Someone Translate this wall of text from Omni

[Foxplay]

I agree with the sentiment that raid logging sucks, be it via batphone, on a 7day lockout MMO, or a raid rotation that could take months

Raid logging is the number one reason I quit rift and I was in the top guild on my sever. The game at a point boiled down to barely anyone ever playing or having Jack to do unless it was raid night (the lockouts resetting)

Not sure there is a solution for p99 while remaining classic when it comes to the questions of the current meta and ruleset favoring batphones and trains

Personally I think part of the solution would be to root the dragons or make rules as to how far from spawn they can be pulled... This would eliminate fte trains but more importantly it would counter alot of the high level raid bloat... Alot of people would stop raiding if they had to earn their pixels / clear trash and not just pull them to zone in

[Bardp1999]

The answer to the raid scene is very simple, but a bag limit on how many Dragons we can kill. During deer season you can't go out with a machine gun and slaughter 100 deer, there is a bag limit of a couple of doe and a couple of bucks. Maybe for guilds like Aftermath give them a bigger bag limit or have a system in place where once you get X amount of kills your bag limit increases. I don't know but this is one of the only solutions that keeps competitiveness and doesn't allow one guild to dominate the server (Spoiler: Aftermath is dominating/monopolizing the server in a big way).

[bthomsen0312]

Originally Posted by Bardp1999 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The answer to the raid scene is very simple, but a bag limit on how many Dragons we can kill. During deer season you can't go out with a machine gun and slaughter 100 deer, there is a bag limit of a couple of doe and a couple of bucks. Maybe for guilds like Aftermath give them a bigger bag limit or have a system in place where once you get X amount of kills your bag limit increases. I don't know but this is one of the only solutions that keeps competitiveness and doesn't allow one guild to dominate the server (Spoiler: Aftermath is dominating/monopolizing the server in a big way).

Are we talking about the same aftermath that has dropped vulak like 5 times in a row recently?

They are the premier raiding guild don't get me wrong, but they have solid competition

[ErlickBachman]

Originally Posted by bthomsen0312 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

There was not a single guild on live that was rotating current content.

zero
zilch
none
nada

Quellious and the Rathe servers rotated "current content" when I played on live from 2000 to 2003. Just thought you should know.

[BlownAway]

Competitive? Are you guys seriously considering Killing kunark dragons, 32k hp, with in moments of spawn with 100 people or, 140+ guild member in ToV on respawn day with almost no one else competitive? ToV dragons just last cycle being left up for many many hours until aftermath can go ahead and casually log in the next morning to kill them alone, competition? All this bull shit about "Just join us if you want to experience content." Is 160+ people not enough? You guys all want to just split up the other 3-400 raiders each night and get 200+ more members in AM? What kind of backwards ass thinking is this?

Is it so hard for any of you to understand that some people want to experience content with there own guild mates they grew in the game with? How many of you in Aftermath right now were around for a guild first kill? How many of you started from nothing and set up raid kill from scratch. How many of the 120+ members at that raid did ANYTHING to progress aftermath to its current infrastructure? Real easy to talk so much shit about effort when 94% of all of you did nothing to get the guild your in to the point of killing the mob for the .... how many hundreds of time now?

Why has no one considered or discussed splitting up a ToV rotation into 3 Tiers of mobs. So that there are 3 guilds each week in TOV killing dragons. Make the Tiers of mobs set up by difficulty with the Hardest being a barrier of entry into moving into the next tier. Give only 1 day to kill the ones on your slot then they become FFA. Thats 12 Guilds killing or attempting to kill FTE's in TOV each month. With AM eating all the mobs not killed in time. This would keep more people seeing content and in TOV each week and more ability for older content to be varied. Mobs like Lord Vyemm wont be sitting around for 3 days and the top guild will have plenty of mobs to Snag up as the newer guilds stumble around.

[rezzie]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Furthermore, for all your claims about the "time and effort" put in, the vast majority of members of the top guilds don't have to put in that time and effort.

The Aftermath DKP page is open for all to view. Here it is, sorted by: adjustment (tracking) DKP. Looks like your claim that the vast majority of our members don't put in time or effort is sadly not backed up by reality, as the vast majority of our members do all contribute a reasonable amount of tracking.

There is nothing stopping Anonymous, or Omni, or Dawn Believers, or any other guild on the server from competing in ToV or the other top tier targets. No guild has an uncatchable advantage. The mage spots are well known, the pull techniques are well known, and there is ample opportunity to practice pulls with flurries or park mages during mini-crawls.

Azure Guard never used to compete in ToV. Around the time of Tempest's demise, they decided they wanted to compete. Surprise surprise, they're putting in the time and now they're being rewarded with mobs they are winning competitively against seasoned Core and Aftermath pull teams.

The only thing stopping you doing the same is that you want the rules changed to suit your personal play style more.

Ask the Azure Guard guys if the Vulak loot they earned would have felt the same if they'd killed it on their rotated week, vs sniping it from the hands of both Aftermath and Core.

[Jonabis]

Just remove raid boss respawn windows. Make raid mobs only respawns on quakes. 0-5 quakes a month. Keep current rules(some rules no longer matter). Zero has to be a possibility to prevent end of month poopsockin as we have seen in the past. This ends socking, provides good competition, and gives more guilds opportunity to see content if they put in some effort. Kittens got all west dragons last quake because they tried. People can xp, or trash clear raid without fear of DQ'ing their guild.

[Nexii]

Originally Posted by Jonabis [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Just remove raid boss respawn windows. Make raid mobs only respawns on quakes. 0-5 quakes a month. Keep current rules(some rules no longer matter). Zero has to be a possibility to prevent end of month poopsockin as we have seen in the past. This ends socking, provides good competition, and gives more guilds opportunity to see content if they put in some effort. Kittens got all west dragons last quake because they tried. People can xp, or trash clear raid without fear of DQ'ing their guild.

I've always favored quakes over variance based repops, but 0-5 quakes would be much less mobs per week. You'd need ~0-10 quakes to equal what we get now (roughly 3.5 variance repops and 1.5 quakes a month)

[Wonkie]

quakes should autosuspend whatever guild killed vulak most recently, for 12 hours

[Prostatus]

Loramin argues with everyone V3.0