Has anyone documented the maximum damage caps per class?

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Jimjam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

When I say attack doesn’t increase your hit values, i’m not talking about chance to hit.

I mean the 20 sided die has a different amount of damage on each face. Attack doesn’t increase the number on any of these faces. Instead it makes the faces with the larger numbers more likely to be rolled (ie weights the dice, ie ie more likely to hit closer to max).

That was my understanding at least, but from like pop+ era based on Yoda’s parses. Perhaps it is different here/in this era.

This is my current understanding of how it works:

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Attack does increase your max damage values. When you say "weight the dice", what you are referring to is the combination of your damage range and the maximum damage cap.

If your damage range is 1-100 and your maximum damage cap is 84, you have more of a chance of getting an 84, because the cap occurs as the LAST step. This means you can still roll a 100, it just becomes an 84. So you have a 16% chance to roll an 84 , instead of a 1% chance to roll a 100 if your maximum damage cap was 100.

[Vivitron]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Oh I see. What I meant was that even when I got +100 attack, I was still only hitting for 84, which was reinforcing the evidence to show that there is a maximum damage cap. On my Shadowknight getting +Attack from Aura of Battle, Grim Aura, and Firefist is increasing my max damage. Without 2x Aura of Battles, Grim Aura, and Firefist I hit for 124 max with a 25 damage weapon. I hit for 132 with a 25 damage weapon with 2x Aura of Battles, Grim Aura, and Firefist.

I was saying +Attack doesn't increase chance to hit.

Interesting with the sk and attack, I get what you're saying now.

I think you must be right about a class specific element as well: according to the wiki bards and rogues have the same piercing and offense caps.

[Vivitron]

Although according to this bards and rogues are supposed to be on the same damage table after Oct 2001, so perhaps the difference in max hit between them with the same damage weapon is a bug.

[messiah_b]

I know that the P99 code is branched from this and not public, but curiously there is a very familiar number in a custom damage cap for shaman listed in the public code as part of a section supporting hard-coded class based caps.

Line 1303: https://github.com/EQEmu/Server/blob...one/attack.cpp

else if (level >= 40) {
switch (GetClass()) {
case CLERIC:
case DRUID:
case SHAMAN:
cap = 80;
break;

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by messiah_b [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I know that the P99 code is branched from this and not public, but curiously there is a very familiar number in a custom damage cap for shaman listed in the public code as part of a section supporting hard-coded class based caps.

Line 1303: https://github.com/EQEmu/Server/blob...one/attack.cpp

else if (level >= 40) {
switch (GetClass()) {
case CLERIC:
case DRUID:
case SHAMAN:
cap = 80;
break;

Glad to see someone else is looking at the code! I believe that is the WEAPON damage caps, not the MAXIMUM damage caps. on P99 at least, the MAXIMUM damage cap seems to be based on weapon damage. For Shamans it looks like 4.2 MAXIMUM damage per 1 WEAPON damage. This is why I can only hit for 63 with a 15 damage weapon. If 80 was the static MAXIMUM damage, I should be hitting higher than 63 with a 15 damage weapon with 255 STR and Avatar.

[radbeard]

Of course there is a maximum damage, because stats only get so high. I think probably that is what you are seeing.

I don't see anywhere that +ATK increases maximum damage. +ATK decreases the effectiveness of the target AC so that on average you roll higher damage numbers, but doesn't increase the max damage.

It also seems possible that over 200 strength more strength is half as effective at increasing the damage mod.

When you plug those numbers in you get damage values very very close to what you're suggesting here. Probably we could work it out exactly if you posted the exact stats and buffs and did a long-ish parse on some low level mobs. Your SK magelo, for example, doesn't have max str and thats with a +25 STR stat 2hander. So in an earlier post I don't know what 25 damage weapon you referenced but are you sure you were at max str with it and attacking a mob that had low-ish ac (the low AC won't increase the max it will just make you see the max more often so it takes less time to establish)?

Below is what I think you would expect to see as the max damage for a 25 DMG 1-hander used by different classes with max stats assuming STR is half as effective over 200.

This same formula suggests you should be able to hit for 64 with a 15 damage weapon as a shaman. So maybe you could hit for 1 higher potentially (easier to parse this on a lower AC target) or maybe its how rounding is handled somewhere in the code, but its a very similar result. The +ATK from Avatar should not increase your cap, just increase your average.

Mod Formula: ((Off_Skill+Str(Cap200)+(Str_Over_200/2))/100) = MOD
Max Damage Formula: (MOD*WPN_DMG)+DMG_Bonus

Str over cap below is just 55 strength divided by 2, to account for a softcap.
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[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by radbeard [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Of course there is a maximum damage, because stats only get so high. I think probably that is what you are seeing.

I don't see anywhere that +ATK increases maximum damage. +ATK decreases the effectiveness of the target AC so that on average you roll higher damage numbers, but doesn't increase the max damage.

It also seems possible that over 200 strength more strength is half as effective at increasing the damage mod.

When you plug those numbers in you get damage values very very close to what you're suggesting here. Probably we could work it out exactly if you posted the exact stats and buffs and did a long-ish parse on some low level mobs. Your SK magelo, for example, doesn't have max str and thats with a +25 STR stat 2hander. So in an earlier post I don't know what 25 damage weapon you referenced but are you sure you were at max str with it and attacking a mob that had low-ish ac (the low AC won't increase the max it will just make you see the max more often so it takes less time to establish)?

Below is what I think you would expect to see as the max damage for a 25 DMG 1-hander used by different classes with max stats assuming STR is half as effective over 200.

This same formula suggests you should be able to hit for 64 with a 15 damage weapon as a shaman. So maybe you could hit for 1 higher potentially (easier to parse this on a lower AC target) or maybe its how rounding is handled somewhere in the code, but its a very similar result. The +ATK from Avatar should not increase your cap, just increase your average.

Mod Formula: ((Off_Skill+Str(Cap200)+(Str_Over_200/2))/100) = MOD
Max Damage Formula: (MOD*WPN_DMG)+DMG_Bonus

Str over cap below is just 55 strength divided by 2, to account for a softcap.
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Ah yes, I didn't mean to sound like I was surprised there was a max damage. All variables have a limit, and the EQEMU code has a max damage as well. I am more interested if the max damage was low enough for melee classes to hit it. For Shaman it is certainly the case.

Based on my testing I am fairly certain +ATK increases max damage. I couldn't hit my old max damage without the +40ish attack, and I didn't change my STR. The 25 damage weapon I was referring to is https://wiki.project1999.com/Eye_of_the_Rigtorgn .

If the max damages are correct from this post https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...d.php?t=415495 , that would suggest a ranger's max damage is more like 6 max damage per 1 weapon damage. The last bit of damage is coming from the 2h bonus probably. That is why Primal hits for a bit more, because the delay is higher.

Originally Posted by Vivitron [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

There's no attack in the formula you suggested above, though. On my bard I seem to get 97 max prime hand with a 16 damage weapon, and 92 prime hand with a 15 damage, regardless of avatar status.

Looking through my logs it looks like rogues are probably hitting 96 with a 15 damage prime hand.

Vivitron's post seems to suggest basically 6 max damage per 1 weapon damage as well for Rogues/Bards. So that may be the case for most melees. But I would be interested to see if people can post higher numbers (not crits, those aren't quite the same).

[radbeard]

There are a bunch of people here saying that +ATK doesn't increase their max damage, and that is what all the formulas I can find say. I think the simplest explanation here is that +ATK doesn't increase your max damage.

You seem to be assuming that isn't true. And maybe you are correct, but if so I think you should do some intentional parses to compare.

Get to max str with zero + ATK items and parse a bit to establish a max attack and then do it again with avatar and/or with +ATK items. And then post the results so we can see exactly what is happening. If it does go up with + ATK items on then try it with +10, +20, +30, +40 gear to see if it stops going up.

The next thing to do would be to get well below max str and only use +ATK items and compare the same low strength with and w/o + ATK items. This would side-step your theory about a damage cap since the low str would keep you under it.

[meathook]

Yeah, there is a max damage, but most people wont reach it. On my monk at some point stacking STR + AOB + Avatar I capped my max hit and adding additional AOB / +ATK items didnt matter.

If your toon is stacked on ATK items/buffs, you can easily see this by having someone sit, hitting them, and then adding/subtracting +ATK gear and still hitting for the same max dmg.

That doesnt mean your average dmg wont continue to increase. I have no proof it does or it doesnt cause that was a parse I didnt want to do. I just know at a certain point your max dmg caps.

[magnetaress]

if u want to hit hard don't roll a caster