Lvl 53 Mage Fire Pet, what's the point?

[long.liam]

Originally Posted by PatChapp [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yes very much, the 49 pet vs any decent xp mob at 57+ gets absolutely shredded, whereas the 57 pet holds it's own fine. I even found the 51 pet better on my own long haul on seafury island, I timed the fights and the 51 pet usually killed them about 45seconds - minute faster, and little downtime with either pet chaining 1 per mob there.

I'm very Skeptical of that. I would need to see an extensive parse of the 49 Earth Pet compared to the 51 and 57 Earth pets to believe that the Difference is anything other than very small. I would think 20 points of correlation across several level ranges. I would do it myself, but I just don't care enough and don't really play anymore. Even then I'm not sure it would be worth 2x the mana cost for the higher pet.

[long.liam]

Actually now that I think it about, in order for the extra mana cost to even break even, the Higher pet would need 2x the HP and 2x the damage to be worth it. Or possibly 2x the AC somehow. Yeah I'm extremely skeptical that the Higher pet has 2x the AC of the 49 pet.

[long.liam]

Unless my thinking is wrong about this. I actually think that the 49 pet is more mana efficient to use. If I'm wrong about this, please explain to me why my thinking is incorrect.

[PatChapp]

Originally Posted by long.liam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Unless my thinking is wrong about this. I actually think that the 49 pet is more mana efficient to use. If I'm wrong about this, please explain to me why my thinking is incorrect.

It is upwards of 8 lvls lower, which means higher level mobs destroy it and it kills much slower. If your farming greens I could see it being viable, but for xp mobs it's worthless at higher levels

[Balimon]

Correct it's the level of the pet that makes the largest difference

[ReoDobbs]

Originally Posted by long.liam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I'm very Skeptical of that. I would need to see an extensive parse of the 49 Earth Pet compared to the 51 and 57 Earth pets to believe that the Difference is anything other than very small. I would think 20 points of correlation across several level ranges. I would do it myself, but I just don't care enough and don't really play anymore. Even then I'm not sure it would be worth 2x the mana cost for the higher pet.

It's 150% the mana cost not 200%. Additionally level up a melee class fight a level 41 mob when you're level 41, once you hit level 45 go back and fight the same level 41 mob, let me know if you're at least 50% more efficient (spoiler it'll be far more than that).

This isn't even taking into account the level 51 and 57 Earth pet have a root that actually does damage and they love to spam it. (Pre 50 Earth pet root doesn't do damage).

Anytime I see a mage holding a shovel post 51 and is doing anything but chain casting I cringe because they've simply read something in some guide or YouTube video and can't think or test for themselves

[long.liam]

Originally Posted by ReoDobbs [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It's 150% the mana cost not 200%. Additionally level up a melee class fight a level 41 mob when you're level 41, once you hit level 45 go back and fight the same level 41 mob, let me know if you're at least 50% more efficient (spoiler it'll be far more than that).

This isn't even taking into account the level 51 and 57 Earth pet have a root that actually does damage and they love to spam it. (Pre 50 Earth pet root doesn't do damage).

Anytime I see a mage holding a shovel post 51 and is doing anything but chain casting I cringe because they've simply read something in some guide or YouTube video and can't think or test for themselves

57 Earth Pet cost 400 Mana: https://wiki.project1999.com/Greater_Vocaration:_Earth
49 Earth Pet cost 200 Mana: https://wiki.project1999.com/Greater_Conjuration:_Earth

And again unless someone shows me actually data to back up their claims, I don't believe that the 57 Pet is more efficient.

[Balimon]

Originally Posted by long.liam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

57 Earth Pet cost 400 Mana: https://wiki.project1999.com/Greater_Vocaration:_Earth
49 Earth Pet cost 200 Mana: https://wiki.project1999.com/Greater_Conjuration:_Earth

And again unless someone shows me actually data to back up their claims, I don't believe that the 57 Pet is more efficient.

Will you accept first hand accounts? Or just pure data? I can give you a perfect example of why the 57 earth pet is better.

https://wiki.project1999.com/A_frost_giant_elite

The elite's in greater divide have around 6500 HP and are level 45~ or so. The 49 earth pet will die halfway through that fight and you'll need to summon another one to finish, and you would have to DS it again.

49 earth x2 + DS x2 + Burnout = 200x2 + 155x2 + 150 = 860 mana

57 earth + DS + Burnout = 400 + 155 + 150 = 705 mana

Then you would have the factor in the lost med time, when you would be re-summoning the pet, rebuffing the pet, running around like a chicken until the pet gets aggro.

I know this first hand because I would exp on those guys at 56 using Dyzil's (level 41-45) which is even higher level then the 49 earth(37-41), and would always need two pets to finish the mob. Once I got 57 and swapped to earth, it finished the mob by itself 9 out 10 times, and than I would just have to tank a little bit at the end, that's when the summon is the lowest level.

Now I'm not saying the shoveled 49 earth isn't worth using past 49, because it is, and there are plenty of exp spots where it's viable. If you don't have a water or air staff, it's prolly the best pet to use until 56 when you Dyzils, and then 57 when you get the final earth. If you really need logs I'm sure I can dig some out, but it's completely unnecessary, anyone can tell you that the 49 earth has a shelf life.

[long.liam]

Originally Posted by Balimon [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Will you accept first hand accounts? Or just pure data? I can give you a perfect example of why the 57 earth pet is better.

https://wiki.project1999.com/A_frost_giant_elite

The elite's in greater divide have around 6500 HP and are level 45~ or so. The 49 earth pet will die halfway through that fight and you'll need to summon another one to finish, and you would have to DS it again.

49 earth x2 + DS x2 + Burnout = 200x2 + 155x2 + 150 = 860 mana

57 earth + DS + Burnout = 400 + 155 + 150 = 705 mana

Then you would have the factor in the lost med time, when you would be re-summoning the pet, rebuffing the pet, running around like a chicken until the pet gets aggro.

I know this first hand because I would exp on those guys at 56 using Dyzil's (level 41-45) which is even higher level then the 49 earth(37-41), and would always need two pets to finish the mob. Once I got 57 and swapped to earth, it finished the mob by itself 9 out 10 times, and than I would just have to tank a little bit at the end, that's when the summon is the lowest level.

Now I'm not saying the shoveled 49 earth isn't worth using past 49, because it is, and there are plenty of exp spots where it's viable. If you don't have a water or air staff, it's prolly the best pet to use until 56 when you Dyzils, and then 57 when you get the final earth. If you really need logs I'm sure I can dig some out, but it's completely unnecessary, anyone can tell you that the 49 earth has a shelf life.

From what I understood, Mages used a slightly different method to kill mobs before the pet aggro was bugged, before whatever changes that occurred that causes all pet aggro to switch to the mage. Back then the Mages wouldn't bother hasting or putting DS on the Pet. All they would do is start Summoning a New pet before their current pet died and then right before the spell landed they would use pet get lost. Mages used to be able to chain summoning down certain raid targets. This is probably not a viable strategy anymore, except maybe with the Earth Pet. I believe they wouldn't cast any buffs or DS on the Pets, so that the fresh pet could instantly pull aggro from the Mage each time the new pet was summoned.

[Balimon]

Originally Posted by long.liam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

From what I understood, Mages used a slightly different method to kill mobs before the pet aggro was bugged, before whatever changes that occurred that causes all pet aggro to switch to the mage. Back then the Mages wouldn't bother hasting or putting DS on the Pet. All they would do is start Summoning a New pet before their current pet died and then right before the spell landed they would use pet get lost. Mages used to be able to chain summoning down certain raid targets. This is probably not a viable strategy anymore, except maybe with the Earth Pet. I believe they wouldn't cast any buffs or DS on the Pets, so that the fresh pet could instantly pull aggro from the Mage each time the new pet was summoned.

Pets definitely need DS at the the bare minimum, chaining an earth pet without DS is pointless, it will just die without doing any damage. I'm not sure why you are bringing up some obscure way to kill a raid mob, that wouldn't even work. You would need to chain summon fire pets with the innate DS to do what you're taking about.

I understand how the mechanics used to work just fine, I had a mage then too, even if that was still the case the earth pet would need a DS. Also I'd like to point out that post 55/57 you need to haste the pets as well to keep up with mob HP. I'm not sure what you're trying to argue at this point