Warriors are useless in 90% of the games content

[spoil]

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

How would you fix Warriors with the fewest changes possible? I've heard people suggest giving them block (at least with a shield equipped), but this would really just enhance them as raid tanks (where they already shine) and do nothing to address their weaknesses in the other aspects of the game (where they underperform).

On Secrets' playground server warriors get an ability /shield at level 30 that mitigates 50% of the damage to a targeted player (within close range) and transfers like 75% of the damage to the warrior, with a few minute cooldown. I'm not sure what expansion that ability is from, but it adds much-needed depth to the class. It felt satisfying when a quick reaction made the difference in saving an enchanter on a charm break or giving some relief to a cleric who pulls aggro. Almost like playing a good class.

[Snaggles]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Some people do care about group content. People prefer faster leveling experiences to slower leveling experiences generally speaking. Time is the issue, not difficulty. Every class can afk camp an easy single static spawn all the way to 60. That takes much longer time-wise, however. This is why you don't see an overabundance of Rogues trying to solo to 60.

The strengths and weakness of Warriors on P99 will remain as facts, regardless of whether you care about grouping or not.

I didn’t mean literally who cares about group content (ie doing it). I meant, who cares if it’s moderately more difficult. A shaman can drop 66% slow on something in the early 50’s and it scales to 75%. Just slow stuff and kill it, or CC with mez, or split tank, or root, or kite. My point was most group content is very easy, but fun. If people struggle they should practice their own class, not nitpick another to break progression history.

So get some buddies together and kill stuff. Don’t get precious optimizing group dynamics. Also, rogues and monks should have a bit of patience with a warrior tank. It’s not their fault. Slowers can debuff like a belly caster or pre-root. Lots of ways to work with a warrior if people care to try.

[Sonark]

Originally Posted by Snaggles [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Aggro issues so they don’t trivialize raid encounters? Check

...are you serious?

They made them bad at managing aggro so raids won't be as easy.

Is that seriously your position?

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Snaggles [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I didn’t mean literally who cares about group content (ie doing it). I meant, who cares if it’s moderately more difficult. A shaman can drop 66% slow on something in the early 50’s and it scales to 75%. Just slow stuff and kill it, or CC with mez, or split tank, or root, or kite. My point was most group content is very easy, but fun. If people struggle they should practice their own class, not nitpick another to break progression history.

So get some buddies together and kill stuff. Don’t get precious optimizing group dynamics. Also, rogues and monks should have a bit of patience with a warrior tank. It’s not their fault. Slowers can debuff like a belly caster or pre-root. Lots of ways to work with a warrior if people care to try.

I agree that you shouldn't prevent Warriors from joining XP groups as a tank. That wasn't what I was suggesting.

I was just explaining why Warriors are considered to be less useful in groups generally speaking. It's good to know why this bias occurs.

When people know what the weaknesses/strengths of a Warrior are, they can determine if their group would be able to handle a Warrior tank.

If you have a lazy random Rogue in your group who can't handle a Warrior tank, you have to choose between:
1. Denying the Warrior.
2. Kicking the Rogue.
3. Invite the Warrior and hope you find a Cleric for reses.
4. Try to teach the Rogue how to play.

All are valid options the group leader will have to decide for themselves based on their own laziness/willingless to handle the situation.

[Snaggles]

Originally Posted by Sonark [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

...are you serious?

They made them bad at managing aggro so raids won't be as easy.

Is that seriously your position?

They could have made taunt generate 1k aggro a click and didn’t. It’s pretty obvious aggro was a problem since day one.

Sorry the game is too hard.

[Jimjam]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I agree that you shouldn't prevent Warriors from joining XP groups as a tank. That wasn't what I was suggesting.

I was just explaining why Warriors are considered to be less useful in groups generally speaking. It's good to know why this bias occurs.

When people know what the weaknesses/strengths of a Warrior are, they can determine if their group would be able to handle a Warrior tank.

If you have a lazy random Rogue in your group who can't handle a Warrior tank, you have to choose between:
1. Denying the Warrior.
2. Kicking the Rogue.
3. Invite the Warrior and hope you find a Cleric for reses.
4. Try to teach the Rogue how to play.

All are valid options the group leader will have to decide for themselves based on their own laziness/willingless to handle the situation.

Rogues need to take a few hits to cap defensive skills, and they do have good defensive skills, so imo just leave them to it. If they are stretching healer mana the healer can choose not to heal them. People will be careful engaging as their hp lowers [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.].

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Jimjam [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Rogues need to take a few hits to cap defensive skills, and they do have good defensive skills, so imo just leave them to it. If they are stretching healer mana the healer can choose not to heal them. People will be careful engaging as their hp lowers [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.].

Assuming people play well, there is no problem of course. My post is referring to when people are not playing well.

[Samoht]

Originally Posted by Vexenu [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

How would you fix Warriors with the fewest changes possible?

Hate on shield bash.

[Jimjam]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Assuming people play well, there is no problem of course. My post is referring to when people are not playing well.

When they respawn naked in kelethin they’ll have plenty of time to think about what they’ve done as they hitch hike back to velious/kunark!

[enjchanter]

Warrior design is great ! All it requires is everyone else in the group to work extra to make them viable at their role