The beta server needs more user support.

[Byrjun]

So I watched Sirken's stream recently and the discussion between him and Durubael pretty much echoed what Swish says in 90% of his posts - that the P99 playerbase is lazy and everyone wants Velious to be finished without putting any effort into testing it.

I feel that this is a gross misinterpretation of what's actually happening. The real problem is that there is absolutely no support for players to beta test. When software/games are in testing phases, they don't just shove an entire product on someone and say "go test everything." The result would be ineffectual testing and a bad product.

So, I'm asking the P99 developers to help us.

A) We need direction. On Sirken's stream it was stated that no one has done anything and everyone should be doing everything. Like I mentioned, this is the worst way to frame a beta test. For example, let's say I want to test the Circlet of Falinkan quest. That's quite a lot of time/effort that would be wasted since I know that quest has been completed.

So we need some sort of official post that says hey, this is Siren's Grotto week. Make people go group/test in Siren's Grotto for that week, and create a centralized thread for people to discuss their thoughts on the zone. I'd definitely schedule some time to go group with some people in that zone, but that stuff needs to be coordinated. Then after Siren's Grotto week we could have Coldain Ring week where everyone works on that quest, or a Skyshrine week where people hunt in that zone (with knowledge that faction would be reset afterwards). Very little developer overhead would produce great testing results.

B) Faction is a huge pain in the ass in Velious. And it's 10x worse on the beta server because there are no raid mobs up. In "real Velious" if you needed Tormax faction you'd go tag a Yelinak kill, etc. Our only option at the moment is endless grinding.

Recently I logged on to the server to try out the Coldain ring and realized I was still only Apprehensive in Thurgadin so I couldn't even start. I pretty much logged out right after that. I've done Kael arena with my guild a few different nights which didn't seem to move my faction, now there's even less people on the server so I'd be forced to solo for my faction, which could take weeks. This isn't really going to work for people.

So, two big requests. Targeted testing with discussion, and some sort of solution to get around the grind. Some additional support/commands like maybe #buff to get full raid buffs would be nice also.

[SamwiseRed]

/beta doesnt work. alot of us cant test anything atm.

[Halius]

I stated in a previous thread that I would love to help but I am only level 20. Would love to see a level buff implemented so that I could help out. It's not like I will be able to keep the character anyways, I just want to be able to help out in my spare time.

[JayN]

how about they spawn some raid content; you can only test the same trash so many times!

[Cyrano]

Putting a focus on things would help. It would just take a weekly post stickied here saying "Please focus on these zones and these quests" or whatever.

[Auvdar]

So I watched Sirken's stream recently and the discussion between him and Durubael pretty much echoed what Swish says in 90% of his posts - that the P99 playerbase is lazy and everyone wants Velious to be finished without putting any effort into testing it.

I feel that this is a gross misinterpretation of what's actually happening. The real problem is that there is absolutely no support for players to beta test. When software/games are in testing phases, they don't just shove an entire product on someone and say "go test everything." The result would be ineffectual testing and a bad product.

So, I'm asking the P99 developers to help us.

A) We need direction. On Sirken's stream it was stated that no one has done anything and everyone should be doing everything. Like I mentioned, this is the worst way to frame a beta test. For example, let's say I want to test the Circlet of Falinkan quest. That's quite a lot of time/effort that would be wasted since I know that quest has been completed.

So we need some sort of official post that says hey, this is Siren's Grotto week. Make people go group/test in Siren's Grotto for that week, and create a centralized thread for people to discuss their thoughts on the zone. I'd definitely schedule some time to go group with some people in that zone, but that stuff needs to be coordinated. Then after Siren's Grotto week we could have Coldain Ring week where everyone works on that quest, or a Skyshrine week where people hunt in that zone (with knowledge that faction would be reset afterwards). Very little developer overhead would produce great testing results.

B) Faction is a huge pain in the ass in Velious. And it's 10x worse on the beta server because there are no raid mobs up. In "real Velious" if you needed Tormax faction you'd go tag a Yelinak kill, etc. Our only option at the moment is endless grinding.

Recently I logged on to the server to try out the Coldain ring and realized I was still only Apprehensive in Thurgadin so I couldn't even start. I pretty much logged out right after that. I've done Kael arena with my guild a few different nights which didn't seem to move my faction, now there's even less people on the server so I'd be forced to solo for my faction, which could take weeks. This isn't really going to work for people.

So, two big requests. Targeted testing with discussion, and some sort of solution to get around the grind. Some additional support/commands like maybe #buff to get full raid buffs would be nice also.

Honestly this. No direction. No idea on what is working correctly so you don't waste time. The faction bottleneck with no raid bosses to help curb that (or a faction bump toggle). Honestly I was in Beta for a bit when it opened, but without any kind of direction and no real tools to properly test anything, I simply moved back to FFXIV.

[Shiftin]

This is a really great post that I agree with fully. I've done the same as Byr and fought in the arena to try to raise faction, helped build bug reports, done PoG raids, etc. Even if I didn't submit them, my hands are on plenty of reports because I was in the groups where they were found and discussed but I can't do jack as a solo rogue.

I'm not going to grind to ally via trash mobs to test quests, and until raid mobs / TOV are open, there's a ton that's untestable.

You couldn't test the ring war if you tried because there's a component not dropping for 8th ring right now.

Again, because everyone seems to have forgotten, the raid content on Kunark release was insanely broken. Just off the top of my head:

- Trakanon went to 3-4 patches alone of tuning. He was using the wrong abilities, missing abilities, had goofy AC and hit values, etc.
- VS needed significant tuning
- VP wasn't released for 6? 7? months after release and with a ton of errors. Hoshkar wasn't AEing, the zone was flagged indoors, doors weren't locked that should have been, pathing was hilarious, etc.

Extrapolate this number of bugged encounters to the 5-10x as many raid encounters in Velious. Why does this approach make sense? Because you don't want us learning how to beat the 14 year old content? Come on

Most of this could have been corrected with an organized testing effort, and some of it was even bug reported via the few ways we did attempt to test Trakanon, with Nirron's GM buffs and logs, but the attitude of "well just level to 60, gear up, and tell us if anything is wrong, and if you don't, you're lazy" was crazy insulting then, just like "you aren't testing velious despite massive artificial roadblocks, no testing plan or direction, and no assistance - YOU'RE LAZY" is insulting today.

[nilbog]

Not sure what all the hostility is about, but I made this post yesterday.

Pending update:

Added Box of the Void, mana batteries, and jade inlaid coffins to one of the giant gnome vendors.

Speaking to the gnomes will allow some faction utilities. Following their prompts, you can check your kromzek, coldain, or clawsofveeshan faction standings. Additional prompts allow you to increase or decrease these factions in small increments. This should help people trying to quest under certain requirements, and people testing faction in general. You can max a faction or bottom it out, then be able to test gains or losses more easily.

Regarding other tools to assist with testing, I'm open to suggestions.

[Daldaen]

How tedious is "small increments" to max any faction?

It's this something we have to sit there and spam for a few hours? Could you implement a way to instantly max each of the main factions in addition to incremental faction hits?

Also a list of things needing testing is the primary thing people are interested in. I think just a week-long "Velketor's Test" would be good. List all quest drops / named involved in the zone and have people test away. At the end of the week check off that drop rates were checked, named spawns were checked, mob difficulty/resists were checked and spawn Velketor / Lord Bob for testing. Then end week o' Velketor. Start Week o' Great Divide. Repeat.

[nilbog]

How tedious is "small increments" to max any faction?

It's this something we have to sit there and spam for a few hours? Could you implement a way to instantly max each of the main factions in addition to incremental faction hits?


50 at a time. So, 40 times either way. 40 seconds I guess, depending on your fingers.

[Nirgon]

Methinks you need a few appointed testers with GM powers to really speed things along.

You got some people making very well organized tests and results but imagine how many quests they could bang out with the ability to spawn items/npcs and hand things in.

I wouldn't give this to everyone on the beta server, but people who are really showing drive in banging out quests could really use it.

(I'm more interested in a few existing odds and ends before moving in on Velious beta.. mechanics > content imo)

[BattleToad]

Pending update:

Added Box of the Void, mana batteries, and jade inlaid coffins to one of the giant gnome vendors.

Speaking to the gnomes will allow some faction utilities.

Awesome!

Methinks you need a few appointed testers with GM powers to really speed things along.


Hit me!

[Daldaen]

Okay 40 clicks is reasonable. I'll be sure to do that and check out some quests.

Also the armor quest gems are somewhat of a crap shoot getting them to drop. Any chance a vendor could be made that sells them:

Melee - Warrior, Rogue, Monk, Ranger, Shadowknight, Paladin, Bard
Priest - Cleric, Druid, Shaman
Caster - Wizard, Enchanter, Mage

Black Marble - Priest Breastplate
Chipped Onyx Sapphire - Priest Legs
Crushed Black Marble - Melee Boots
Crushed Coral - Melee Helmet
Crushed Flame Emerald - Melee Bracer, Priest Boots
Crushed Flame Opal - Caster Helm
Crushed Jaundice Gem - Caster Boots
Crushed Lava Ruby - Priest Gloves
Crushed Onyx Sapphire - Priest Helm, Caster Bracer
Crushed Opal - Priest Bracer
Crushed Topaz - Melee Gloves, Caster Gloves
Flawed Emerald - Melee Arms
Flawed Sea Sapphire - Melee Legs
Flawed Topaz - Caster Arms
Flawless Diamond - Melee Breastplate
Jaundiced Gem - Priest Arms
Nephrite - Caster legs
Pristine Emerald - Caster Breastplate

I have an eroded leather piece or two. I'd like to see after incremental faction increases the bare minimum on a turnin... But I can't get the gems. Atleast without grinding velks solo for 100s of hours solo praying for the gem I need.

[Ele]

But I can't get the gems. Atleast without grinding velks solo for 100s of hours solo praying for the gem I need.

a couple of bug reports are in about gem drops everywhere, but they haven't been addressed yet.

gem vendor to test at least the thurgadin quests would be nice, since we can't get tov drops yet.

[Shiftin]

Not sure what all the hostility is about, but I made this post yesterday.



Regarding other tools to assist with testing, I'm open to suggestions.

Not trying to come off as hostile, just frustrated. I had no idea you had made that post - I'd expect to see posts of a major testing announcement nature like that somewhere more visible but I'm excited this is in and I'll definitely be back on Beta tonight. This post was started because the servers own GMs/Guides are talking crap about the players for not testing, even though the stuff in this thread had been brought up several times.

I think a specific focus on testing schedule would be super helpful. If I know I can log on and there will be a few groups crawling through Velks or SG or something that night I can lend my DPS to, i'm way more likely to get on and do that. Even if i don't specifically know that zone well, I can lend my DPS to their efforts.

[Splorf22]

+1. I'm sure if you had a post with 'please test x, y, and z' up those things would get crossed off sooner rather than later. I was actually talking to Bier and we'd both be down to play beta but I had (and have) zero ideas how to do anything useful there.

[Lyrith]

Nilbog thanks for the improvements to the gnomes with factions! I'm actually excited to get on and see if I cannot complete a set of dwarf armor if I can find a tank and some dps to play with and farm gear.

I hate to beat a dead horse, but everyone is always bitching (I mean expressing nicely) how they want EXP BONUS weeks/weekends on Blue99. Why doesn't the staff implement some strat like Dal mentioned for when certain things are fully tested the normal servers get an EXP Buff.

Lame I know, but it might just be enough to draw more interest over. And obviously if some raid content was around you would have 200+ more people over since everything is dead within 30 seconds on the blue server as well...

[BattleToad]

50 at a time. So, 40 times either way. 40 seconds I guess, depending on your fingers.

Will there be an item that works like this for other reps as well?

Like the Chetari and Paebela rats in Dragon Necropolis, or Tormax/Dain/Yelinak.

I'd also suggest a teleport NPC for getting across Siren's Grotto, and in addition to the Thurgadin Gate staff a "Cobalt Scar" Gate Staff.

The staffs should be bound to you on death like Sebelis/HS keys.

I keep ending up in dumb situations where I die in Eastern Wastes and I'm bound outside DN and can't do anything about it.

[nilbog]

Will there be an item that works like this for other reps as well?

It's not an item that can do it. I wrote it in perl, so the npcs can handle it by request.

It is possible to add additional factions to this, but it does take time.

Pending update:
-Added the Velious Beta gnomes to the bridge in thurgadina
-Staff of Betas are now soulbound

[nilbog]

A few people have sent me PMs regarding npc leveling scripts, spell scribers etc.

Here are my issues:
-The leveling is no problem, but you won't have the correct skills for your level.
Setting skills for level is more complicated.
-Spell scribing is no problem, but you will have spells, and copies of spells that you will never see in game. For example, there are multiple copies of certain spells. This leads to bug reports that are non-issues. Since old zones are not included in the beta, you also can't return home to buy them.

If anyone has suggestions about the above, I will consider them.

Other things I'm considering:
-Adding a vendor for quest gems
-A porting npc, that will take you to requested velious zones.

[Kekephee]

/beta doesnt work. alot of us cant test anything atm.


Yeah. I logged out dead the last time I was on beta, so until I can recopy my dude I can't help. I understand they're going to put the beta copy server whatever back up when they've made some changes, so I'm just waiting for that.

[arsenalpow]

Vandy had pretty solid leveling and skillup bots on his server. Maybe that's worth a look?

[Auvdar]

That's all awesome stuff Nilbog and thank you!

[nilbog]

Pending update:

Added a 'Velious Teleports and Bind' npc at the nro docks, as well as the thurgadina bridge. It will send you to the currently testable Velious zones, and/or bind you upon request.

[Sirken]

Pending update:

Added a 'Velious Teleports and Bind' npc at the nro docks, as well as the thurgadina bridge. It will send you to the currently testable Velious zones, and/or bind you upon request.

pras nilbog

[Nirgon]

That's what I'm talkin bout bruh

Pras The Berg, all hail the High Priest

[SamwiseRed]

nilbog any ETA on when /beta will work again. cant get my toons on beta.

[nilbog]

nilbog any ETA on when /beta will work again. cant get my toons on beta.

Rogean working on it.

[heals4reals]

Rogean working on it.

goo1

[SamwiseRed]

Rogean working on it.

pras

[Aussie]

Hi folks, /beta appears to be working now

[Kekephee]

Hi folks, /beta appears to be working now


Thanks, Aussie! Copying over. Will play later tonight and try to nab a couple bugs. Any suggestions on some zones or mobs that people haven't really been touching so far on beta?

[Lyrith]

Big things happening in this thread!

[Laugher]

Hi folks, /beta appears to be working now

Yuss and I just got a fungi! Time to copy the rogue :D

[JayN]

how about they spawn some raid content; you can only test the same trash so many times!

any chance at giving everyone max faction everywhere so we can test quests or something close to this?

farming trash over and over again isnt great testing

[Aussie]

any chance at giving everyone max faction everywhere so we can test quests or something close to this?

farming trash over and over again isnt great testing

It doesn't add Raid NPC's - but faction is now easy to max/bottom out

Pending update:

Added Box of the Void, mana batteries, and jade inlaid coffins to one of the giant gnome vendors.

Speaking to the gnomes will allow some faction utilities. Following their prompts, you can check your kromzek, coldain, or clawsofveeshan faction standings. Additional prompts allow you to increase or decrease these factions in small increments. This should help people trying to quest under certain requirements, and people testing faction in general. You can max a faction or bottom it out, then be able to test gains or losses more easily.

[maximum]

A few people have sent me PMs regarding npc leveling scripts, spell scribers etc.

Here are my issues:
-The leveling is no problem, but you won't have the correct skills for your level.
Setting skills for level is more complicated.
-Spell scribing is no problem, but you will have spells, and copies of spells that you will never see in game. For example, there are multiple copies of certain spells. This leads to bug reports that are non-issues. Since old zones are not included in the beta, you also can't return home to buy them.

If anyone has suggestions about the above, I will consider them.

Other things I'm considering:
-Adding a vendor for quest gems
-A porting npc, that will take you to requested velious zones.

Can we get faction modifiers for

* KingTormax
* DainFrostreaverIV
* Yelinak

[element08]

Not sure if this has been brought up but I /beta'd my mage over today, was logged in neriak. When I popped into the beta server I was in nro & bound there as expected, but was stuck under the world. I gated out, but not sure if re-logging would fix or if anyone else had this happen.

[littlebobby3]

Not sure if this has been brought up but I /beta'd my mage over today, was logged in neriak. When I popped into the beta server I was in nro & bound there as expected, but was stuck under the world. I gated out, but not sure if re-logging would fix or if anyone else had this happen.

This happend to me as well but I gated and was in front of the velious vendors in nro.. Only seems to happen when the character is fresh /beta also the vendors have staffs to port to thurg and the portal vendor if hailed can teleport you to the various zones

[Ennewi]

Not sure if this has been brought up but I /beta'd my mage over today, was logged in neriak. When I popped into the beta server I was in nro & bound there as expected, but was stuck under the world. I gated out, but not sure if re-logging would fix or if anyone else had this happen.

This happened with the first additional character I beta copied over after the fix. Unfortunately the character doesn't have gate and, even though a ranger, I can't find a way to kill myself and respawn. Relogging didn't fix the issue. All other characters copied over don't have this problem though.

[Clang]

This happened to me earlier - /rewind popped me back out of the ground.

[Ennewi]

This happened to me earlier - /rewind popped me back out of the ground.

Ah, yeah tried that, unfortunately I moved before thinking to do that so it just relocated my x / y coordinates but not z. Just a heads up to anyone copying over.

[Sylexis]

Can we get faction modifiers for

* KingTormax
* DainFrostreaverIV
* Yelinak

Yea I drug Amax over to Icewell keep and trashed his dain faction so he can't do ring 8+ right now I don't think :p