How much do Clerics need CHA?

[Vexenu]

Originally Posted by Solist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Having a class that can DA do room breaks, and leave an enchanter or other group members able to freecast while mobs do zero damage is very efficient. Healing is by far the least efficient thing a cleric can ever do of the common group roles.

1) Given that a Cleric has double DAs to fall back on during crit lull fails, why exactly is max CHA so important to begin with? Are you really going to say you're pumping CHA just for CRs?

2) If Cleric healing is inefficient, whose healing is efficient? Who should heal the group instead?

ITT: good players massively overthinking the Cleric class You're there to heal, bros. You have other tools in the toolbox to be sure. And Cleric lulls are very legit and powerful. But the class isn't built around them. I mean, I suppose you can make an argument for it if you have a very niche playstyle built around dungeon crawling in duos/trios. But I think every other grouping/raiding Cleric is better off maxing their mana pool, and carrying around a bag of +CHA gear (which is plentiful and cheap) for the rare occasions they need it.

Groups and raids in EQ have probably wiped about 1000x more often because a Cleric ran OOM than because the Cleric puller got a crit lull resist at an inopportune moment.

"Group LF Cleric to pull for us instead of healing," said no one ever.

[PatChapp]

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

1) Given that a Cleric has double DAs to fall back on during crit lull fails, why exactly is max CHA so important to begin with? Are you really going to say you're pumping CHA just for CRs?

2) If Cleric healing is inefficient, whose healing is efficient? Who should heal the group instead?

ITT: good players massively overthinking the Cleric class You're there to heal, bros. You have other tools in the toolbox to be sure. And Cleric lulls are very legit and powerful. But the class isn't built around them. I mean, I suppose you can make an argument for it if you have a very niche playstyle built around dungeon crawling in duos/trios. But I think every other grouping/raiding Cleric is better off maxing their mana pool, and carrying around a bag of +CHA gear (which is plentiful and cheap) for the rare occasions they need it.

Groups and raids in EQ have probably wiped about 1000x more often because a Cleric ran OOM than because the Cleric puller got a crit lull resist at an inopportune moment.

"Group LF Cleric to pull for us instead of healing," said no one ever.

Cha cleric with paci bracer is a much better puller in an enchanter/cleric duo than the enchanter.
Mana free,and allows the enchanter to handle problems as they happen.

[Vexenu]

Originally Posted by PatChapp [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Cha cleric with paci bracer is a much better puller in an enchanter/cleric duo than the enchanter.
Mana free,and allows the enchanter to handle problems as they happen.

There may be some scenarios where this is true, but again, if you're a Cleric with two DAs and an Ench to peel mobs off you, why do you need to max CHA to begin with? A crit resist isn't going to matter in 99% of cases, and if there is a pull so risky it might get the Cleric killed on a crit resist, guess what? The Cleric shouldn't be pulling in that case, anyway! The Enchanter should, since the Cleric can rez him back in if it all goes south.

Also let's be honest, assuming two players of reasonable intelligence and experience, you can basically do whatever the hell you want with Ench/Cleric anyway. You're not exactly hurting for efficiency.

[Toxigen]

nah the cleric pulls in that duo, sorry you dont got hope that helped

[Jimjam]

Originally Posted by Toxigen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

nah the cleric pulls in that duo, sorry you dont got hope that helped

Will sk mobs burn their HT reuse timer if the only thing on their aggro list is a DA cleric?

[Snaggles]

"Need" is a highly subjective word for a class that most of the time heals, buffs, and rezzes people.

Also for what it's worth, any competent puller (including ench's) will fight the cleric tooth and nail to let them pull for the group. It's an all-eggs-in-one-basket situation but more than that trying to reframe the team dynamic. In P99 most people are pretty locked in their ways...just let them do it the way they want to do it. If you have an unique small group thinking outside the box then sure, figure out any other system and have fun.

[PatChapp]

Originally Posted by Snaggles [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

"Need" is a highly subjective word for a class that most of the time heals, buffs, and rezzes people.

Also for what it's worth, any competent puller (including ench's) will fight the cleric tooth and nail to let them pull for the group. It's an all-eggs-in-one-basket situation but more than that trying to reframe the team dynamic. In P99 most people are pretty locked in their ways...just let them do it the way they want to do it. If you have an unique small group thinking outside the box then sure, figure out any other system and have fun.

There is nothing outside the box about a cleric enchanter duo. Strongest duo in the game,certain spots monk/shaman are a little better - like fungi king

[Crede]

Originally Posted by Toxigen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

nah the cleric pulls in that duo, sorry you dont got hope that helped

Correct. Idk why people expect the enc to do all the work with the cleric just sitting at FM nuking & tossing a CH once in awhile. Paci bracer is OP, and a cleric can easily be rocking 200+ cha with enchanter buffs if they rolled their race/stats properly. And you can do some cool pulling tricks with DA/DB, like the HS west room after the ledge.

[Vexenu]

If you're pulling on a Cleric specifically to eat a roomful of HTs with DA, again, why do you need high CHA? You might as well pull with a nuke in that case.

There are vanishingly few scenarios I can think of in EQ where the Cleric should be the one in the group/duo doing something risky that might get them killed instead of another party member. This should be obvious and require no explanation. So the only situation in which a Cleric should be pulling are those which are relatively low risk to begin with. Which means pumping CHA is more a matter of convenience than survival.

[Danth]

I'm mostly with you Vexenu. I know a cleric can pull if he has to. I usually don't want him doing that. We're on a server where a wipe = forfeiting a camp; maintaining presence matters. I don't want my rezzer unnecessarily risking himself in normal gameplay. Of course some scenarios fall outside that general rule of thumb. Chaining low-risk blue exp fodder or in an area with no competition, or pushing the envelope where a death means a wipe regardless due to fast spawns or lack of safe areas, then sure, have at it. Cleric pulling someplace like chardok royals is fair game on that account.

Danth