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#13
12-16-2009, 06:22 AM
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I would complain more, but that I can't stop laughing at the fact that it shapes up that the very guild that QQ'd for weeks and weeks about nonexistant GM favoritism and hacks (zero evidence has been presented against any IB member) - have now been shown to be the recipients of favored treatment (implementation of rotation without consultation), and the utilizers of illegal methods to gain access to loot they would otherwise have questionable ability to obtain (wiping to trash in the same sequence where they exploit phin). Cute. | |||
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#14
12-16-2009, 07:08 AM
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I'm sure I've heard this before... | |||
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#15
12-16-2009, 07:27 AM
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PvE means Players versus Environement. Which means players compete against environment.
PvP means Players vs Players. Wich means players compete against other player. Rotation are here so all players get an equal chance to compete against environment. If you want, like you said so many time, compete against another guild of players, racing,training, KSing,etc, then you might want to go to a pvp server (where 90% of your players come from). Because what you're actually doing, on a pve server, is absolutly pointless. You could not say it louder then you actually do : you want conflict. Fine by me if it was on PvP server i'd glady KS you / with you and we would have a big guild war. But again, it's PvE server, where people play together against environment, like Transcendence did with Divinity. It's not that hard to understand, really. It's important to understand both side , i played on a pvp server too i would react exactly the same way if a rotation was put because it would just mean GMs are giving loosers something they don't deserve and i'm pretty sure you think that way (because you come from pvp) But on pve you don't have to KS to deserve a mob, you just have to camp it with enough power to kill it. on a side note i'm curious to know why there's so much pvp players on this server | ||
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Last edited by Soulfighter; 12-16-2009 at 07:39 AM..
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#16
12-16-2009, 07:36 AM
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Why are you guys acting so surprised? You were told on Monday, December 7th, 2009 at 8:03 PM EST that this was going to happen. You have been following the rotation since then. I told you that details would be posted. I posted the details.
You have discussed it with me. You have discussed it with Aeolwind. You have discussed it with Nilbog. You have been shown direct quotes from the GM code of conduct from Live. We have explained the situation over and over. Allizia asked me how we were handling the planes. Since you guys got there first to kill CT the planes were yours, Trans pulled out of the planes since it was your guys' night in the planes. Seriously. The ones doing all the QQing... is you guys. | ||
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#17
12-16-2009, 07:53 AM
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You miss the point of it all Soulfighter, let's give you some scenarios.
Let's say your guild works tirelessly getting diamonds for resist gear, leveling the much needed classes, and finally breaking into a new zone, and after some trial and error you manage to drop a raid mob. By the time you're breaking the guilds that are lagging behind are complaining and rushing along because they too want some of that planar action. You get a scenario where your guild is putting in effort but is getting fucked out of that effort because zerg guilds of 80+ people are bind rushing a mob to kill it, it creates a lackluster group of end gamers who drudge along slowly who would rather have things handed to them than actually earn it. My view is if you want that raid mob bad enough you'll park a ranger there and check periodically if it is up, and you go by the old rule of first come, first serve. There should be no magical list of order to maintain civility because that just slows progression even further by creating a rut in terms of guild accessibility to end game content. To be honest it's not a PVP only mentality to compete with other guilds, PVE servers had their fair share of uber guilds wrecking raid mobs as soon as the spawned until they farmed nearly everything possible then moved on to harder content. This is classic, classic was all about assembling your raid forces at a moments notice to tag a mob before another guild prepared, some servers like Brell tried to implement some faggy "Rules of order" and that totally bit them in the ass in the end I'd say if your guild is crying about how they're not getting their "fair share" of Naggy drops and try to change the whole dynamics of first come,first serve while they zerg themselves down 2-3 levels in failed attempts. Then expect later on for high profile mobs to be wielding glowing black swords and haste weapons | ||
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#18
12-16-2009, 08:03 AM
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Have you talked to Furor "Balls to the wall" Planedefiler about raid conduct and intra-guild conflict? Live conduct is one thing, but ask any leader or member from any end game raiding guild about why rotations wont work. Hell, even the GM's on live allowed the first guild to tag the mob gets it policy. Even if guild #1 was loaded with every piece of gear possible from the planes, and guild #2 was still trying to rock them in Solro/guk loot, if guild #1 got the first hit, it's legally theirs. Just like if you took your 6 man group to foreman room and you called it first, it works in the same principle for raids, just on a larger scale. | |||
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#19
12-16-2009, 08:20 AM
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i can't really answer anything else in your post since it's just some basic trolling "guilds that are lagging behind are complaining" "while they zerg themselves down 2-3 levels in failed attempts." " your guild is crying about how they're not getting their "fair share" of Naggy " | |||
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#20
12-16-2009, 08:23 AM
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Here. I will lay it all out on the table...
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1. IB was the first guild to peak and basically was killing all the raid targets with absolutely no competition. IB - Happy Trans - Sad 2. Server got DDoS'd which caused us to be down for a few days. Naggy was supposed to spawn in those few days which meant that as soon as the server came up, Naggy was spawned and ready. Trans was the first guild there and attempted Naggy and failed initially. IB showed up and wanted to "leapfrog" them because they were ready to go and Trans had not gotten rebuffed yet. I told them that Trans was there first and had every right to give it another shot. After the attempt that I watched there was still no IB in the zone. IB - Sad Trans - Happy 3. My memory is a little foggy here so I can't remember if Trans got the next Naggy or if IB did. Basically the next occurrence I remember was Trans showing up two hours early for Nagafen to claim the spawn. They were the first raid force there and had every right to get the first attempt. IB - Sad Trans - Happy 4. IB decides that they want to play this game as well. They showed up five hours early to kill FGs and claim the camp. Transcendence showed up in the zone and I asked them to move along as IB was there before just like in the past incident. IB gets the right to do Nagafen first. IB - Happy Trans - Sad 5. Trans decided to up the ante. Trans shows up eight hours early for Vox so that they can claim the spawn. This is starting to get a little bit ridiculous and became clear that the guilds just couldn't get along. Trans got to claim Vox. IB - Sad Trans - Happy 6. Trans decides to put an exclamation mark on the current system. They showed up fourteen hours early for Nagafen's spawn. IB is completely incensed and decide "as a guild," as I have been told over and over, that the system they have been following for weeks should no longer apply to them. IB passed Trans (who have been ready to go for 14 hours) and decides they were going to sit in Nagafen's lair 20 minutes before he is supposed to spawn. This is when the rotation went into place.. ................. So let's go through these instances that happened over these weeks. I talked to Otto individually. I talked to Allizia individually. I talked to Otto and Allizia together. Aeolwind talked to them together. We tried our best to help you guys sort out a solution. We tried our best to get you guys to work out a compromise. Contrary to popular belief, Trans never came to me and suggested a rotation. Contrary to the tin foil hat perched atop your head, Trans never made the rules. It is actually pretty hilarious. Is IB so soon to forget all the people claiming we were feeding IB all this info and favortism? Remember how much that was bullshit and you guys knew the truth that we weren't doing you guys any favors? This is the same fucking bullshit. We aren't doing anything for Trans. I will tell you this though. If Trans wanted a rotation, I guess they lucked out because it certainly is the most fair way to handle things. Your guys' suggestion of "Whoever does the most damage gets the kill," is not a system that we are going to operate under. Consider raid targets part of the PNP rules is basically what we asked you guys. Don't kill steal, don't camp steal and just make ethical decisions. While Trans is at fault as well by taking the system we were using to the extreme, I feel that IB's method for solving this issue of: Ignore it and just let us both engage the raid mob is completely unethical. This is a PVP mentality and has no place on this server. When a guild is there preparing for a raid. Leave them alone, move on to another target or do something else. Every server had different guidelines for following raids. Some servers (apparently) were allowed to just zerg raid targets and whoever got the kill got it. Some servers operated under a guild-enforced rotation. Others just respected each other and let guilds who got there first take the target. Is a GM-enforced rotation where we wanted to go? Hell no. We wanted nothing to do with this garbage but you guys left us no choice. Rotation was the most fair way to handle it. Because guess what... IB still gets raid targets. And if you want the truth, there is no way that IB was going to win under the system we were operating under before. You wanted the system changed... you got it changed. Congrats. Between school, keeping my own play characters at least somewhere with the pace of the rest of the server, and baby sitting you guys... I don't have time to do ANY fixes. Every day I am dealing with talking to someone from one of the two guilds over something. Seriously guys, I do this as a donation of my time. The last thing I want to do with my volunteer time is sort out these guild issues. | ||||||
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Last edited by Wenai; 12-16-2009 at 08:26 AM..
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