Seal Team removes ourselves from all player agreements

[Twochain]

Originally Posted by Fammaden [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't think these guilds mind the losing part, or for the most part even mind that they aren't in VP. When they lose outright they chalk it up to inexperience, mistakes, being out manned and out strategized. They give ST their due in that regard.

What they can't stomach, and many didn't expect coming into P99 for green, is that they not only lose most of the time but are never allowed to win either. In P99's raid meta, the dominant guild has a real knack for never accepting defeat even when its handed to them as clear as day when the little guy prevailed for a change. Its always straight to the lawyerquest, fishing for concessions to block the competition out of future attempts.

You know this damn well with your experience. How many times have you been involved in a situation like "we can't contest this mob at this time of day, but we can go pressure Riot with our tiny force and try to make them screw up and give us something to petition"? That's the overriding meta that raid guilds here operate under.

On blue you have two and three entities at a time who are fluent in this back and forth and have played it against each other for years. These green guilds however, they came in and found out that even when David beats Goliath a win is never ever allowed to stand on its merits.

Competitive people pat the opponent on the back and say good game see you next time. Bullies do everything they can to beat your morale down and try to intimidate you to never try again.

So when you see these green dudes saying these things, its not that they hate ST for spending more time or having more people or working harder at being on top. They hate all the effort that goes into rigging the game when they do take a loss. And they weren't prepared to see this coming from outside of the blue raid scene as so many on green have.

I’ll agree that if I was the guild leader of Seal Team, I would 100% give leniency to lesser guilds when it came to the rule book on everything outside of blatant trains. The rules are long and confusing, especially to new raiders. If we’re talking the #2 guild, they should know better and be expected to follow the same rules.

Is the gap between 1 and 2-5 really that big on green??

Geeze, I’ll raid lead trak if someone has a bot account. I’m sure I could find some other seasoned veterans to help out the cause.

[G13]

Originally Posted by getsome [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This guy knows how to hold a grudge.

To quote a great man:

"It is what it is"

[LuffyP99]

How did this thread become about anything except the fact that ST acted like a pathetic child, deleted the UN, welched on their agreements with the other guilds and STOLE ~30 god level targets from guilds who were following the rules that ST agreed to?

It was an absolutely pathetic display and anyone in that guild who isn't ashamed of that is full of shit. It has nothing to do with a GM issued sanction that was out of player hands, or ST being dominant. That's BS anyway, they just have 2-3x as many members as any other guild. Yeah, you want competition. BS, you want to poach all the talented members of the smaller guilds then go on a rant about 'how op' you are. What a joke. I hope they stay banned over a month or dissolve, they lost my respect with these recent actions. There's plenty of good ST members in the guild I am friends with, but if you don't leave a guild after this disgustingly toxic behavior, my opinion of you changes. Not even a public apology or any attempt to make things right to the guild's they completely fucked over, just because they can't win a noble race.

[Twochain]

Originally Posted by LuffyP99 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

How did this thread become about anything except the fact that ST acted like a pathetic child, deleted the UN, welched on their agreements with the other guilds and STOLE ~30 god level targets from guilds who were following the rules that ST agreed to?

It was an absolutely pathetic display and anyone in that guild who isn't ashamed of that is full of shit. It has nothing to do with a GM issued sanction that was out of player hands, or ST being dominant. That's BS anyway, they just have 2-3x as many members as any other guild. Yeah, you want competition. BS, you want to poach all the talented members of the smaller guilds then go on a rant about 'how op' you are. What a joke. I hope they stay banned over a month or dissolve, they lost my respect with these recent actions. There's plenty of good ST members in the guild I am friends with, but if you don't leave a guild after this disgustingly toxic behavior, my opinion of you changes. Not even a public apology or any attempt to make things right to the guild's they completely fucked over, just because they can't win a noble race.

what 30 god tier targets were stolen

[silo32]

GM's killing green the way they did red. I see nothing has changed.

[Albanwr]

I know great people in ST. I have no idea why they have not left yet. I know they don't agree with this shit. I know they know this is all sorts of fucked up. Yet they stay in the guild.

I guess I know what they really are deep down.

[Tunabros]

Originally Posted by Albanwr [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I know great people in ST. I have no idea why they have not left yet. I know they don't agree with this shit. I know they know this is all sorts of fucked up. Yet they stay in the guild.

I guess I know what they really are deep down.

they still can't raid if they leave

[Xer0]

Originally Posted by silo32 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

GM's killing green the way they did red. I see nothing has changed.

red jhas always been completely desolate what are you even talking about lolol

[Larken]

Why isn't anyone at least discussing the one way of settling this never ending mess with some form of PvP? There could be several options, I'm not advocating to copy red99, but after weighin all pros and cons some form of pvp to settle this mess is to me the only logical conclusion. Convince me otherwise please.

Raid zone pvp flagging?
Raid guilds pvp flagging each other, limited only to certain zones adjacent to raid zones?
Have guilds the option to declare war against another guild. For example, a minimum of 3 guilds independent of eachtoerh with x# of members can PvP flag another guild. (In case a guild is being scummy, then other guilds will put them in place)

I mean just consider how different things would be and how much nicer guilds could potentially treat each other. 1 guild being dicks? Well, all the smaller guild join up and take them out to teach them a lesson. It's just a different way of gaming life and sometimes I think you all don't give it a fair chance of consideration but rather just say "look at what a mess red is, therefore pvp doesn't work" - which is a flawed logic IMO.

[Xer0]

Originally Posted by Larken [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Why isn't anyone at least discussing the one way of settling this never ending mess with some form of PvP? There could be several options, I'm not advocating to copy red99, but after weighin all pros and cons some form of pvp to settle this mess is to me the only logical conclusion. Convince me otherwise please.

Raid zone pvp flagging?
Raid guilds pvp flagging each other, limited only to certain zones adjacent to raid zones?
Have guilds the option to declare war against another guild. For example, a minimum of 3 guilds independent of eachtoerh with x# of members can PvP flag another guild. (In case a guild is being scummy, then other guilds will put them in place)

I mean just consider how different things would be and how much nicer guilds could potentially treat each other. 1 guild being dicks? Well, all the smaller guild join up and take them out to teach them a lesson. It's just a different way of gaming life and sometimes I think you all don't give it a fair chance of consideration but rather just say "look at what a mess red is, therefore pvp doesn't work" - which is a flawed logic IMO.

sorry what thread are you taking part in? I've only taken cursory glances at the threads surrounding this situation and red/pvp has been mentioned 5 or 6 times.