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  #21  
Old 03-01-2021, 04:21 PM
rewinder47 rewinder47 is offline
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If you are wondering why it is worth so much money, it's because.... it's not easy to get.

Yet I see them for sale pretty often, so the drop rate can't be as low as you are suggesting

Therefore by logic, everything is fine and you are wrong
  #22  
Old 03-01-2021, 09:29 PM
unsunghero unsunghero is offline
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Thank goodness hard-casting invis still seems to work just fine. Cancel magic on the other hand, broke charms at first then just stopped working completely...was weird
  #23  
Old 03-01-2021, 10:05 PM
Shadeynight Shadeynight is offline
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Alright guys, someone get out there and kill 10,000 couriers for the sake of this argument! You’ll probably even make some plat out of it!
  #24  
Old 03-02-2021, 01:39 PM
loramin loramin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unsunghero [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Thank goodness hard-casting invis still seems to work just fine.
It works just fine, but results in slower leveling.

When you charm fight, you want to break your charm right when both mobs are about to die: if you break it sooner, you'll have to spend more mana to kill the two mobs. Ideally you want them both with 0.1% left, so you can just kill them with a quick low-level spell or a melee hit.

But when you "hard-cast" invis, you have to account for the casting time. That means you have to guess "the mos are at 10%, hopefully they'll be down to 1% when I finish casting". If you cast too early, they have too many HP left. If you cast too late, the mob dies before you break charm, and you get either 0% or 50% of its XP.

Instant-cast invis (from GGR) let's you break with no guesswork, at the latest moment possible. Over the course of a lot of charm fights that adds up ... a lot. For a charm class, virtually no other item in the game offers a similar increase in XP speed (only a very few like Fungi, JBB, or Lumi Staff).
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Anyone can improve the wiki! If you are new to the Blue server, you can improve the wiki to earn a "welcome package" of up to 2k+ platinum! Message me for details.
  #25  
Old 03-02-2021, 02:56 PM
unsunghero unsunghero is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
It works just fine, but results in slower leveling.

When you charm fight, you want to break your charm right when both mobs are about to die: if you break it sooner, you'll have to spend more mana to kill the two mobs. Ideally you want them both with 0.1% left, so you can just kill them with a quick low-level spell or a melee hit.

But when you "hard-cast" invis, you have to account for the casting time. That means you have to guess "the mos are at 10%, hopefully they'll be down to 1% when I finish casting". If you cast too early, they have too many HP left. If you cast too late, the mob dies before you break charm, and you get either 0% or 50% of its XP.

Instant-cast invis (from GGR) let's you break with no guesswork, at the latest moment possible. Over the course of a lot of charm fights that adds up ... a lot. For a charm class, virtually no other item in the game offers a similar increase in XP speed (only a very few like Fungi, JBB, or Lumi Staff).
It costs too much mana to try to line up both mobs dying around the same health. Either with a slow, a dot, or nukes on the enemy mob, no matter what it’s a waste of mana. Not only that, but if your mob happens to win, it ganks 50% of the exp

Therefore, the best method to charm kill for exp is in reverse, which means picking a pet that will for sure lose to the mob you are attacking it with. What I do is usually grab 2 enemy mobs if I can, and root them roughly in range of where I want my pet to fight

Keep 1 or both of the enemy mobs rooted, then mash the pet back off command when the pet is less than 10% health. This will ensure that only 1 max level nuke will finish it. It doesn’t matter how long it takes to cast invis, as long as it is less than the duration of root on the enemy mobs. Invis could take 35 seconds to cast and it would still work out. After pet is dead, pick the next most hurt mob to become the new pet, and sent it against something you know it cannot beat

No need for instant charm break this way
Last edited by unsunghero; 03-02-2021 at 03:09 PM..
  #26  
Old 03-02-2021, 03:12 PM
freezzo freezzo is offline
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I camped this on and off over a three week period and killed over 200 couriers before I got my ring. I had to go back and tally up my logs, because I didn't believe I had killed that many. I witnessed other people come in and get them after 15 minutes of camping.
  #27  
Old 03-02-2021, 04:38 PM
loramin loramin is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by unsunghero [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
It costs too much mana to try to line up both mobs dying around the same health. Either with a slow, a dot, or nukes on the enemy mob, no matter what it’s a waste of mana. Not only that, but if your mob happens to win, it ganks 50% of the exp

Therefore, the best method to charm kill for exp is in reverse, which means picking a pet that will for sure lose to the mob you are attacking it with. What I do is usually grab 2 enemy mobs if I can, and root them roughly in range of where I want my pet to fight

Keep 1 or both of the enemy mobs rooted, then mash the pet back off command when the pet is less than 10% health. This will ensure that only 1 max level nuke will finish it. It doesn’t matter how long it takes to cast invis, as long as it is less than the duration of root on the enemy mobs. Invis could take 35 seconds to cast and it would still work out. After pet is dead, pick the next most hurt mob to become the new pet, and sent it against something you know it cannot beat

No need for instant charm break this way
It depends on the mobs, but there are lots of places where you can absolutely find multiple animals of the same level (eg. http://wiki.project1999.com/Alligator%20Alley comes to mind). But whether you have mobs that are the same level or not is irrelevant; in any case, the GGR is going to let you break your pet reliable and instantly, and that's going to be hugely valuable when charm fighting. Casting invis will be neither reliable (with fizzles) or instant (and neither will racial hide).

To be clear: I'm not saying you need a GGR to charm fight! But I am saying that you will earn XP faster while charming with one than without.
__________________

Loramin Frostseer, Oracle of the Tribunal <Anonymous> and Fan of the "Where To Go For XP/For Treasure?" Guides
Anyone can improve the wiki! If you are new to the Blue server, you can improve the wiki to earn a "welcome package" of up to 2k+ platinum! Message me for details.
  #28  
Old 03-02-2021, 05:37 PM
fastboy21 fastboy21 is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DMN [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Sorry to hear that.

Statistics isn't really that complicated, but I understand you struggle with pretty much everything in life.
You don't camp the Gazughi ring...it camps you.
  #29  
Old 03-02-2021, 07:03 PM
unsunghero unsunghero is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
It depends on the mobs, but there are lots of places where you can absolutely find multiple animals of the same level (eg. http://wiki.project1999.com/Alligator%20Alley comes to mind). But whether you have mobs that are the same level or not is irrelevant; in any case, the GGR is going to let you break your pet reliable and instantly, and that's going to be hugely valuable when charm fighting. Casting invis will be neither reliable (with fizzles) or instant (and neither will racial hide).

To be clear: I'm not saying you need a GGR to charm fight! But I am saying that you will earn XP faster while charming with one than without.
Ideal scenario would be areas where multiple mobs are around the same level range. But I’ve learned that even if both mobs are the same level range, your pet can always have a few rounds of hits when the enemy missed and be winning the fight. I’ve tried doing things like the /pet sit command to even things up, and never had much success with it

That’s why I personally switched to pulling multiple mobs at once with the pet. It is somewhat risky to do vs dark blues because of root breaks, but the surest way to ensure your pet loses any fight is to send it to aggro at least 2 other enemy mobs around, then pull pet back to an area relatively safe from pathers, then root+tash each of the 2 mobs killing the pet. The pet will be in melee range of both at once and so his health will plummet. But if needed, i can back the pet off and send him after one or the other mob individually if I want to slow down how fast the pet is dying. The only scenario where instant invis would be clutch would be if root broke off one or both of the enemy mobs as I was casting invis. I admit this does suck when it happens because if I timed pet back off correctly, it means 1-2 more rounds of melee kills the pet and costs me mana and time. But as long as root holds I’m golden to cast invis

The scenario that is more annoying is when there are only lower level mobs around the pet. In these cases I have to become a genocidal maniac and send the pet after literally anything remotely near me, which are going to be green cons that give zero exp. Even at a 5ish level difference the mobs can usually do SOME damage to the pet. After I kill about 3-5 of these, the pet is softened up enough to where another blue con that is lower level can kill it. Typically the pet will need to be around 50% health to lose to a mob that is 1 level lower. This takes me some trial and error to get right

To me, GGR seems like a super costly convenience item, like jboots, not something that fundamentally changes the class like torpor/epic for shaman. I would have to weigh out just how often it happens that root breaks on enemy mobs while I am casting invis, and the amount of time it would take to recoup that lost experience. Then figure out how much pp/hour I can grind before I reach a “break even” point on time saved to justify spending 8k+ of pp. I see rings auctioned all the time by the same people, so there doesn’t seem to be a scarcity of these in regards to the OP
  #30  
Old 03-04-2021, 02:56 PM
Dustyslippers Dustyslippers is offline
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160 sample size is far to small to make assumptions...

I got my ring in 30 minutes and 4 couriers. in rngesus we trust.
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