Game Mechanics: AoE spells should only hit limited targets until September 1999 patch era - Page 4

Dolalin · #31 09-26-2019, 04:36 AM

Shaman's 24th aoe is a rain spell. It would never hit more than 3 targets per rain pulse, in any era that I'm aware of.

Vyal · #32 09-26-2019, 05:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMN [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Maybe they were exaggerating for effect? I doubt there are even 45+ tadpole spawns in the swamp, doubly so with the troll/ogre newbies running around killing them. 3 pulses of damage would be 12 dead tadpoles per cast, probably spectacular enough to boast a bit for a newb. He also says "spells", plural, when he only got one at 24. Also, "at one time" is a phrase one can take some liberties with, and it even makes more sense why he would choose to use "spells", since it could mean he cast multiple.

Edit:
For those who don't want to read through, it's some old blog/diary of an EQ player, he/she writes:

5/18/99

. . . After hitting 24th I promptly purchased my new spells, and gathered together every froglok tadpole in the land into one nice big group, laughed as they tried to nibble me as they did oh so not long ago, and basked in the light of self satisfaction watching all 46 of them die at one time to the new improved area effect spells.

froglok tads are level 1 so obviously that isn't what the guy was talking about. If you read his review you can tell how he is. And 46 is a very specific number. 50, 40, 30, dozens, those are numbers you use when you exaggerate.

If you read his review and get past the way he is you'll see it's informative and the guy knew his stuff.

Not only can you see it there but you can ask ANYBODY who remembers playing Everquest when it released and we'll all tell you AoE spells had no limits.

Also this Kendrick guys comment the one dude keeps linking back to was fired and clearly had no idea how to play EQ if you take the time to read anything he posted not only that but he wasn't even part of the original crew. So basing everything on the words of someone who wasn't even part of the developer team at the time and didn't know how to play at all is just... [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

5/18/99 A guy named Ron uses AoE on many mobs.

2001 AoE groups in Seb and mentions of previous Chardok groups, highly possible people were doing these much more than anybody previously thought.
https://www.graffe.com/forums/showthread.php?6048/page
"Lucky? If done right you can pull chef/bar and everything in between to D2, all this with 3 wizards/1 chanter/1 cleric/1 SK. The only real limiting factor is the newbness of the people you are working with, not the classes you have!"

Jun 20, 1999
http://twilight.uh-oh.jp/eq/tips/b_song.html
"It is a dissonant music that damages a certain range around you. I can't imagine how to use it clearly. The price is not so high, but I don't think you need to buy it. The only way to say how to use it is to attract a monster to yourself or to take a Yokozuna sumo to help someone who has trained in BB or other places."

Vyal · #33 09-26-2019, 06:07 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dolalin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Shaman's 24th aoe is a rain spell. It would never hit more than 3 targets per rain pulse, in any era that I'm aware of.

Wrong.

Classic AoE on video even. This guild only existed from 1999 - 2002
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BUHDRz1Iv_U

You keep trying to justify mob limits and changing how AoE works because you're afraid of bards or seeing everyone get zoomed but none of this is how the game actually worked.

DMN · #34 09-26-2019, 07:06 AM

Kendrick and Kalaran were largely consider the most knowledgeable players for their classes back in the day and (some might even say the game in general). Other than azmodeus those two were the only players virtually everyone knew/heard of back in the day. You really couldn't pick a worse person to dismiss as some ignoramus.

And your video about AoEing on povar... did you see where they are? We are talking about early classic, usually called "vanilla". hence not including kunark and beyond.

And the one dude clearly says improved spellS, despite only having one at 24. That gives the impression he may have cast multiple.

Dolalin · #35 09-26-2019, 07:08 AM

I'm done humoring Vyal, it's time to just dismiss him as a troll with an agenda. Because that's what he is.

Vyal · #36 09-26-2019, 07:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMN [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Kendrick and Kalaran were largely consider the most knowledgeable players for their classes back in the day and (some might even say the game in general). Other than azmodeus those two were the only players virtually everyone knew/heard of back in the day. You really couldn't pick a worse person to dismiss as some ignoramus.

And your video about AoEing on povar... did you see where they are? We are talking about early classic, usually called "vanilla". hence not including kunark.

And the one dude clearly says improved spellS, despite only having one at 24. That gives the impression he may have cast multiple.

This Kendrick person doesn't seem to know anything and everything linking back to him I have seen is wrong. Plus he wasn't part of the EQ team then either and got fired after he did become part of it.

There is nothing to mass AoE like that pre Kunark anyhow it's just to difficult to get any good pulls in the original dungeons trust me I have tried to pull everything.

When the game first came out there was no limit to AoE spells this much I am absolutely sure of and I have shown evidence dating back to a month after release confirming this.

And it reads from the bottom up.

"And what of those changes. I have taken a look at some of the big name EQ sites lately, the best one one being the site at www.gameznet.com/eq/ If any of you now big time EQ players have not taken a look at the site, I encourage you to do so. However, as informative that the site is, they fail to really get a lot of the details on things that actually mean something, and seem to rely on information sent to them by others. I am planning on doing something somewhat like they do, but based more upon my experiences and what I have encountered or accomplished first hand, and do so in a way that only I can muster. Entertaining yet informative. That's my goal."

waybackmachine for www.gameznet.com/eq/

Poison Storm
This is an area effect poison attack.
https://web.archive.org/web/19991111...ls/shaman.html

https://web.archive.org/web/19991111...ells/bard.html

Fire Flux
Fire flux is an area effect spell based on the caster. That means that this spell will damage all monsters in the immediate area of the caster.
https://web.archive.org/web/19990508.../magician.html

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You can't keep ignoring the fact that everyone including some of the biggest EQ websites of the time all say exactly how AoE worked. They do not say there is a limit to the number of mobs a spell can hit and they don't say that because there was never any limit to AoE.

DMN · #37 09-26-2019, 07:47 AM

1. Pre-kunark I never saw a bard kiting more than 3-4 mobs.
2. Pre-kunark I never saw a single bard talking about swarm kiting for than 3-4 mobs either
3. I kept close track of the first level 50s on most servers and don't ever recall a bard being first. (was virtually always a necro or a druid, or something like a "guild cleric" being played 24-7 by 3-4 different people.)
4. The more knowledgeable bards did use a much more complicated way to get exp fast on a bard, which involved kiting 3-4 mobs and mixing up charming and having them beat each other, similar to how necro/enchanters charm-kill stuff. Why would they resort to this much more complicated scheme if they could simply swarm kite?

Vyal · #38 09-26-2019, 08:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DMN [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

1. Pre-kunark I never saw a bard kiting more than 3-4 mobs.
2. Pre-kunark I never saw a single bard talking about swarm kiting for than 3-4 mobs either
3. I kept close track of the first level 50s on most servers and don't ever recall a bard being first. (was virtually always a necro or a druid, or something like a "guild cleric" being played 24-7 by 3-4 different people.)
4. The more knowledgeable bards did use a much more complicated way to get exp fast on a bard, which involved kiting 3-4 mobs and mixing up charming and having them beat each other, similar to how necro/enchanters charm-kill stuff. Why would they resort to this much more complicated scheme if they could simply swarm kite?

What server were you on and what was your character name then?

There wasn't many bards on Sol Ro I hardly remember any at all in the early days.

Also pre-Kunark bards hit a huge wall once they hit 25 or so not only do they fall off hard because there isn't many mobs to kite but it's ruff to get a group.

Bards can only really start kiting huge groups of mobs and keep leveling fast once Kunark comes out.

Can you find any pictures of a bard only kiting 4 mobs because I can't and for that matter I can't find any pictures of a bard kiting anything.

Dolalin · #39 09-26-2019, 08:08 AM

Don't feed the troll. He has nothing useful to add.

Jibartik · #40 09-26-2019, 08:31 AM

I think it is up to Vyal to find a dated screenshot of an AOE hitting more than 4 creatures. At this point the evidence greatly outweighs the contrary evidence.

He has discredited newsgroups and patch notes, and supplied an edgelord blog as "proof!"

I usually support all EQ fans but vyal is off his rocker. I would love to know the truth, but vyal I do not stand behind your arguments at all. Maybe if you reduced your post count by 90% and spent that time researching and finding a NEW link to defend your arguments, I might start thinking you're contributing.

But what you're doing now is the opposite of contributing.