Clickie Changes Invalidate some Server First Achievements

[Baler]

With the recent clickie changes some of which add cast time to clickies. Some of the accomplishments achieved such as server firsts are invalid due to this changing the goal line for future achievements.

So before you reply with mad face hear me out. Whether clickies were or were not used in server first achievements does not change the fact that the finish line for these achievements has just been pushed back.

I hope some level headed people can understand the dangerous precedent that occures when these major changes happen mid server progress. It affects the entire future of how players will go about completing server firsts or it can even make it impossible for some due to the changes.

If the finish line keeps getting moved mid progression how can any accomplishment be validated.

This is NOT a rants and flames thread.

[Cen]

I am a little confused about this because the server firsts don't compete with each other across servers or across specific achievements?

Like, how does the fact that innoruuk goes down longer then cazic thule make a difference? etc

[Baler]

Originally Posted by Cen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I am a little confused about this because the server firsts don't compete with each other across servers or across specific achievements?

Like, how does the fact that innoruuk goes down longer then cazic thule make a difference? etc

Neither of those are what I'm trying to address. re-read the OP
I'm not comparing different servers or different targets.

However I can see how you got that misinterpretation when you only read the first sentence of the OP
To more directly answer you with an example, green server first vox is incomparable to a green server first vox post clickie change.

I know some people will struggle to wrap their heads around what I'm saying here. And the childish replies will come eventually..
But there is legitimacy to what im saying.

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How can an achievement be valid when the finish line is being moved.
If it was moved by say classic mechanics than that is acceptable. But for staff to decide that the finish line is now further away is invalidating people's achievements.

The clickie change should have happened at green launch. They knew players used these items. Changing it mid progress invalidates the efforts of both the winners and 'losers' of achievements.
To find a middle ground, If they didn't do it at launch. It would have been better if it happened right before kunark rather than Mid-Classic progression.

No i'm not crying about the specific's of the clickie change, rather the effects it plays on the server and how achievements are now invalid due to the decision.

[Cen]

Originally Posted by Baler [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Neither of those are what I'm trying to address. re-read the OP
I'm not comparing different servers or different targets.

However I can see how you got that misinterpretation when you only read the first sentence of the OP
To more directly answer you with an example, green server first vox is incomparable to a green server first vox post clickie change.

I know some people will struggle to wrap their heads around what I'm saying here. And the childish replies will come eventually..
But there is legitimacy to what im saying.

---
How can an achievement be valid when the finish line is being moved.

No man I still don't actually get it. Rephrase or something, I think my brain is fried today. How do you get first if the first already happened?

Ive never been on a raid in any online game so maybe there is terminology I don't get. I assumed it was the yellow text achievement thing

[Baler]

Originally Posted by Cen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No man I still don't actually get it. Rephrase or something, I think my brain is fried today. How do you get first if the first already happened?

Ive never been on a raid in any online game so maybe there is terminology I don't get. I assumed it was the yellow text achievement thing

Let's say you're playing a game with a really strong character build. You do all the content and get awarded the title of finishing all content first. Then the staff say oh that build is too strong so they nerf it. Now your build can't do all that content. You'd of never been able to complete all that content with that build. Your title of finishing all content first is invalid.

The staff decided to change the finish line for that title. It wasn't a part of the pre-planned game design. The finish line getting moved forwards or backwards affects the significance of that title. In this case it's invalidating the achievement.

note: I'm speaking of a hypothetical staff not the p99 staff in this post

edit: I can understand how some may say 'Oh well it's already happened can't change history'. And people on my side of the topic will say it's changed the ease/difficult of that achievement enough to warrant that the legitimacy of it's completion in the past is invalid.

[Cen]

Gotcha. Actually, I think you've made me realize that the perception of achievements are a little different between folks. I was viewing them as a race to a first goal, not a content difficulty type achievement.

There's actually some real life examples I know of that are legit races like triathlons and ironmen races and OCR type events where in the next years the actual events are significantly harder, but you get the same awards. Now to be fair, in the next years awards, your in competition only with people from that year, but medals and trophies aren't taken away when it gets harder. Likewise, since a different green server will happen in the future, the goals will be different then, since they will probably can those wands right out of the gate.

I mean i'm not worried about it but if you were shooting for something coming out soon with the wands, I guess it makes sense to feel unfair about it.

[Tethler]

I mean, sure the firsts would certainly have occurred at different times without the use of clickies. But also, who cares? Achievements on an old ass emulator don't mean anything.

[ChooChoo Train]

Server first raid kills were just bind rushed I thought? Clickies would have zero effect on the outcome. Wands which could effect leveling speed probably weren’t farmed til after server first 50s. Maybe clickies effected a couple of server first items from camp mobs on solo/group content? You just seem upset you didn’t get enough server firsts and want to claim more via convincing people of your skewed logic. Hate and Solro soon that’s where you’ll get that yellow text fix.

[Baler]

Originally Posted by ChooChoo Train [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You just seem upset you didn’t get enough server firsts and want to claim more via convincing people of your skewed logic.

Our first troll post, I didn't get any server firsts. I didn't want any and didn't try to get any. Not even a good attempt at discrediting my post.

[drdrakes]

Originally Posted by Baler [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Our first troll post, I didn't get any server firsts. I didn't want any and didn't try to get any. Not even a good attempt at discrediting my post.

You were the first person on my ignore list =)