Necromancer Decision

[aaezil]

Hahah look at the people who rolled de necro on green flocking to defend their poor choice here.

[Snortles Chortles]

Originally Posted by branamil [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Liking your character is more important than stats. It's an RPG not a math test.

[Baler]

DE Necro only has to be level ~30 to fully complete the reaper quest right?
or minimal level if you get the stuff on your main.

[Vexenu]

Originally Posted by kjs86z [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Lots of bad paper napkin math and flawed logic going on here.

You started with a weak argument and made it worse by providing one very specific vacuum-esque circumstance.

RNG happens. Mistakes are made. Any time your perfect little scenario goes south, Iksar regen cushions the blow and keeps things going. The exp penalty is a moot point. Its just 20% more mobs to kill on your way to 60 which means you'll have more money to blow on your big boy spells.

Also once Necro hits 49 and gets PE, if you're only engaging 2 mobs at a time (pet + 1) you're doing it wrong.

I said flat out my example only applied to charming. I've played both Iksar and non-Iksar Necros. The Iksar is definitely preferable, especially if you can gear him out well (the low INT is very noticeable otherwise). But people seem to imply that Iksar regen is so good that the other races are borderline unplayable. Which is ridiculous. Here are the facts about Necros:

1) Racial regen is hardly noticeable until 50+.
2) Iksar low INT/mana pool is very noticeable until you acquire high-end gear.
3) If you're charming 50-60, regen doesn't much come into play.
4) Regen does provides a noticeable efficiency advantage at high end when not charming.
5) Iksar is the undisputed min/max race.
6) VP Soul Well staff/Zlandicar's Heart/Holgresh Beads/Ring 10 provide high-end options for non-Iksar Necros to be more efficient.
7) There is very little reason to main a Necro anyway if you are a min/max type, endgame-focused player because they are an extremely boring and non-essential raid class for the most part. If you're that concerned about min/maxing, roll a pure melee, Cleric or Wizard and go carry your weight in raids.
8) There is nothing that an Iksar Necro can do that a similarly geared non-Iksar cannot also do.
9) Necro, regardless of race, is still the #1 most versatile, safest and self-sufficient solo class in the game.
10) FashionQuest ultimately rules all, this is an electronic elf simulator with no win condition. If you don't enjoy looking at the character you're sinking hundreds of hours into you're doing it wrong.

[loramin]

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

1) Racial regen is hardly noticeable until 50+.
2) Iksar low INT/mana pool is very noticeable until you acquire high-end gear.
3) If you're charming 50-60, regen doesn't much come into play.
4) Regen does provides a noticeable efficiency advantage at high end when not charming.
5) Iksar is the undisputed min/max race.
6) VP Soul Well staff/Zlandicar's Heart/Holgresh Beads/Ring 10 provide high-end options for non-Iksar Necros to be more efficient.
7) There is very little reason to main a Necro anyway if you are a min/max type, endgame-focused player because they are an extremely boring and non-essential raid class for the most part. If you're that concerned about min/maxing, roll a pure melee, Cleric or Wizard and go carry your weight in raids.
8) There is nothing that an Iksar Necro can do that a similarly geared non-Iksar cannot also do.
9) Necro, regardless of race, is still the #1 most versatile, safest and self-sufficient solo class in the game.
10) FashionQuest ultimately rules all, this is an electronic elf simulator with no win condition. If you don't enjoy looking at the character you're sinking hundreds of hours into you're doing it wrong.

Truth.

[kjs86z]

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

1) Racial regen is hardly noticeable until 50+.
(20-49 its double any other necro race choice and helps offset lich line)

2) Iksar low INT/mana pool is very noticeable until you acquire high-end gear.
(lots of cheap caster options on blue for very little plat)

3) If you're charming 50-60, regen doesn't much come into play.
(what? no)

6) VP Soul Well staff/Zlandicar's Heart/Holgresh Beads/Ring 10 provide high-end options for non-Iksar Necros to be more efficient.
(yeah sure 150k z heart, 400k beads, VP key + boss kills and Ring 10...lots of good options for a leveling necro)

7) There is very little reason to main a Necro anyway if you are a min/max type, endgame-focused player because they are an extremely boring and non-essential raid class for the most part. If you're that concerned about min/maxing, roll a pure melee, Cleric or Wizard and go carry your weight in raids.
(https://youtu.be/pWdd6_ZxX8c)

8) There is nothing that an Iksar Necro can do that a similarly geared non-Iksar cannot also do.
(until you start looking at output over extended durations)

[Philistine]

What motivated me to go Ikky was the knowledge that once I (eventually) hit 60, the xp penalty wouldn't be very relevant, but I'd keep the superior regen forever. With the talk of possible introduction of AA's to blue that math changes - I'm unlikely to ever max AA's, and thus will be paying for my regen forever.

I vote you play what you like - they've all got their ups and downs.

[Tyrant82]

Originally Posted by Endorra [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Edit: I feel that I should point out that, on blue, the most effective necromancer of all time was a gnome. That being said, the sheer amount of gear that he had available is unlikely to be so concentrated on Green due to the timeline constraints. We did farm an awful lot of VP staves and Zlandi hearts on blue that won't be there on green. I still think my evaluation stands.

If we are talking about the same one, the Gnome soloing in Hate or Fear, then i remember him as a good fellow for that time. But the time came and he got banned from P99, Twitch and after those years i even forgot his name [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[7thGate]

Loramin has made the argument before that the XP penalty is more relevant than people give it credit for. Depending on how much you play, this can very much be the case.

Until level 60, I'm extremely skeptical that a Iksar necro compares to a non-Iksar because you're one level higher on the non-Iksar and the large regen difference hasn't kicked in yet. An extra level is a much larger benefit than the increased regen. You're going to need to consider what percent of the total time you're going to play this character is going to be spent at 60 vs. below 60.

I took over 2 years to hit 60 on Jayya, and the percentage of playtime at 60 vs. below 60 for her is something like 1 to 20 right now. She's not a necromancer, but if she had had the option to be Iksar it would have been a terrible choice since she would still be level 58.

On the flip side, if you're going to hit 60 in two months and actively raid for years, fair enough. XP penalty is not terribly relevant in that case.

[Oddbaal]

Would a human necromancer who follows Bertoxxulous be able to compete quests such as Crushbone belts without being KoS in the dwarven city?