New Lodizal Agreement Proposal

[Kich867]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

FWIW I did the click fest once. And by "once", I mean I sat there for two entire hours, clicking constantly, and Lodi didn't show up, so I came back and clicked constantly for another two hours ... and he still didn't spawn. At that point I decided "let the six Dawn Believers (all of whom had been presumably sitting there clicking constantly for four hours) have it."

It was gross, and I will likely never do it again (if only because my wrists just can't take that RSI!) It's not classic, it's not good for anyone (I can't imagine even the Dawn Believer folks enjoyed it), and I think just about any replacement whatsoever would be better.

I've never been involved in much of the raid scene, what about that isn't classic though? How did the spawn work on live? Just wondering, seen so much discussion about this mob over the years.

[Baler]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

FWIW I did the click fest once. And by "once", I mean I sat there for two entire hours, clicking constantly, and Lodi didn't show up, so I came back and clicked constantly for another two hours ... and he still didn't spawn. At that point I decided "let the six Dawn Believers (all of whom had been presumably sitting there clicking constantly for four hours) have it."

It was gross, and I will likely never do it again (if only because my wrists just can't take that RSI!) It's not classic, it's not good for anyone (I can't imagine even the Dawn Believer folks enjoyed it), and I think just about any replacement whatsoever would be better.

Kunark and Velious didn't last for years,
It wasn't the titanium client,
There was no p99 wiki.

Classic? My argument with this post is unfair I'll admit but.. not classic.. Welcome to Project 1999 blue.

A more proactive use of time regarding lodizal would be to prepare ideas for solving this problem on green. Which may, sadly, be /list

I know for a fact that shady goblin & the dwarf in EW agreements are rooted with certain players who had stakes/interests in those mobs. Not average players who just want a shot at a mob. The oll politician bait and switch routine. Oh yeah an agreement can work, especially when the deck is favorably stacked.

What's the most classic is no player agreement for lodizal.

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If an agreement is really generated. All the members of the council that design the agreement need to Vetted thoroughly for their interests.

[loramin]

Originally Posted by Kich867 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I've never been involved in much of the raid scene, what about that isn't classic though? How did the spawn work on live? Just wondering, seen so much discussion about this mob over the years.

Basically just what everyone else has been saying: no one knew exactly where or when Lodi was going to spawn. If you wanted Lodi ... or many other "mysterious" mobs back then (eg. Quillmane, South Ro AC, etc.) ... you just hung out in the zone they were in, in the general area people had seen the mob, preferably with a Ranger friend to help you track ... and hoped for it to appear. Any system where everyone waits at a single spot and then "competes" for Lodi is really nothing like what people were doing back in 2001.

In that sense, I think making Lodi have random spawn points, have a (far) more random timer, or otherwise making him impossible to camp, would be a very "classic" solution, as it would get people to play the game of 2001, not the game of 2020.

An automated GMing solution would be classic in a different way: it'd be more about "we are playing this game with 2020 knowledge, and we're not going to try and fix that, but we want a fair way to share Lodi between everyone who wants him." If two people did get in a fight over Lodi back in the day, the GMs would have resolved that fight (ultimately with a random roll: see Velious GM Guidelines ... or the similar, and better formatted Kunark GM Guildelines). /list would be classic in the sense that it provides similar "fair resolution of a contested mob" ... but since we don't have paid GMs it would use "automated GMing", which is the next best thing we can have here.

Ultimately which "fix" is better comes down to how the staff wants to pursue "classic" (sacrifice classic mechanics for a more classic environment, or vice versa) ... but either approach would be significantly closer to what people did in 2001 vs. clicking a screen for two hours solid here.

[Kirdan]

I like the suggestion that Lodizal gets the Guardian Kozz treatment and spawns somewhere randomly on his path instead of the same dirty, Robthe-stained spot.

[loramin]

Originally Posted by Baler [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Kunark and Velious didn't last for years,
It wasn't the titanium client,
There was no p99 wiki.

Classic? My argument with this post is unfair I'll admit but.. not classic.. Welcome to Project 1999 blue.

I'm sorry Baler, I think that's a terrible argument. Are we going to Luclin, PoP, or LDoN with Blue?

If not, then it's a classic server, and the goal will always be to make it as classic as possible. As "beta Blue", with seven years of Kunark, it can never be perfectly classic ... but that doesn't mean we can't/shouldn't aim for classic (if only, as you suggested, to get it right for Green).

Originally Posted by Baler [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I know for a fact that shady goblin & the dwarf in EW agreements are rooted with certain players who had stakes/interests in those mobs. Not average players who just want a shot at a mob. The oll politician bait and switch routine. Oh yeah an agreement can work, especially when the deck is favorably stacked.

What's with this Illuminati conspiracy nonsense?

I helped forge the Shady Goblin agreement: I was there for every roll (and every failed attempt to get everyone to roll prior), and there were no "certain players who had stakes" ... unless you count me (with my stake being "clickfests suck and I don't want to do one") or the twenty other people whose "stake" was similarly wanting to do the quest, and not wanting to do a clickfest. To the contrary, there were multiple players interested in keeping the clickfest (Siryado being the most notable), and they made it extremely difficult to get the roll started.

Originally Posted by Baler [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What's the most classic is no player agreement for lodizal.

You're basically saying clickfests are classic, and I strongly disagree. In the entire year of 2001 I highly doubt there was ever ... even once ... two (let alone ten) people sitting around at Lodi's spawn point, clicking constantly, for two hours. It simply did not happen in 2001, and there is nothing classic about it except the server mechanics.

Originally Posted by Baler [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

If an agreement is really generated. All the members of the council that design the agreement need to Vetted thoroughly for their interests.

Again with the P99 Illuminati [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] There's no "council" for any agreement, just players trying to make it happen, and their "interests" are that this is a game we all want to play.

By definition here on P99 player agreements require consensus. That means everyone who would have clicked has to agree to roll instead. There is no possible way for "our evil overlords" to force anyone to do anything in that system: the only way an agreement can be forged is if every participant wants it.

[Erati]

Originally Posted by Kirdan [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I like the suggestion that Lodizal gets the Guardian Kozz treatment and spawns somewhere randomly on his path instead of the same dirty, Robthe-stained spot.

it just devolves slowly into pets on each spawn node as theyre plotted and discovered

Kozz needs 20+ more spawn nodes and Lodi should be random all over Iceclad cept the island w the rings.

[Pretzelle]

People racing to the random icebergs for him would be great. Ranger and bard tandems, like racing for Faydedar.

[Baler]

@loramin There is no P99 Illuminati. There are just people who have more information than you and I. How we function is generally irrelevant to them. It's an ecosystem inside an ecosytem.
There are key players in the game and I'm not talking about everquest. And for the tinfoil people, no it has nothing to do with buying or selling.

[Daldolma]

Randomizing his pop points anywhere along his path is not classic. That’s significant interference and changes the nature of the mob to require either massive groups to lock down multiple pop points or a tracker. You’ll still have neckbeards socking the camp during the window.

Just make his pop times totally random with no windows. If people want to sit on the pop point indefinitely without any guarantee that they’ll even see Lodi pop, let them. It sufficiently disincentivizes spawn camping to make it not worth anyone’s time. Especially when you could sit there 48 straight hours only to lose FTE to some dude who lucked out and decided to show up and sit at spawn point for 45 minutes.

[Freakish]

Wait what? People definitely knew about Lodizal cycle on live. I even get my own server RnF thread because of him.

What happened was me + rogue were on ice, knew the window and were checking to see if he would skip. Competition showed up. Lodi spawns, competition wins but we KS. However rogue and I had been there since window opened so in the public eyes of the server we had it legitimately because there is no way to know who got first when you're killing him, and even if they did get first hit we had obviously been camping it.

Nobody was proactively checking logs mid fight to see who got fte. We took the loot, went away and the other group just got laughed at on ezboards when they cried about it. GMs didn't care and 18 hours later we were that much closer to a new expansion and the loot being obsolete.