Raiding in P1999 is nothing like raiding in classic.

[Morgander]

If you're reading this, my guess is that the title of this thread had captured your attention.

Now I've played on P1999 for several years now, on multiple characters in multiple guilds. Each one has been a raiding guild. I've dabbled with guilds such as Dark Ascension and The Mystical Order, just to name a few, and every guild I've been apart of has been first and foremost, a raiding guild.

Through these experiences I've come to notice that the way you're forced to go about raiding on P1999, well, it just isn't very much fun.

It's not very much fun because there's such thing here as fair competition. Imagine if you would, a game of chess where black has the official starting pieces: 1 king, 1 queen, 2 rooks, 2 bishops, 2 knights, and 8 pawns.

Now imagine you're black, and you're playing the game against white, who's starting pieces are: 1 king, 7 queens, and 8 pawns.

Just doesn't sound like equality.

Sure, if you've two basketball teams on the court, one's bound to have superior players, better strategies, harder training regiments, etc., but they're both going to sport 5 players, and each side of the court's got the same measurements, and both teams still abide by all the same rules and undergo the same penalties.

What I'm getting at here is to reinforce the idea that this whole "competitive" aspect of P1999 raiding is an illusion. From my experience, there seems to be a clear outcry to continue to focus on this same-old competitive aspect of raiding from the more efficient raid guilds. And why not? This is of course directly in their best interests. Why share when you can take more than the other guy?

There seems to be a second group of raiders who feel so vehemently toward a given guild(s), that the mere idea of not having the opportunity to take something from these most hated groups, simply boils them up from the very soul outward.

And that's about it. You've got the group who wants nothing to change because they're already getting theirs, and you have the group who may or may not be getting much, but what they're getting keeps them in favor of this same competitive system because when they do get some, they relish in the idea of imaginary bragging rights against the group(s) they hate so avidly.

If you don't believe me you can just run a quick scan across the forums at the myriad of flames from guild to guild. You've got people from TMO blatantly bashing other guilds, calling them names, ridiculing them, and frankly, being very unsportsmanlike for a very competitive, sport-like endeavor. It's not TMO I'm talking about though, nor are they the focus nor major culprit of this topic. It's all the guilds. You've got guilds hating one another, telling lies about each others members, blowing up in public channels, across voice software, all over the forums... The list continues.

So what's the damned point? Well, the point is, why are we still accepting this archaic outlook on this server? How is it fun to log out next to a raid target, leave your guilds common voice-chat program open, awaiting the call, only to log on, play the game for a grand total of maybe 5-15 minutes, then move your character(s) to another target or targets, then rinse and repeat the process?

Whatever happened to actually logging in and playing the game? When did Everquest raiding mean you've got to have multiple max level characters just to stay logged in?

It's not just about who gets the most or who gets the least. It's a culmination of principles and what's most positive for the community.

I for one would implore the server administrators to take another look at the state of affairs on this server regarding raiding. We can do better than this. We can do better than forcing the staff to come up with a slew of seriously ridiculous, arbitrary rulesets to safeguard an illusionary form of competition between a select few guilds and a large minority of the playerbase.

Everquest wasn't like this. Not on any server I'd played on, nor the server in which I was a guide.

I for one hear more disdain, irritation, and sheer flagrant hatred come from the current system than I do positives on how things are running.

Do we want better? Do the players on this server deserve better? Can't we do better than this?

I think we can.

[Bazia]

everyone who didn't buy multiple accounts to park at multiple targets when it was allowed is pretty much fucked

sorry future p99er's you will never be able to compete

[Autotune]

Nice try, Obama.

[Gimp]

I still don't see what could possibly be fun about getting batphoned at 3am to log in and kill a mob for the 1,000th time, when you know every single possible drop is either going to someone's 7th alt or going to be sold in EC for plat. How useful can plat possibly be when you literally have an endless amount of it and control the market on 90% of high end items?

I guess some guild's sole purpose on killing mobs these days is to cockblock what they would consider "lower" guilds from progressing and closing the gear gap pre-Velious. I could be wrong, but from my very limited time on this server, this seems to be the only logical reasoning.

[gotrocks]

This is actually a nice, well thought out post, with one glaringly obvious flaw...

What do you propose be done about the raiding scene on p99?

[Autotune]

Originally Posted by Gimp [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I still don't see what could possibly be fun about getting batphoned at 3am to log in and kill a mob for the 1,000th time, when you know every single possible drop is either going to someone's 7th alt or going to be sold in EC for plat. How useful can plat possibly be when you literally have an endless amount of it and control the market on 90% of high end items?

I guess some guild's sole purpose on killing mobs these days is to cockblock what they would consider "lower" guilds from progressing and closing the gear gap pre-Velious. I could be wrong, but from my very limited time on this server, this seems to be the only logical reasoning.

This person only thinks of loot.

[Tasslehofp99]

Good post, unfortunately you're right about the raiding scene on p99.

There are many flaws which remain a part of the raid scene for whatever reason or another. I for one have tried to bring it to the attention of players and staff many times and the only thing that came of it was harassment from players who are in competing guilds. If you try to point out inconsistencies or flaws in the server and ruffle the wrong feathers in the process you will be shunned. Hopefully a new p99 server comes out 5 years from now and all the assholes who've ruined p99 1.0 die in a fire before it opens.


I'm not ready to give up on p99 but if training/raid interference and other generally shitty antics are still allowed come velious release I will probably end up quitting (I assume many others will as well) everquest for good. Shit like that is not why I came back to re-experience everquest and is not a classic representation of eq at all when it goes unenforced.

The illusion of competition you speak of though, its real competition...just not a fair one as you stated. The top guild tries to legitimize the competition by making it seem as if anyone is even interested in stooping to the level that is required to "compete" with them. The reality though is only the top guild gives a fuck about raiding because the rest of us are sick of being trained/harassed/stalked by them and tired of seeing the rules broken and no repercussions. If the raiding rules on p99 were enforced fairly and there was a legit PNP (by that I mean one that applied to all players and not just a select few like the current PNP) the raiding scene might not be so bad.

What do you expect on a server that allows guilds to train other guilds on purpose and allows people to exploit ip exemptions, though?

[Tasslehofp99]

Originally Posted by gotrocks [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This is actually a nice, well thought out post, with one glaringly obvious flaw...

What do you propose be done about the raiding scene on p99?

Proposals have been made by many in the past and were mostly met with extreme sarcasm.

Did you know there was a "raiding guild summit" where the gms and representatives from each raiding guild tried to discuss solutions?

Did you know that the only guild against reforming the raid scene is the one currently monopolizing most of the content?

Did you know their only concern was, and I quote, "whens velious"? .... and that is how the last attempt at fixing the raid scene ended.

Its up to the devs&gms to create fair rules for the server and enforce them.


What we have here is more like a wild west, mad max type lf scenario.

You seem to be under the impression that no attempts have been made to fix things in the past, that is not true.

[Eccezan]

OP and Tasslehoff also think that limited targeted attacks on Syria will be good for the U.S.

[gotrocks]

Originally Posted by Tasslehofp99 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Proposals have been made by many in the past and were mostly met with extreme sarcasm.

Did you know there was a "raiding guild summit" where the gms and representatives from each raiding guild tried to discuss solutions?

Did you know that the only guild against reforming the raid scene is the one currently monopolizing most of the content?

Did you know their only concern was, and I quote, "whens velious"? .... and that is how the last attempt at fixing the raid scene ended.

Its up to the devs&gms to create fair rules for the server and enforce them.


What we have here is more like a wild west, mad max type lf scenario.

You seem to be under the impression that no attempts have been made to fix things in the past, that is not true.

i am aware of all of this.

simulated patch days for server repops, variance, server rotation, etc.

These are all good suggestions, but I don't see an earth shatteringly clear solution here that will fix the p99 raid scene. Tasslehof, don't get me wrong - i'm not trying to say attempts haven't been made. And i'm not someone who has ever harassed you for attempting to find a solution, i'm just pointing out that this really is a well thought out and likely heartfelt post - but there's still no answer here, because there isn't an easy answer.

And i don't have one either.