FTE Shouts: Rethinking Their Mechanics and Issue

[Tecmos Deception]

Originally Posted by Frieza_Prexus [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The problem of kiting out door dragons is something that's really got me baffled with regards to how to code something to prevent, or at least strongly discourage it.

Make bosses summon at 100%.

[falkun]

Originally Posted by Tecmos Deception [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Make bosses summon at 100%.

I would hate to kill Faydedar in the water, water combat is just not practical. Then add in Fear and Faydedar gets a whole lot more difficult.

[radditsu]

Originally Posted by falkun [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I would hate to kill Faydedar in the water, water combat is just not practical. Then add in Fear and Faydedar gets a whole lot more difficult.

everybody has to do it corinav style imo.

[Splorf22]

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

What are the holes in Xasten's "first to commit" idea we're not seeing?

Well the obvious one is that summoning and the appropriate messages are already coded in, while multiple FTE shouts are not, and may require more coding server side than the simple scripts Nilbog is talking about.

But of course I think Xasten has a reasonable idea as well.

[Frieza_Prexus]

Originally Posted by windo [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Why not just require 15 people (a raid force) on a target's aggro list for FTE and FTE shout?

I considered that. The exact # required to trigger the shout can be tweaked. The point is to force groups to commit. Some mobs like VS and Fay can be done with under 15.

It also occurred to me that this is a far more practical way to achieve the situation the GMs wanted some months back when they desired for you to kill draco on his spawn and not pull him. While this would allow mobs to still be pulled, it is not without risk.

[Anesthia]

Make bosses flag you for PvP.

[kotton05]

I'd like the shout, but what im curious about is...

1. dragon charm, he will shout blah blah has my aggro, charm then reset... will he emote a disengage or what?

2. CT can death touch like 4 people, so even if the first to engage has a shout, he's insta gibbed no longer on aggro list...

3. making 15+ for fte would make us kill fay in water right on spawn pt, hell all the dragons for that matter.

[YendorLootmonkey]

Originally Posted by falkun [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

First to Engage shouts (when implemented) will just remove the GM/CSR from the "FTE argument". Its automating a process that already exists.

As for the most recent example, the shout would have had the added benefit that TMO would have known, without a doubt, that FE had FTE and could have disengaged.

I agree that an FTE shout solves *most* of the issues (i.e. disengaging a raid knowing the opposing force got FTE and letting them sink or swim), however Xasten's solution addresses stall tactics like someone grabbing FTE, confirmed via FTE shout, but then DA tanking for 18 seconds. Or a Donals BP cleric and a warrior stalling for 3-5 minutes on VS until the rest of the raid force can get there/logged in (I suppose a group of 4-5 people can still stall, but this at least ups the ante on the number of people you have to instantly log in to claim VS.)

Either system of automated acknowledgement of rights to the mob is better than what we have now. The strategy/game theory is different when you can't tell who has FTE... Guild A has 15 ppl on Trak, Guild B has 30 ppl on Trak... Guild B has no choice but to engage ASAP, which favors Guild A on a mob they would most likely fail on, because Guild B can't take the chance that Guild A can pull it off with 15.

But if Guild B knew they could disengage and camp aggro after a FTE shout awarded the mob to Guild A, there is a decent chance Guild A will wipe and Guild B will get their shot. So raid encounters become a little bit more about mobilization, even if mobilization here just means "who can log in the fastest at the spawn".

[falkun]

Originally Posted by YendorLootmonkey [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

But if Guild B knew they could disengage and camp aggro after a FTE shout awarded the mob to Guild A, there is a decent chance Guild A will wipe and Guild B will get their shot. So raid encounters become a little bit more about mobilization, even if mobilization here just means "who can log in the fastest at the spawn".

This is granted via the incoming FTE shouts, you won't need FTC shouts for this functionality. I completely agree that Guild_B, once committed, pretty much has to stick on the raid mob currently, pre-FTE shout implementation. I anticipate many more disengages (and likely wipes) following the FTE shout implementation. FTC shouts bring in a bunch of new variables and rules to lawyer and hash out. For instance, guilds may disagree how many bodies represents an engaged force or how long it takes to pull a mob. FTE shouts, an extension/automation of the already existing FTE metric, minimizes additional creation of game mechanics/server rules to govern the player-base.

[porigromus]

Originally Posted by Anesthia [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Make bosses flag you for PvP.

Probably best suggestion right here. Implement this for boss fights and then let the players handle disputes via pvp