Pantheon: Rise of the Fallen?

[Encroaching Death]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It's been a long time, but didn't Lost Dungeons of Norath use "auto dungeon creators"? If so, I think those auto dungeons lost their "New Best Buy feeling" pretty fast.

I'm not saying Pantheon can't make a better one that LDoN did, but just, procedurally-generated content is no magic panacea for newness.

Agreed.

...but what about player-made dungeons?

Think about how popular custom maps are on Counter Strike or Happy Wheels or Roblox.

Could be an interesting thing.

[loramin]

Agreed. There's still a huge difference between artificial and human intelligence, and the very last thing AI will catch up on is creativity.

[A Knight]

Originally Posted by loramin [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It's been a long time, but didn't Lost Dungeons of Norath use "auto dungeon creators"? If so, I think those auto dungeons lost their "New Best Buy feeling" pretty fast.

I'm not saying Pantheon can't make a better one that LDoN did, but just, procedurally-generated content is no magic panacea for newness.

I could play both honestly. As long as its fun. [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[A Knight]

I mostly meant, if there is too much pressure to make a master craft created world. Then auto create a dungeon. This may lessen the burden of the pressure, of making a perfect world. Especially if there is pressure to surpass classic Everquest. Just an idea /shrugs. You could be right.

Not one Dungeon that changes every time. That would probably be not fun. Unless the Mmo was specifically known, and designed for that.

[Bisonzabi]

EQ2 introduced player made dungeons back in 2011. Spoiler: Nobody used it.

[loramin]

Originally Posted by Bisonzabi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

EQ2 introduced player made dungeons back in 2011. Spoiler: Nobody used it.

LOL to be fair though, hardly anyone used EQ2 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.] WoW was just a little bit more popular.

[Secrets]

Originally Posted by Bisonzabi [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

EQ2 introduced player made dungeons back in 2011. Spoiler: Nobody used it.

People used it in the way it was most efficient because EQ2 also optimized out all of the fun during that era of the game.

SF / Destiny of Velious / Skyshrine were EQ2's darkest hours in terms of flawed design.

Critical mitigation was awful. The raid encounters had a huge difficulty jump between normal and hard modes. The game basically took the entire itemization of EQ2 that had historically worked prior to TSO and shat upon it, removing unique effects from a lot of items on current-tier content.

The game started to add stuff from eq2 extended (the 'f2p server') into the live game like Health Potions that they promised they'd 'never add'.

They saw a ton of raiders quit after Skyshrine into CoE. Then they all but lost a majority of their population into Tears of Veeshan after they fucked up their "Rum Cellar" expansion which just handed out the best gear to everyone who paid for it.

There were problems with the design, but that's because the design sucked, not because the idea of players designing dungeons is a terrible idea.

[Toxigen]

Scamtheon: Boofing Bux

[Swish]

Word has it they updated a few pixels of terrain last week.

[Bisonzabi]

Originally Posted by Secrets [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

People used it in the way it was most efficient because EQ2 also optimized out all of the fun during that era of the game.

SF / Destiny of Velious / Skyshrine were EQ2's darkest hours in terms of flawed design.

Critical mitigation was awful. The raid encounters had a huge difficulty jump between normal and hard modes. The game basically took the entire itemization of EQ2 that had historically worked prior to TSO and shat upon it, removing unique effects from a lot of items on current-tier content.

The game started to add stuff from eq2 extended (the 'f2p server') into the live game like Health Potions that they promised they'd 'never add'.

They saw a ton of raiders quit after Skyshrine into CoE. Then they all but lost a majority of their population into Tears of Veeshan after they fucked up their "Rum Cellar" expansion which just handed out the best gear to everyone who paid for it.

There were problems with the design, but that's because the design sucked, not because the idea of players designing dungeons is a terrible idea.

No I feel you on the changes with EQ2. I stopped playing it around late 2014 to early 2015. F2P was inevitable unfortunately and even by 2010 you could tell SOE downsized the EQ2 team several times from its peak with EoF-TSO. I still have nostalgia for Sentinels Fate primarily due to the music and atmosphere.
And the Rum Cellar wasn't part of Tears of Veeshan, that was post-Altar of Malice in 2015 when SoE downsized yet again and became DBG.