GAMEBREAKING BUGS THAT HAVE EXISTED SINCE BETA

[Daefuin]

COMPILED LIST

1. The mana bug. I don't know how to repeat it. All I know is that I've died once on this server and it was because of this bug. You get mana from sitting, then stand up and try and gate and your mana disafuckingpears. Oh, sit for another tic of mana? Nevermind it's gone when you stand up.

2. PvP EXP loss is non-existant. Why even call it exp loss, it's a joke. I died today, finally, and I couldn't even see my bar move. From now I'm going to have to seek out little skeleton friends to kill people for me. In all the discussion leading up to the server one thing that was mentioned time and time again was there HAS to be a death penalty. Item loot. Exp loss. ANYTHING. Right now there is no penalty for dying. I deal with people bind rushing my camps and I just kill them over and over, whats the point? They don't lose anything. Eventually I get tired of dirtnapping them because they don't lose anything and I'm wasting time.

3. Shadowstep takes you through walls, hills, castles, up, down, around. It should take you DOWN and only places you can see. It's why terrible wizards died on live and non-awful wizards made an attempt to run to the top of a hill before yondering.

4. Many dots aren't applying buff icons. You cannot dispel what you cannot see.

5. Pets only do like 1/3 damage in PvP. Not classic, gimps some classes like mages. No one cares about the level 4 mage killing the level 2. You can't balance the whole game around level 4 idiots.

6. Ice Comet should not be in game. Harvest should not be in game.

[Shrubwise]

5. Pets only do like 1/3 damage in PvP. Not classic, gimps some classes like mages.

Holy shit, if this is what mages do gimped, I wanna know what they were like ungimped!

[Daefuin]

Holy shit, if this is what mages do gimped, I wanna know what they were like ungimped!

No one cares about the level 4 mage killing the level 2. You can't balance the whole game around level 4 idiots.
No one cares about the level 4 mage killing the level 2. You can't balance the whole game around level 4 idiots.
No one cares about the level 4 mage killing the level 2. You can't balance the whole game around level 4 idiots.
No one cares about the level 4 mage killing the level 2. You can't balance the whole game around level 4 idiots.
No one cares about the level 4 mage killing the level 2. You can't balance the whole game around level 4 idiots.
No one cares about the level 4 mage killing the level 2. You can't balance the whole game around level 4 idiots.

[Shrubwise]

does not compute

[Slave]

7. Guards not assisting in pvp.
8. Selos not overwriting snare/root
9. Zonewide lag/skip when someone zones in
10. white/red/green con system for pvp is not in
11. Root vs resists

[Mardur]

COMPILED LIST

1. The mana bug. I don't know how to repeat it. All I know is that I've died once on this server and it was because of this bug. You get mana from sitting, then stand up and try and gate and your mana disafuckingpears. Oh, sit for another tic of mana? Nevermind it's gone when you stand up.

This was your own fault, you were out of drink. The mana bug as it exists doesn't visibly increase your mana bar.

[Daefuin]

This was your own fault, you were out of drink. The mana bug as it exists doesn't visibly increase your mana bar.

Don't think I've ever had less than 40 iron rations/water since like level 3.

There is not just one mana bug - maybe they are related? But try playing a class that med-kites and tell me there is no bug with mana disappearing after you stand up.

[nilbog]

1. The mana bug. I don't know how to repeat it. All I know is that I've died once on this server and it was because of this bug. You get mana from sitting, then stand up and try and gate and your mana disafuckingpears. Oh, sit for another tic of mana? Nevermind it's gone when you stand up.For the devs who don't play, it's quite hard to narrow down what causes this. If someone can find a way to replicate the bug, we'll have a chance of fixing it.

2. PvP EXP loss is non-existant. Why even call it exp loss, it's a joke. I died today, finally, and I couldn't even see my bar move. From now I'm going to have to seek out little skeleton friends to kill people for me. In all the discussion leading up to the server one thing that was mentioned time and time again was there HAS to be a death penalty. Item loot. Exp loss. ANYTHING. Right now there is no penalty for dying. I deal with people bind rushing my camps and I just kill them over and over, whats the point? They don't lose anything. Eventually I get tired of dirtnapping them because they don't lose anything and I'm wasting time.Opinion more than a bug. Why don't you ask the other pvpers if they agree? Make a poll or something.

3. Shadowstep takes you through walls, hills, castles, up, down, around. It should take you DOWN and only places you can see. It's why terrible wizards died on live and non-awful wizards made an attempt to run to the top of a hill before yondering.This is being looked into.

4. Many dots aren't applying buff icons. You cannot dispel what you cannot see.I *believe* this is fixed for patch.

5. Pets only do like 1/3 damage in PvP. Not classic, gimps some classes like mages. No one cares about the level 4 mage killing the level 2. You can't balance the whole game around level 4 idiots.There's really been no research provided that mage pets should perform otherwise. 1/3 of what? The dmg they do in pve?

6. Ice Comet should not be in game. Harvest should not be in game.Being worked on. There's not a command to systematically remove spells from everyone... yet. :P

[Kringe]

For the devs who don't play, it's quite hard to narrow down what causes this. If someone can find a way to replicate the bug, we'll have a chance of fixing it.

There's really been no research provided that mage pets should perform otherwise. 1/3 of what? The dmg they do in pve?

P

Pets do 1/3 of PVE dmg to PVP targets.. This was never LIVE.. Pets always did FULL PVE dmg in PVP.. This extremely hurts pet classes (with runes/cleric buffs etc) level 50 pets hitting for max dmg of 26-27 is laughable. Especially since we are adhering to classic ruleset where as pets dont zone etc...

Unfortunately there are no patch notes I have found to reflect this change, just off simple memory (which we know isnt enough evidence) but ask yourselves, especially for classes that rely solely on Pets, should their max dps pet hit players for 1/3 PVE dmg?

It will extremely gimp pet classes once melee's come into the picture higher end.

[Kringe]

COMPILED LIST

6. Ice Comet should not be in game. Harvest should not be in game.

I think it should be as it was orginally on LIVE (but very very difficult to obtain as Staff of the Wheel wasnt orginally in as proven in other threads)

[Slave]

Pets do 1/3 of PVE dmg to PVP targets.. level 50 pets hitting for max dmg of 26-27 is laughable.

If level 50 pets are hitting for 26-27, that is 1/2 PVE damage and not 1/3.

[nilbog]

We're not trying to intentionally nerf anyone. :P

Can I see some classic screenshots of pet dmg vs players? I wouldn't be the one to fix, but I can prioritize it if a change is needed.

[Darwoth]

i am also being told that upon a pvp death you do not respawn with zero mana like your supposed to.

[Daefuin]

For the devs who don't play, it's quite hard to narrow down what causes this. If someone can find a way to replicate the bug, we'll have a chance of fixing it.

Opinion more than a bug. Why don't you ask the other pvpers if they agree? Make a poll or something.


There appears to be two different mana bugs. The first causes you to simply stop regening mana; clixcking your water seems to fix it. I've only experienced it a couple times and it has not affected my gameplay much.

The mana bug I get hit with daily seems to be caused by the server and client becoming out of sync. My client thinks I get mana, but whenever I do anything the mana doesn't seem to register and ot goes away. I usually keep the mana if I med 30 seconds straight or whatnot... But it makes med-kiting and canni-dancing impossible when you can't tell when the server thinks you're supposed to get mana. Happens to me nost sessions.

As for PvP exp loss, I was under the impression the server and staff settled on exp loss as a death penalty over item loot. Right now the loss is so inconsequential that it doesn't deserve to be called exp loss. I understand not wanting to scare new players off, but how do you hold a camp in your 30s and 40s when the person spawns and rushes you, losing less than a tic of blue per death.

[Arillious]

There appears to be two different mana bugs. The first causes you to simply stop regening mana; clixcking your water seems to fix it. I've only experienced it a couple times and it has not affected my gameplay much.

The mana bug I get hit with daily seems to be caused by the server and client becoming out of sync. My client thinks I get mana, but whenever I do anything the mana doesn't seem to register and ot goes away. I usually keep the mana if I med 30 seconds straight or whatnot... But it makes med-kiting and canni-dancing impossible when you can't tell when the server thinks you're supposed to get mana. Happens to me nost sessions.

As for PvP exp loss, I was under the impression the server and staff settled on exp loss as a death penalty over item loot. Right now the loss is so inconsequential that it doesn't deserve to be called exp loss. I understand not wanting to scare new players off, but how do you hold a camp in your 30s and 40s when the person spawns and rushes you, losing less than a tic of blue per death.

The first mana bug you described is the one that has plauged me since beta. About 20% of the time i med, my mana will actually stop increasing. I need to drink water to fix.

The second issue I have ran into only a few times, usually when im trying to get in a few meds while kiting. I can see this being much mroe of an issue for a shaman and canni.

For exp loss in pvp death, I'd say the goal would be to lose about 20-30 minutes of exp time(hard to quantify I know). It's enough to make it hurt, and prevent bind rushing but not enough to make a single pvp death make someone ragequit.

[Merrik]

The having to manually drink your water at random really freaking sucks. Playing a cleric and trying to med up for a heal on my tank after running oom only to look down and see that I'm not actually regaining mana makes me want to rage. I have to grab the water from my bag and actually put it in my non-bagged inventory and right click to force a drink in order to get mana back. That's a major pain in the ass.

Also- I know this isn't game breaking, but I posted a bug about drowning/falling deaths causing exp death on the pvp server when it shouldn't. The thread had multiple views but zero acknowledgement of the bug from anyone as to whether it would be looked at or what. If it's chosen to be ignored, I'm fine with that, just want to know that it's being left alone vs wandering if anyone important actually read it.

[Brinkman]

We're not trying to intentionally nerf anyone. :P

Can I see some classic screenshots of pet dmg vs players? I wouldn't be the one to fix, but I can prioritize it if a change is needed.


Nilbog, no offense, but I think the question here is, where did yall get the info to make it 1/3 of pve?

There is nothing about it either way in the patch notes.

Are you saying that the code for pet damage in pvp was defaulted to 1/3 when the server was made, based on... The titanium client? Im slightly confused.

[Brinkman]

Being worked on. There's not a command to systematically remove spells from everyone... yet. :P

There are only a few wizards who have this spell yet. Tell them that its not intended and if they use a known bug , its a bannable offense. Tell them to delete the spell from their spellbook.

I dont understand why we are dancing around it. Remove from vendors... force the players who have it to delete it.

Speaking on Harvest.


Suppose some wizards wont have a problem deleting it since they are already 50. Meh.

[AffEcT]

The pet PvP dmg reduction applies on charmed pets.
So you can charm a mob and kill it with the group and take less dmg.
Its kinda an exploit i guess.

And it should be risk vs reward, = Charm pets should do full dmg

[xblade724]

7. Guards not assisting in pvp.
8. Selos not overwriting snare/root
9. Zonewide lag/skip when someone zones in
10. white/red/green con system for pvp is not in
11. Root vs resists

^
12. Boastful bellow doesn't give knockback
13. Linkdead shows you LD instead of hiding the tag

[Lovely]

6. Ice Comet should not be in game. Harvest should not be in game.

Not TRUE IT HAS ALWAYS BEEN IN THE GAME. Stop posting bullshit - Staff of Wheel quest hasn't however always been in game, but the spell has.

Ima Go solo that noob Vox dragon if I have to, np boys. Eye of zoom in da hizzah

[Leftoverture]

Don't take away my bullshit spell! :(

[Kringe]

SEPTEMBER 28, 1999

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The following changes have been implemented with the latest patch, most importantly, changes to corpse resurrection. It should be noted that all corpses generated previous to this patch may not be resurrected, however, all corpses generated from this point forward may be resurrected with the changes listed below applying.
Corpses that are older than 2 hours cannot be resurrected.
Corpses that are produced from a duel cannot be resurrected after 10 minutes.
General Enhancements:A Yes/
No request window is now brought up when ever turning in the PK note to the Priest of Discord.
It is now possible to manually reorganize icons within the spell book. This may be performed by right-clicking on the currently placed icon (the icon will then be highlighted), then right-clicking on the desired slot you wish to move it.
Pet damage inflicted during PvP combat has been slightly reduced.
It is now possible to place items marked as "No Drop" in the bank.
NPC corpses will only remain for 8 minutes, even while looting.
If a party member goes link-dead, the remaining members will be notified.
Pets with less than 20 hit points cannot receive hit point buffs.
When viewing an invisible PC with See Invisible, the name will be shown in parentheses over the character.
All beneficial speed spells may be canceled left-clicking on the spell icon.
We have also made revisions to the /text command section of the EverQuest manual.


Thats a huge start nilbog.... It doesnt give you specific numbers, but the TOP end focus'd mage pet hitting for 26s while Sword of runes is procing for 41s at 50 is laughable... Wouldnt even eat through diamond skin...

We have Spell damage at 80% and pet damage hits set to 50% but yet melee damage is 100%....


Ill dig more for classic screenshots but this should be a start.

[Lubian]

For the devs who don't play, it's quite hard to narrow down what causes this. If someone can find a way to replicate the bug, we'll have a chance of fixing it.This can be caused by a few things:


The client tries to accurately predict mana regen for each tick. When you're mixing sitting up and standing the client will inaccurately think you got a sitting mediate tick, while server side the mana tick may have occurred while the player was standing. When you actually try to cast a spell the mana will be updated client side, and you'll see your mana seemingly decrease more than it should, or not have enough mana to cast the spell.
The server and client mana regen formula or a mana regen value isn't properly synced between the client and server. I don't see a mana regen value in eq_packet_structs.h, is it possible that it's one of the unknowns? I don't know the eqemu source code that well though.

[Arillious]

The first mana bug you described is the one that has plauged me since beta. About 20% of the time i med, my mana will actually stop increasing. I need to drink water to fix.

The second issue I have ran into only a few times, usually when im trying to get in a few meds while kiting. I can see this being much mroe of an issue for a shaman and canni.

For exp loss in pvp death, I'd say the goal would be to lose about 20-30 minutes of exp time(hard to quantify I know). It's enough to make it hurt, and prevent bind rushing but not enough to make a single pvp death make someone ragequit.


I have more information regarding the first mana bug, where while medding, you do not get mana back sometimes until you drink water.

While this was happening I actually got the "You are Thirsty" message even though I had an entire stack of water in my inventory. This means that the client really thinks that the person is out of water when this happens(which makes sense since drinking water fixes it.)

If you cannot identify the problem, I would suggest simply removing the need to have water to begin with until the problem can be identified. This bug outweighs any need to mandate that someone carry water on them. I dont think anyones going to miss it while you guys figure this one out.

[Mardur]

Something interesting about the mana bug:

My stamina bar stopped regenerating today until I ate some food. So not only does the game sometimes think you're out of water when you're not, sometimes it thinks you're out of food when you're not. These issues occur separately (my mana was regenerating but not my stamina).

If I had to guess when this was broken, it would be here: http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=48145

Kanras: Food/Drink duration now varies per item.

This was found to be non-classic and was repealed shortly after. I assume either when making food/drink duration vary per item, or when removing that functionality, something got dun goofd that sometimes makes the server think you're lacking food/drink when you're not.

[Truth]

Secrets commented in IRC about the mana bug. He said something about cancelling the client side update in like call__DoTimeUpdate() and just updating the value when server sends the verification packet. I could see that helping when you appear to have the mana and cast spell but it like "nope u oom", but perhaps not the other symptom when you are just sitting there medding at 0% for 45 seconds until it finally starts ticking up or whatever.

[Lubian]

Secrets commented in IRC about the mana bug. He said something about cancelling the client side update in like call__DoTimeUpdate() and just updating the value when server sends the verification packet. I could see that helping when you appear to have the mana and cast spell but it like "nope u oom", but perhaps not the other symptom when you are just sitting there medding at 0% for 45 seconds until it finally starts ticking up or whatever.

That's not fixing the underlying bug, but rather just sending the mana over and over again, because he doesn't understand what is causing the desync issue. Don't misunderstand me though; it could still be used as a (hopefully temporary) solution.