is the point you missed in your haste to dickwave. And pretty much all of WoW's Vanilla raiders learnt their trade in EQ....and many of them no longer play.

But feel free to elucidate on your interwebz exploits, I'm sure somebody is impressed.

yeah no

sorry you're so vested in eq you think its hard because of time required

not sure if it still happens today but top end guilds would split their raid force into 5 or 6 groups of alts and clear zones that many times per week to funnel gear to mains before mythic progression...this was firelands / mop / etc

time sinks were not a roadblock back then and they arent today for the hardcore elite