Bard song and runspeed buffs stacking

[mcoy]

I was browsing through some old logs and found something interesting. Apparently bardspeed wouldn't stack with jboots or sow, and these needed to be clicked off in order for it to stick:

[Sun Nov 11 14:37:25 2001] Your mind clears.
[Sun Nov 11 14:37:31 2001] Your mind clears.
[Sun Nov 11 14:37:34 2001] Beginning to memorize Translocate: Common...
[Sun Nov 11 14:37:35 2001] You have finished memorizing Translocate: Common.
[Sun Nov 11 14:37:37 2001] Your mind clears.
[Sun Nov 11 14:37:39 2001] You tell your party, 'you know the way to velks?'
[Sun Nov 11 14:37:43 2001] Your mind clears.
[Sun Nov 11 14:37:50 2001] You appear.
[Sun Nov 11 14:37:50 2001] Your feet feel quick.
[Sun Nov 11 14:37:50 2001] Dazzeler tells the group, 'think you could log on the bard on Bristlebane so i can get the 4k i have on him so i can try to buy some stuff since your playing?'
[Sun Nov 11 14:37:56 2001] Dazzeler tells the group, 'yeah follow me'
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:09 2001] You will now auto-follow Dazzeler.
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:09 2001] *WARNING*: Do NOT use around lava, water, cliffs, or other dangerous areas because you WILL fall into them. You have been warned.
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:09 2001] Also, auto-follow works best in wide open areas with low lag. Twisty areas, lag, and other factors may cause auto-follow to fail.
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:21 2001] You tell your party, 'hey your song isn't workin'
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:21 2001] Iandaar says out of character, 'does gralk dwarfkiller dropanyting good?'
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:21 2001] You are no longer auto-following Dazzeler.
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:24 2001] a young shardwurm scowls at you, ready to attack -- You would probably win this fight..it's not certain though.
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:30 2001] Dazzeler tells the group, 'working for me'
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:32 2001] Dazzeler tells the group, 'you have sow?'
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:39 2001] Dazzeler tells you, 'or Jboots on?'
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:42 2001] You tell your party, 'where'd you go'
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:44 2001] You tell your party, 'booties'
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:48 2001] Magusbane says out of character, 'not sure'
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:49 2001] Your feet slow down.
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:50 2001] Jacobinus says out of character, 'depends'
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:51 2001] Dazzeler tells the group, 'turn em off meet at the ring'
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:51 2001] Magusbane says out of character, 'doubt it'
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:56 2001] You tell your party, 'I'm aty ave 1'
[Sun Nov 11 14:38:59 2001] You tell your party, 'cave 1'
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:10 2001] Zziggy shouts, '44th level bard lfg'
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:11 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:12 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:13 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:15 2001] Dazzeler tells the group, 'ok on way'
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:16 2001] Taliysa shouts, 'looking for a TL or port to NK please, will donate'
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:19 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:20 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:21 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:21 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:21 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:22 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:22 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:23 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:23 2001] Kakarott auctions, 'buying small velium bricks'
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:23 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:24 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:24 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:25 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:25 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:25 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:26 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:26 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:26 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:27 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:27 2001] You begin casting Chill Sight.
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:27 2001] Your Sorcerer's Wristband begins to glow.
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:30 2001] Your eyes tingle.
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:32 2001] Your target is out of range, get closer!
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:34 2001] You begin casting Chill Sight.
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:34 2001] Your Sorcerer's Wristband begins to glow.
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:37 2001] Your eyes tingle.
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:39 2001] Your feet move faster.
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:43 2001] You told Dazzeler, 'wanna see something funny?'
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:45 2001] You begin casting Enticement of Flame.
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:45 2001] Your Sorcerer's Robe begins to glow.
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:45 2001] Your feet move faster.
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:46 2001] Dazzeler tells you, 'sure'
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:47 2001] Iandaar says out of character, 'only meat on him'
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:51 2001] Your feet move faster.
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:57 2001] Your feet move faster.
[Sun Nov 11 14:39:59 2001] Qien twiddles his thumbs.


From what I can see here, I had to click off jboots in order to allow the bard's song to stick on me. On p99 they appear to stack / not overwrite. Just thought I'd add it to the #classic list.

-Mcoy

[Aalderon Crystafire]

I see the text -- but how do we know you didn't just fall behind because you were using auto-follow like a noob? Yeah you didn't bold that part but I see it! Hahaha! <3 Needs more research but it should be easy to find people discussing things like this in old posts. What zone was that in by the way?

[isidian]

I had JBoots on my bard on live in the classic period. To my recollection, I could use Selo's while the JBoots icon was active. But there was also the issue of having too many buffs, so that the whole buff window was blocked off. In this case, no bard song would be added, since the buff box was full.

[mcoy]

I'm guessing GD since I asked about the way to velks and they said to catch up to them at the ring. I didn't often have too many buffs on as a wizard but that's anecdotal obviously.

-Mcoy

[Erati]

bump

Selos Jboots n Sow do not stack

if you had selos you could not have sow/jboots and vice versa as its same buff slot for run speed

Many times I remember losing the bard I was following then being without any speed buffs as you had to click them off as OPs logs suggest

[Brocode]

bump

Selos Jboots n Sow do not stack

if you had selos you could not have sow/jboots and vice versa as its same buff slot for run speed

Many times I remember losing the bard I was following then being without any speed buffs as you had to click them off as OPs logs suggest

yes because a log is so reliable, need to find a patch message

[Rygar]

yes because a log is so reliable, need to find a patch message

Logs are more reliable. Often times there were "stealth updates " not reflected in the message or general messages (i.e. fixed some issues in the stacking code)

[Rygar]

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=1721&p=4#comments
Nov 15 2002 at 1:34 PM

actually procs that stack with other buffs are usually random, I.E. not clicky, don't know if sow overrides the jboot effect, but I do know that if you're wearing these and grouped with a bard TAKE THEM OFF!! even if you're not useing them the fact that you're wearing them will keep selos from sticking on you.. just like if you have a sow on TURN IT OFF!! nothing worse then tring to get to a camp quick with a group and fireing up selos with a MM drum, and haveing to stop every three steps because someone refuses to give up their preasious SOW

Even out of era this was a known issue.

[Pringles]

If you go through the patch notes in the ramp up to Luclin bards started to break very frequently. All the way to late PoP every other patch note has an amusing anecdote of something broken. Selo's and Sow/Jboots are in differing slots then and now so the behavior I'd expect would be them to stack but the highest take precedence. In January, 2003 bard songs were given there own little window to help with the clutter. Could this guy not have been getting you to free up a redundant buff slot so it would have room to stick?

[MiRo2]

Anything cast by a bard whether it was a song, clicked effect, or proc was considered a 'song' and all songs stacked with any 'spells'. I could see run speed being the one exception to this to prevent bards from having Selo's+SoW speed.

[feniin]

Bard run speed, invisibility, and levitate songs always used to overwrite spells. Always thought it was weird on P99 that it didn't.

[Rygar]

If you go through the patch notes in the ramp up to Luclin bards started to break very frequently. All the way to late PoP every other patch note has an amusing anecdote of something broken. Selo's and Sow/Jboots are in differing slots then and now so the behavior I'd expect would be them to stack but the highest take precedence. In January, 2003 bard songs were given there own little window to help with the clutter. Could this guy not have been getting you to free up a redundant buff slot so it would have room to stick?

While I don't doubt bards had buggy periods, I'm pretty convinced sow should block selo during our current patch on server. We have that shown in these logs after final velious patch but before Luclin, end of luclin / PoP, and now during Kunark era (or is this still vanilla EQ?):

1/18/00: (https://groups.google.com/forum/m/#!searchin/alt.games.everquest/Click$20off$20sow$20bard/alt.games.everquest/3e7NqlktaeQ)
There is nothing more annoying when someone asks you to run them
somewhere, FP to HH or other, sure, I'm going that way, you then spend
5mins asking them are you encumbered? *No, do you have SoW? *Yes it RoX
makes me run fast, 'Disband' .. that's the lameness!

It was only an opinion .....


Above quote describes exactly what happened in these logs.

About 2 months ago due to the fact that if you had this on then someone used
Selo's, the SOW would be cancelled out from thereforth.
No no, I meant that the foot would stay on your screen, but from then on, it
would have no effect. *This was a horrible thing, because in places like
cazic, if the bard hit the foot on accident or something, from then on, the
puller had to get sow again yadda yadda, it was quite an annoyance. *Now the
selo's just doesnt show up on your icons if you already have SoW.
Above quotes seems to imply selo used to overwrite sow, but now sow blocks selo. Not sure if dev's would code in the overwrite for first 6 months of refresh, but seems that happened.

Can we call this case closed? Classic behavior seems determined.

[Rygar]

Anything cast by a bard whether it was a song, clicked effect, or proc was considered a 'song' and all songs stacked with any 'spells'. I could see run speed being the one exception to this to prevent bards from having Selo's+SoW speed.

And I don't think bard songs always stacked no matter what, but would always stack so long as there wasn't a specific rule for that song against stacking. Non song clickies the exception, it treated a spell like a song, and since spell had no song stack rule, was allowed to stack.

[kaev]

I remember the sow vs selo's conflict, but I can't for the life of me remember specificly when I learned of it or when it was changed, other than that it was pre-lucy (so prior to 2002) which does make it relevant to p99. Good luck finding the evidence.

[Rygar]

I remember the sow vs selo's conflict, but I can't for the life of me remember specificly when I learned of it or when it was changed, other than that it was pre-lucy (so prior to 2002) which does make it relevant to p99. Good luck finding the evidence.

... try reading through the thread?

[kaev]

... try reading through the thread?

looks p thin to me, glad i'm not the judge tho

[Daldaen]

SoW or JBoots should prevent Selos from landing on a person.

Selos should prevent SoW or JBoots from landing on a person.

This is classic and how it should be. You don't want to exist on an easymode server where bards can just stack two runspeed buffs and eat a dispel on one and continue running fast. That would not be fun or classic.