Best tank class (group edition)

[YendorLootmonkey]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No, rangers are just mediocre dps. I parse groups. I parse raids. Rangers are just not that good at dps. Great class, but not stellar dps. DPS for ranger is solidly middle of the road.

Olay, but are you parsing a bunch of rangers walking on eggshells trying not to take aggro away from a warrior and fucking the entire raid, or are you parsing rangers purposely tanking things and throwing caution to the wind?

Alleriah, are you going balls to the wall DPS when you're not Trueshotting on raids? I know I turned off auto-attack every now and then to make sure I didn't out-aggro the MT.

[Troxx]

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Olay, but are you parsing a bunch of rangers walking on eggshells trying not to take aggro away from a warrior and fucking the entire raid, or are you parsing rangers purposely tanking things and throwing caution to the wind?

You talk about rangers as if they are some latent dps god class only held back by tanks that can't hold aggro. Sorry, that's not the case. Will the ranger 'holding back' toss in a few nukes that are barely better than keeping autoattack un-interrupted?

Rangers are "ok" dps in the same way that they are "good enough" tanks.

/shrug

[BlownAway]

lol

[Xaeophi]

Glad you understood. Not sure how/why this other guy doesnt.
it kind of reminds me of someone who tried to make a ranger in the past. Threw on a bunch of str/dex gear and had a miserable experience.

For someone to say rangers are just okay dps is proof enough that
1- This guy obviously doesn't parse in groups.
2 - This guy obviously doesn't parse in raids.

Oh.. Why do i make this claim? when my parse is next to rogues, or sometimes exceeding that of a rogue in a group.. I consider that decent dps for also having the capabilities listed in previous posts.

Okay well what about raids.. Well... Rogues should be #1 and they usually are. Rangers for the most part will be above every other melee class. If you think monks beat rangers then im sorry to break the news to you and reveal that they dont... unless santa gave all the p99 monks Gharns last Christmas monk dps is mediocre as shit.

[Xaeophi]

My advice to you, stick to setting records for long duration Lodizal Kitesstalls and whatever else is in your capabilities. You can either accept the reality that rangers shit on just about every melee class (on average) besides rogues OR you can keep finding new ways to sound incompetent on the forums. Nothing personal.

Have a great evening and best wishes on your lodizal kites.

[Troxx]

Lol

[Ennewi]

Originally Posted by Ennewi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Wave of Healing. Underused because of the high mana cost, but its low cast-time is a lifesaver when sub-59 ... Wave of Healing also has the potential to heal +1500hp across the board, assuming full group

Correction: 1,320hp in total, potentially. The project1999 wiki had Wave of Healing at 270hp per player when in fact it is 220hp.

[Troxx]

Wave of healing being capped at 220/target is not a very good heal. Situationally useful, but not efficient.

[Ennewi]

Originally Posted by Troxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Wave of healing being capped at 220/target is not a very good heal. Situationally useful, but not efficient.

True. It's hard to make it mana-efficient and in a lot of groups that opportunity won't present itself. However, in the majority of those same groups, mana is continuously streaming in from multiple sources. Depending on CC resists and how fast group member hp is dropping, other heals can be inferior given their cast time--a split second too late and the blue spell particles just highlight that reality and the group member's corpse. If LoH is on cooldown or the dying are out of its range, there really isn't a better option afaik other than a SoulFire (or Celestial Cleansing when available).

Wave of Healing is best for "oh shit" moments that initially don't seem shitty enough to warrant using Lay on Hands or SF charges. Personally, I prefer to wait and see how things develop in camp before blowing my LoH, especially in groups with multiple forms of healing, heals that usually are enough, if not more than enough, even when chain pulling. But with the Druid/Shaman casting Greater or Superior Heal, I often wondered, why do the same as a Paladin (unless time is not an issue)? More diversity with heals and other spells in general helps out a ton. The Bard hymns. The Shaman torpors. The Necromancer patches. And then the Cleric finishes CH. Without those other, weaker heals, the dying player usually still has a few ways to buy themselves time, but not a great deal of time. So any mana lost is worth it if the xp continues, more so if the heal keeps a caster alive since they would be oom after rez.

Wave of Healing's faster cast also means not leaving oneself as open to being interrupted by the current target's attacks. Used sparingly, it can keep a dying member alive for a few more hits until better heals finally land, while topping off the rest of the party. Sometimes I have such an overabundance of mana regen that I look for moments when all or even as few as three members have at least a bubble of red missing from their bar. It's a good way to break up the autopilot mode that can set in when grouped with quality players that know the ins and outs of the zone and their class.

Once Celestial Cleansing is memorized, there are fewer reasons to keep Wave of Healing loaded in place of another spell. But even then, it's still good for places like Halls of Testing, to keep DPS from getting below the low hp aggro threshold, or Kael arena when everyone suddenly gets turned on at the end of a fight.

Agreed though, the spell could/should be better overall, but the same goes for most hybrid spells and abilities. However, finding their worth and making due with what's available can be fun, even when it's frustrating.

[fadetree]

Originally Posted by Alleriah [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ya Thats one narrow way of looking at it mr blood guard. I was entertained reading what you had to say.. Back to reality.
Now to clear some things up..
How i justify rangers being optimal tanks is this....
{long post redacted}

Well, so look,I'm always pro-ranger but it's true that they really aren't best choice for group tanking past say 45-50 or so. Before that, they kick ass but so do a lot of other classes. Notably, warriors kind of suck at this range.
I always saw myself as an off tank/root parker. My main job is to protect the robes, DPS is what I do otherwise. Peel angry mobs off of them quickly and root or ranger mezz or kite depending on situation. That's where we shine the most, in my opinion.