"Fair and legitimate chance at a target" (cont)

[Daldaen]

Originally Posted by Nexii [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Can someone expand on what Sirken meant by players promising to stop the sock? As far as I understand your only options to get a raid kill are to sock or by player agreement. It seems a little idealistic to think that 100% of guilds will reach agreement for 100% of raid targets.

This is what confused me...

Players agreed to stop socking. That was back in 96-hour Variance era with just Velious targets, no rules even about FTEing a mob with a tracker on the spawn.

A lot has evolved since then. Specifically the racing rules in ToV and Kael now allow for a full hour to kill your mob. Which in turn reduces socking. If you want there to be less people sitting around waiting to race, I guarantee you every guild would sign up to a 2 Racer limit if the Variance gets dropped to 2 hours. Then the socking that would occur would be 2 racers per guilds and a ranger. Hell im sure guilds would agree to give up bind sight tracking if the variance reduction was on the table.

Suggesting it is off the table because socking didn't stop... when you're referring to a period of 3 years with multiple rule changes over that time? I just don't follow.

[Daldaen]

Just Kunark targets** stupid no edit.

[Whirled]

concede

[Nexii]

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This is what confused me...

Players agreed to stop socking. That was back in 96-hour Variance era with just Velious targets, no rules even about FTEing a mob with a tracker on the spawn.

A lot has evolved since then. Specifically the racing rules in ToV and Kael now allow for a full hour to kill your mob. Which in turn reduces socking. If you want there to be less people sitting around waiting to race, I guarantee you every guild would sign up to a 2 Racer limit if the Variance gets dropped to 2 hours. Then the socking that would occur would be 2 racers per guilds and a ranger. Hell im sure guilds would agree to give up bind sight tracking if the variance reduction was on the table.

Suggesting it is off the table because socking didn't stop... when you're referring to a period of 3 years with multiple rule changes over that time? I just don't follow.

I've only raided under post Velious rules. Yes, they do seem strange to me. So too many players were socking under raid bosses, so instead guilds had to start at the zoneline. Yet there's no limit to the number of runners.

[Vallanor]

I'm not sure I really understand what exactly is being poopsocked these days? In ToV, the only people in zone during repop days are racers and a handful of AFK people. Is he talking about people standing at the race line waiting on a spawn? That doesn't seem like a poopsock to me. I think of a poopsock as an entire kill force logged in ready to go. With racing, there is really not benefit to doing that.

The only mobs I know that are poopsocked by that definition are fear golems and Severilous, and only a couple guilds are putting themselves through that ordeal (why, I don't know).

Maybe I'm missing something?

[nyclin]

my real question is why the staff would even care about socking in the first place.. it doesn't affect them in the slightest

now, unclear rules & what seems like an obsession with being Arbiter of Fun.. that creates work for the staff

[FatMice]

My respect for Sirken has been elevated to new levels.

[kotton05]

Pretty much these newbies don't know how shit it was before most these rules

[bigjerry]

now imagine if everything was in the open how much more fun this could be

i blame copyright law

[Gimp]

Repops are never addressed in those posts.

Kinda annoying.