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  #11  
Old 01-15-2022, 10:34 PM
unsunghero unsunghero is offline
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Originally Posted by Gravydoo II [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
It was submitted as evidence in court, the fake documents.
Yes interrogations are evidence used in court. That’s why they have to tell you this ahead of time (all countries) and offer you a lawyer if you don’t have or cannot afford one
  #12  
Old 01-15-2022, 10:47 PM
unsunghero unsunghero is offline
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I’ve learned a lot about police stops as well. Police are allowed to stop you and ask you questions at any time, regardless of whether you are appearing to be breaking any laws or not. They can, for example, ask you if you were a witness to a crime they are investigating that has nothing to do with you

While they are allowed to ask you, you are NOT under any legal obligation to answer, and your refusal to answer cannot be legally proven as “obstructing”. The only circumstance where you are legally required to provide an answer or otherwise be considered as obstructing, is if the cop says to YOU in a clear manner, that they have evidence or suspicion that you have committed or are committing a crime

So an example, a cop can ask you if you happened to see a mugging that took place 2 houses down from you yesterday. You can respond “I don’t need to answer you pigs”. Your insult is legally protected speech, you can also not be charged (legally and fairly although it could still happen lol) with disorderly conduct for that. Normally disorderly conduct is words or behaviors which pose a disruption or danger to the public, something like that

There is a certain degree of insulting communication which crosses into “fighting words”, which is an actual legal term (bet you didn’t know that). If the insulting communication seems to be with the intent to provoke a physical confrontation with the cop, or an extreme threat to the cop, then that is no longer first amendment protected speech. So for example, you couldn’t say something like “fight me you fucking coward ass pig”. Or something like “I’m going to kill your children”. But you don’t have to answer, and yes you are legally allowed to be rude to and to insult the cop (not recommended though)

But back to the other scenario. Let’s say the cop says “we had a home broken into near yours yesterday, and your truck matches the description witnesses gave of the one leaving, I have some questions for you”. The cop had communicated suspicion that you have committed a crime, now you ARE legally required to answer his questions, or else you are legally obstructing an investigation and could be charged. I do not think that requesting your or any lawyer before answering is considered obstruction, but I believe they can detain you at that point until a lawyer is provided. I’d have to look into that

One thing you can check is by asking if you are being detained or if you are free to leave. A cop is not allowed to detain you unless under that circumstance I detailed above. And they also are not legally allowed to detain you longer than seems reasonably necessary for the investigation. So if you piss the cop off and he makes you stand at street corner not answering questions but not allowed to leave just generally wasting your time, he could get in trouble for that

Anyway, that’s it off the top of my head
  #13  
Old 01-15-2022, 10:57 PM
Elizondo Elizondo is offline
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Originally Posted by Gravydoo II [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
It was submitted as evidence in court, the fake documents.
They submitted them as actual dna evidence?

Quote in your article where it says that. Everything in your own link indicates it was an interrogation strategy to get a confession dude. You should re title this thread to "police lie to get confessions during interrogations' which should surprise nobody
  #14  
Old 01-15-2022, 11:12 PM
Gravydoo II Gravydoo II is offline
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Read it yourself, retard. I'm not your fucking book keeper.

It was used in court to convict someone. This is just what we know about.

need your mommy to cut the outside off the bread too??
  #15  
Old 01-15-2022, 11:12 PM
unsunghero unsunghero is offline
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If anyone wants to see an officer get taken to school, here’s an example

There are people who know everything there is to know about local law, and as a hobby they deliberately create and film confrontations with cops, hoping the cop will fuck up

This is an example of a frustrated cop in over his head with someone who knows more than him. Gravy would probably get a kick out of this. I think the kid is a dick, but he completely gets the upper hand on the cop and takes him to school

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=
  #16  
Old 01-15-2022, 11:34 PM
Patriam1066 Patriam1066 is offline
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Originally Posted by Elizondo [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Perfectly legal

it's an interrogation. Not evidence being submitted in court.
Yes, and it’s perfectly legal to give poor people under qualified public defenders. And yet it isn’t right and undermines the reasons we participate in a democracy instead of other forms of government
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  #17  
Old 01-15-2022, 11:56 PM
Elizondo Elizondo is offline
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Originally Posted by Gravydoo II [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Read it yourself, retard. I'm not your fucking book keeper.

It was used in court to convict someone. This is just what we know about.

need your mommy to cut the outside off the bread too??
Who was convicted by this department using some fake dna evidence?

name?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Patriam1066 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Yes, and it’s perfectly legal to give poor people under qualified public defenders. And yet it isn’t right and undermines the reasons we participate in a democracy instead of other forms of government
You have the right to remain silent
  #18  
Old 01-16-2022, 12:08 AM
unsunghero unsunghero is offline
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Well, to a point you have the right to remain silent. If you are being interrogated, that means there is already suspicion of you committing a crime. While you can’t be forced to talk (how can anyone force someone to talk, other than maybe actual torture), I think using the coaching of a lawyer to provide explanations and a defense is going to be generally more helpful than staying silent forever. What you say can be used against you, but it can also be used to help you via a judge or jury, especially if you are innocent

But I also don’t see how fake DNA or some other fake evidence could be used to convict someone. Fake evidence can only legally be used to get a confession (in the USA) as far as I know. So if it happened, it doesn’t seem legal or ethical to me

In regards to under qualified public defenders, they still have to pass the bar exam. I’m sure there’s some sort of continual certification requirements. I dunno for lawyers, but as a doctor you can’t just get your MD and sit on your ass not learning anything new for the rest of your career. If you don’t keep up with something like “continuing credits” (I forget the term, basically keeping up with the latest information in medicine as like mini-college courses), then you lose your license to practice. I’m sure law is similar, but could be wrong. So someone shouldn’t be able to stay under qualified forever. But again, not an expert in knowing law
  #19  
Old 01-16-2022, 12:18 AM
Elizondo Elizondo is offline
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Originally Posted by unsunghero [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
If anyone wants to see an officer get taken to school, here’s an example

There are people who know everything there is to know about local law, and as a hobby they deliberately create and film confrontations with cops, hoping the cop will fuck up

This is an example of a frustrated cop in over his head with someone who knows more than him. Gravy would probably get a kick out of this. I think the kid is a dick, but he completely gets the upper hand on the cop and takes him to school
That's my point. Folks need to understand their rights. Even during an interrogation you can get up and leave at any time unless you are being formally detained. If a cop questions you, ask them straight up if you are being detained. If they say no, walk away. You don't have to answer their questions. Not even in an interrogation room after being arrested. Remain silent. It's one of the most powerful rights you have.

Cops can lie their asses off. It's perfectly legal. They want to build up a smoke screen and apply pressure to coerce you into giving them evidence such as a confession. if they actually tried to submit some bogus dna report to a court of law with obvious photoshopped stamps on them to get a conviction, even a court appointed attorney is competent enough to expose that. At some point in the appeals process if it actually led to a conviction it would be exposed.

Quote:
Originally Posted by unsunghero [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Well, to a point you have the right to remain silent. If you are being interrogated, that means there is already suspicion of you committing a crime. While you can’t be forced to talk (how can anyone force someone to talk, other than maybe actual torture), I think using the coaching of a lawyer to provide explanations and a defense is going to be generally more helpful than staying silent forever.
No man

you never say a word. period. That's the lawyers job.
  #20  
Old 01-16-2022, 12:26 AM
Homesteaded Homesteaded is offline
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Originally Posted by Patriam1066 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]
Yes, and it’s perfectly legal to give poor people under qualified public defenders. And yet it isn’t right and undermines the reasons we participate in a democracy instead of other forms of government
What's the alternative? No lawyers? One lawyer per citizen? You're doing a great disservice to the public attorneys. Typical from you, out of touch with reality.
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