The Omega Proposal

[Maner]

Originally Posted by Orloc [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This is a logical fallacy - courts of law are not about proofing ones logic. They are about presenting ones argument in a way which sways the juries perspective on the issue resulting in a resolution.

This man is on the right track.

To the gentlemen who referenced "you casuals". I didn't know logging on every day - playing for 4-6 hours and all day on the weekend put me in this bucket. ( seems pretty hardcore in fact ).

I have had many encounters with A/A - and EVEN YOUR MEMBERS acknowledge how shitty some of the people you harbor are.

There are plenty of nice folks who really do want to share / help foster a more cooperative positive community on p99 - but have caved under the pressure A/A puts on the server and have joined your ranks for lack of a "better alternative" to achieve their personal goals.

Lets get the facts straight =) A/A has the horrible reputation they have for a reason- and there are plenty of documented instances / reoccurring events that even GM's have called out in your numerous bans.

Integrity = not the goals you achieve , but how you go about achieving them.

So have some - and admit where you could improve / cooperate.

Yours truly,
That "casual" guy who is probably a better player than half the zerg force A/A uses to keel there merbs =)

Which is why you object on grounds of relevance. You're arguement is the same as finding someone guilty because someone else like him committed a crime in the past. A/A are two different entireties and youre combining their offenses which is a fallacy and just plain dumb.

You say things like I have had interactions with, and our members, but now one knows who you are and what guild you're referring to. The horrible reputation you speak of is due to people like you reading the forums and having biased opinions from the onset. Just logging onto the server doesn't entitle you to anything.

It's funny that you think there are "Better" players in this game. There is a very obvious skill cap in EQ and it doesn't take anything resembling a good gamer to reach that cap. No one is pressuring you to do or not to do anything. The bar is there and is easily reachable for anyone wanting to start raiding. The problem is people like you don't want to even try reaching that bar. You would rather blame the people who do commit stupid amounts of time to tracking because you can't. The problem is your idea of a better alternative is only better for you and the people like you. who like you refuse to commit the time to compete in the raid scene.

[Bones]

Originally Posted by Comoc1 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Just be happy we get suspended and you casuals get free pixels

Yeah the casuals are zoning into ToV right now and sirken is summoning dragons to their raid groups and deathtouching them for free loot

you guys are missing out

[Lhancelot]

Originally Posted by Maner [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Which is why you object on grounds of relevance. You're arguement is the same as finding someone guilty because someone else like him committed a crime in the past. A/A are two different entireties and youre combining their offenses which is a fallacy and just plain dumb.

You say things like I have had interactions with, and our members, but now one knows who you are and what guild you're referring to. The horrible reputation you speak of is due to people like you reading the forums and having biased opinions from the onset. Just logging onto the server doesn't entitle you to anything.

It's funny that you think there are "Better" players in this game. There is a very obvious skill cap in EQ and it doesn't take anything resembling a good gamer to reach that cap. No one is pressuring you to do or not to do anything. The bar is there and is easily reachable for anyone wanting to start raiding. The problem is people like you don't want to even try reaching that bar. You would rather blame the people who do commit stupid amounts of time to tracking because you can't. The problem is your idea of a better alternative is only better for you and the people like you. who like you refuse to commit the time to compete in the raid scene.

I was going to be insultive and rude, but instead have opted to simply express my irrelevant opinion. This sounds bad, Maner. You are better than this.

[Pokesan]

Originally Posted by Lhancelot [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I was going to be insultive and rude, but instead have opted to simply express my irrelevant opinion. This sounds bad, Maner. You are better than this.

no, he's not.

[temporalrift]

Originally Posted by Detoxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Who are you

Not willing to disclose my identity for fear of reprisal. Also not going to provide you with any information about myself as this post is about your guilds and Awakened misdeeds, not my own. You've ruined your own lands, you'll not ruin mine!

Originally Posted by Daldaen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Anon poster is anon.

If you want to be taken seriously in Lawyerquest you need to have a reputation behind your name. Post from your main account and we can talk about disbanding A/A.

Why do you want to know who I am so badly? Is it so you harass me in game, breaking another server rule, and attempt to ruin my gaming experience like you have proven so capable of doing for so many others? Most likely! Some more evidence to support my proposal.

Originally Posted by Detoxx [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Im disbanding Aftermath when I get home. This rule was unknown to me and I feel I need to be held accountable for my guilds actions. Will Awakened follow suit?

The idea of this proposal is to have the server Administrators be the ones to disband your guild and censor you and your officers as well as the GM and officers of Awakened. In order to set a precedent that your shitty behavior will not be tolerated. If you were to disband your guild now it would render any potential judgement of the retribution we seek for you and your ilk moot.

Originally Posted by Maner [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You would make a terrible lawyer. Using evidence against one group to prove the wrongdoing of another is a fallacy.

The evidence implicates both Awakened and Afterlife. Their members both have track records of breaking the rules in their current incarnations. Additionally their members actions while members of other guilds have proven my point over time that they habitually violate the rules of the server. I guess the Administrators of the server perceive this to be 'Classic EverQuest'?

Originally Posted by Sadiki [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Please stop this nonsense. If we're disbanding one guild we need to disband them all. Let's start this server over from scratch.

Indeed, the thought did cross my mind regarding disbanding all guilds as it is inherently clear that once the abused take the reins they tend to become the abusers, but I believe this will set the precedent that the behavior of these guilds (Awakened and Afterlife) is unacceptable and should any future guilds behave in the same nature, they too, along with their officers and guild leaders should be censored from forming their own guilds or raiding as their behavior trickles down to their members. It all starts at the top. However, I don't know if starting the server over from scratch makes so much sense. These same pieces of shit will just shit all over everyone as a level 35 in lguk instead of as a level 60 in tov. So no, I'll pass on that.

Originally Posted by Comoc1 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Just be happy we get suspended and you casuals get free pixels. 2/3 of am suspensions were conflicts with aw. Also be happy Sirken sat on our suspension until he had one to give to Awakened.

Only then did he simultaneously press both suspension post buttons at the exact same second, granting not one, but two repops to you all.

With this logic, one can only wonder why not a single positive post has been volunteered in context of defending your guild or Awakened. This isn't about you guys getting pixels over everyone else, it's about your guilds consistently breaking the rules of the server, so stop breaking the rules.

[derpcake]

noone important gives a fuck and nothing is going to change

trying to prevent further pointless keyboard wear on your behalf here

[Orloc]

Originally Posted by Maner [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Which is why you object on grounds of relevance. You're arguement is the same as finding someone guilty because someone else like him committed a crime in the past. A/A are two different entireties and youre combining their offenses which is a fallacy and just plain dumb.

You say things like I have had interactions with, and our members, but now one knows who you are and what guild you're referring to. The horrible reputation you speak of is due to people like you reading the forums and having biased opinions from the onset. Just logging onto the server doesn't entitle you to anything.

It's funny that you think there are "Better" players in this game. There is a very obvious skill cap in EQ and it doesn't take anything resembling a good gamer to reach that cap. No one is pressuring you to do or not to do anything. The bar is there and is easily reachable for anyone wanting to start raiding. The problem is people like you don't want to even try reaching that bar. You would rather blame the people who do commit stupid amounts of time to tracking because you can't. The problem is your idea of a better alternative is only better for you and the people like you. who like you refuse to commit the time to compete in the raid scene.

I'll address these one at a time - putting aside the name calling - which I wont take any offense to as you clearly misunderstood my intent.

"A/A are two different entireties" (entities) Absolutely - but the represent the same ideal and thus are equally relevant here.

"The horrible reputation you speak of is due to people like you reading the forums and having biased opinions from the onset. Just logging onto the server doesn't entitle you to anything. " - I have played here since 2011, I left the server because of guilds "like" A/A ( back then it was TMO et al ). I am sure some names have changed but again - see point 1

"Just logging onto the server doesn't entitle you to anything." - this one is funny, and very presumptuous. All people put time into things they care about - I have had all the same sleepless nights camping things as the rest of any serious EverQuest player - Everyone has equal entitlement - we all earn our lewts no one "owns" anything except for the people facilitating this wonderful game we all are trying to get the most out of. I hope you let that one sink in a bit.

"It's funny that you think there are "Better" players in this game." - is this so funny? Everyone who reads this I am sure has grouped with "good" and "not so good" players from every class there is. Sure a lot of the mechanics in EQ are straight forward and very well known - but there is a certain finesse and knowledge base required to be "Great" - along with countless hours of farming gears.

"The problem is people like you don't want to even try reaching that bar" - You don't know anything about me - or the effort I put into everything I do - I am also not sure what imaginary bar you are speaking about? There are very concrete requirements to complete raid content.

And finally

"The problem is your idea of a better alternative is only better for you and the people like you. who like you refuse to commit the time to compete in the raid scene." - My (I speak for more than myself) Idea of better involved a less toxic - more productive - generally healthier community which cooperated with each other. I think you would be hard pressed to find evidence against this being a good thing.


You have made my point very clear - and for that I thank you.

I will leave you with this.

"With great power - comes great responsibility" - Awakened and Aftermath are two of the strongest guilds on the server and in a large way shape the ecosystem. The entire community has been asking ( begging ? ) for a more equal playing field for years now. It has been met with trolls - blatant refusal and general dismissal.

This speaks to the perceived character and general reputation people have come to expect from A/A - I think this forum thread represents a continued disapproval from the larger community and deserves to be heard and acted upon.

[t3kn34k]

Originally Posted by temporalrift [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

The evidence implicates both Awakened and Afterlife.
both Awakened and Afterlife

[You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

For what it's worth, I support rap battles to determine FTE

[Swish]

Originally Posted by Bones [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Yeah the casuals are zoning into ToV right now and sirken is summoning dragons to their raid groups and deathtouching them for free loot

you guys are missing out

Must admit I chuckled [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[kotton05]

Originally Posted by t3kn34k [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

For what it's worth, I support rap battles to determine FTE

Only during your playtime right? ..|..