npc run speed.

[guineapig]

I remember being having to jump while running until I ran out of stamina (or endurance or whatever it was at the time). That would give me just enough distance to make it to a zone line while only being hit once or twice.

It should be the same (but in reverse) as when you are auto-following somebody. You maintain the same distance but when you hit jump repeatedly you close the gap a little bit.

[Takshaka]

Originally Posted by Onadan [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Man, they aren't. You should be running at the same speeds of mobs w/ out sow. They should not be catching up to you and plowing you. This is why jumping was nice, it gave you extra distance. Did you even play live? How can you not remember this?

No, the only way to escape without sow was to strafe run (run diagonally). Most mobs are set to run slightly faster than PC run speed so that they can catch up, hit you, then catch up again. If you strafe run you will still get hit only occasionally.

As for certain mobs like Griffins, werewolfs, etc., they run much faster than PC run speed by default and in cases of lower level sow they will catch up to you. Remember, low level sow/Selo's != high level sow/Selo's.

I have no idea how it is currently on live, or how it was after 2001 as I only played up until around may of 2001. However, the way it was when I played from 05/1999 up until I quit is pretty much the same as it is on this server. I still remember very clearly the joy that I had when I discovered strafe running and the subsequent fewer number of deaths.

[Malrubius]

Takshaka is right. Most mobs caught you in classic (could outrun you). I believe a very few might have only run about the same speed as you.

Particularly at lower levels, mobs *would*, definitely, always, catch you. I remember being whacked in the back repeatedly as I ran to the guards. Sometimes I did not make it to the guards alive. We definitely could NOT outrun stuff very often.


They changed this in 2004-ish? so that you could run the same speed as most stuff at low levels up until level 10 or so. Maybe you could even outrun stuff slightly until level 10 or so. Maybe at later levels too - I don't know what it's like on live today.

I think it was a slight speed buff that PCs got (or a slight speed nerf that all mobs got) that made PCs and NPCs run the same speed, or PCs even a little faster. This was not documented and not in the patch notes (they never put stuff like this in the patch notes) - but it was definitely noticed by all and written about elsewhere at the time. I think this is what you are remembering, Onadan. It sounds like it is still this way on live.


Assuming PC and NPC are unbuffed, then the classic behavior that I recall is...

1 - There are some faster mobs and slower mobs, although *most* move at a single "almost universal" NPC speed.

2 - PCs have the same base run speed for their entire lives (unbuffed and unencumbered). All races and classes are the same. You run the same speed at L1 as at L60.

3 - You should not be able to outrun many, if any, mobs (unless you're strafing or something - in which case you might be able to outrun (or at least maintain a lead on) *some* mobs).

4 - You should be able to outrun some stuff - JUST BARELY - if using strafing or jumping (esp. over very hilly terrain) or with Lev (esp. over very hilly terrain).

[Hasbinbad]

Originally Posted by Onadan [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Man, they aren't. You should be running at the same speeds of mobs w/ out sow. They should not be catching up to you and plowing you. This is why jumping was nice, it gave you extra distance. Did you even play live? How can you not remember this?

Yes I do remember live, and what I remember is dying every time i tried to get away from a mob without exception until I learned how to strafe run.

[Hasbinbad]

Originally Posted by Takshaka [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I still remember very clearly the joy that I had when I discovered strafe running and the subsequent fewer number of deaths.

This.

[Finawin]

Mobs are faster. There is no way anyone with an iota of memory or intelligence would try to refute this.

Strafe running allowed you to gain a very slight lead. Now sometimes it barely even does that, and in most cases, doesn't.

Mobs move significantly faster. This coupled with a longer melee range is quite problematic.

This is all moot because it can't really be fixed. So there's no use to a bunch of people who were very likely kids when they played in 1999 (or didn't at all!) claiming they remember something that never happened.

[nilbog]

This is all moot because it can't really be fixed. So there's no use to a bunch of people who were very likely kids when they played in 1999 (or didn't at all!) claiming they remember something that never happened.

The speed itself... eh. I'm not 100% sure. There is some kink within the titanium client vs. the 2004/05 (?) npc runspeed change vs. what we remember from 1999 vs. original/emu melee hit box vs. graphical display.

It is very noticable as certain npcs visually appear to the walking *way* too fast. I hope a solution can be found for the issue.. as I'm sure it deters some newbies.

I was there, I remember :P

This bitch killed me constantly trying to level a paladin, solo, in qeynos hills. First emarr holly windstalker raid.. she taught me all about runspeed.

[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Danth]

Spectres, for example, were among the rare few types of monsters which moved so slowly that a person could outrun them (barely) at normal run speed. Most monsters did outrun the player slightly.

I figure strafe running was something of an unintended exploit that was never fixed and turned into a sort of feature over time. Strafe running works quite nicely on P1999; I can use it to train mobs across entire zones whilst only receiving a few hits.

Although many mobs quite obviously walk too fast, in practice things usually work out about right, except maybe to some kiters. As such this is *mostly* a cosmetic issue, although I absolutely feel for said kiting classes (bards, etc) who have a rough time due to this issue. That being said, it's probably the most blatant cosmetic issue on the server--immediately apparent within a minute or so to every new player who logs on. With that in mind we can continue to expect threads on the subject until a better fix is found.

Danth

[Finawin]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The speed itself... eh. I'm not 100% sure. There is some kink within the titanium client vs. the 2004/05 (?) npc runspeed change vs. what we remember from 1999 vs. original/emu melee hit box vs. graphical display.

It is very noticable as certain npcs visually appear to the walking *way* too fast. I hope a solution can be found for the issue.. as I'm sure it deters some newbies.

I was there, I remember :P

This bitch killed me constantly trying to level a paladin, solo, in qeynos hills. First emarr holly windstalker raid.. she taught me all about runspeed.

Well my point wasn't really directed towards you, more in support of, really.

We know the runspeed is off in a lot of cases, fine in some, and WAY off on some...just that it's not really a high priority to fix it. (If that's even possible.)

People claiming mobs' runspeed are fine, are wrong.

[seveian]

if (mob.aggrolist.size == 0)
runspeed = SLOWER_THAN_SOW_FFS;
else
runspeed = do_it_the_way_it_currently_is;


- the code guru