Binding at pots question

[Rimitto]

so I was thinking about the whole "you cannot bind at pots" argument.
I understand that it can be abused, but here's my counter-argument.

Is anything stopping players from just killing themselves there and having a "stored corpse" for clerics to revive as a form of "bind" ?:rolleyes:

With all the druid rings, magicians, and other teleporting shenanigans out there, it seems kinda silly that the few classes that could use this the most (those without teleports but with bind) are restricted from this the most.

tl;dr - give enchanters the right to bind self at pots so that we can all be happy.
(i'll probably still keep trying to think up ways to screw with pots otherwise, until it becomes easier to use, like druid ports.)

anyways, my real question is this:
Is it really that bad for people to bind at pots now? With all the massive amounts of players doing teleports left and right with alts left and right, is this so much of an issue still or just a biased derogatory viewpoint against solo players?

[mr_jon3s]

This is supposed to be an MMORPG not solo. Thats honestly what made this game so great back in the day was the people.

[Rimitto]

This is supposed to be an MMORPG not solo. Thats honestly what made this game so great back in the day was the people.
then why even have the pots in the game in the first place? why should they exist? :rolleyes:
Clearly they were a dev room product and should be immediately removed. :rolleyes:

[moseman]

You would only be able to rez a corpse for two hours of in game time seems that would be a waste of time then to just ask for a port...

[d3r14k]

You can rez a corpse for up to a week, it just won't be an XP rez. You can always duel another player to create a "no XP loss" body.

Having said that, dying at pots just so you can be rezzed there to get somewhere quicker is extremely counter intuitive. The time it would take to bind at WC rings and get a port to wherever you need is undoubtedly faster.

[Rimitto]

You can rez a corpse for up to a week, it just won't be an XP rez. You can always duel another player to create a "no XP loss" body.

Having said that, dying at pots just so you can be rezzed there to get somewhere quicker is extremely counter intuitive. The time it would take to bind at WC rings and get a port to wherever you need is undoubtedly faster.

I think you've proven my point as to why pots should be released for enchanters... :rolleyes:


not to mention it's canon in the lore that a certain erudian used a certain highway to travel across the land via pots.

[kjs86z]

Remember, OP is the same guy trying to convince the caster forum that charming on an enchanter is a sub-optimal waste of time.

[loramin]

Play on Green. Level your Enchanter in the first year. When Kunark arrives bind yourself there during the brief window when it's possible and never re-bind elsewhere.

Problem solved.

But also, to OP's point, in the Velious era being bound at the pots is significantly less useful that it was in the Kunark era. And of course the Luclin teleporters trivialized travel so much they re-opened binding in that zone.

Still, I'd think most people would agree that in Velious, even though it's far less good, being bound at the pots is still a pretty powerful way to get to all non-Velious content, and that's significant enough to leave the zone blocked (ie. exactly what the live devs actually did).

[Haloren]

I understand that it can be abused

There is your answer. No need for a comma and more text, just that. But, if you want more..

The firepots were never meant to be a main travel system. And would not be classic to become one. It was/is an Easter egg. I believe the real intent for the easter egg was for kunark travelers who want to brave it and maybe cut some boat travel time off in a fun adventure way.

Regardless of the amount of porting available, since you ask why is it a big deal. Do you think the demand for porting stays the same if people bound at pots?

At the time the intent was not to allow an enchanter to travel from the bottom of a kunark/velious dungeon to say the bank in Neriak in a minute with zoning. Not for them selves or for guild mobilization reasons.

You dont need the nexus or pok out in the middle of the water, leave it alone and keep it classy' and stop thinking about the "would it hurt if we made this thing easier" because if anything we need shared banks..... /opens a can of abu'kar

Forgot to add--you didnt mention players with hammers as well. Albeit its not everywhere on the map but being able to use both to go to and fro is like putting a highway through norrath.

I say all this as an player with a gating char bound at the pots.

[Fammaden]

then why even have the pots in the game in the first place? why should they exist? :rolleyes:

Its a way out of one of the most remote and massive zones in the game, which is full of water, and doesn't have any portal locations just boats. It wasn't intended to be an easy way to avoid the reliance on other players for teleportation.

[Rimitto]

Remember, OP is the same guy trying to convince the caster forum that charming on an enchanter is a sub-optimal waste of time.
it is, go back to your highkeep while I take the other 60+ zones in the game that you've never experienced in your tiny little corner sodomizing gargreen or whatever that 0 magic resist jailbait mob is named again. tl;dr.

Play on Green. Level your Enchanter in the first year. When Kunark arrives bind yourself there during the brief window when it's possible and never re-bind elsewhere.

Problem solved.

But also, to OP's point, in the Velious era being bound at the pots is significantly less useful that it was in the Kunark era. And of course the Luclin teleporters trivialized travel so much they re-opened binding in that zone.

Still, I'd think most people would agree that in Velious, even though it's far less good, being bound at the pots is still a pretty powerful way to get to all non-Velious content, and that's significant enough to leave the zone blocked (ie. exactly what the live devs actually did).
I hear your point, but here's my counter-point. Enchanters can't do too much in the ways of messing with other players aside from clarity(which is strong). I'm not suggesting opening it back up to every class, just the ones that matter. :rolleyes:

and yeah, as you said, the pots can only go to mainland areas(save 1 cabalis pot). Everything on velious is out anyways, which means relying on porters or taking the boats like nature intended anyways. Let's be real too, if you're in TD, you're pretty much in kunark ANYWAYS. That's just simple logic. Infact, relooking at all the pot locations now, I am going to argue this harder. The ONLY ports that save any significant non-boat loss time are halas and erudin. nearly every other zone is in sprinting distance. This is no longer an argument about being overpowered but a reward vs time loss argument. I believe that the dangerous trek to said pots is enough of a risk-vs-reward for this ability to bind there.
There are sharks, dragons, and raptors all throughout that zone that could easily dismember someone with 1 false step.

Besides,
the only people that would keep their binds at pots over binding in new zones where they fear death are the types of people who ALREADY have both porters and level 60 clerics lined up in their coffers anyways. It's a moot point to keep it bound-locked at this point... at least for enchanters... :rolleyes:
I'd say necromancers too but I don't know if they get any port spells, but just based on WHERE the pots drop players off, I'd say this was intentional for both enchanters and necros with the possible intentions of linking all back up to toxx forest.

I understand people would fear this because they would have to actually USE A BOAT to go to pots, but let me tell you... boats are amazing

[loramin]

https://i.imgur.com/Ymk83AK.gif

[aaezil]

Remember, OP is the same guy trying to convince the caster forum that charming on an enchanter is a sub-optimal waste of time.

Aww. Hopefully he grew up big and strong now!

[Rimitto]

There is your answer. No need for a comma and more text, just that. But, if you want more.. only for non-enchanters :rolleyes:


Regardless of the amount of porting available, since you ask why is it a big deal. Do you think the demand for porting stays the same if people bound at pots?
player demand is based on player situations and thus free from game decisions. Proof in point, if players camped a certain dragon that guarded pots, vs if they didn't, it wouldn't be any less or more dangerous, as that's a game design vs a what the players want to happen design. :rolleyes:
The more you try to control the players in a game the more they will revolt until the breaking point happens. The fact that some things are permacamped is a prime example of this. Simple put, unbinding rebinding megabinding and bindbinding will have 0 effect, The players will then respond to this 0 effect and implement what they deem fit as a proper response. you see, it's not the game forcing anything, it's the players. The Players. THE PLAYERS. :rolleyes:
or if you need a more direct hint at this one. It's the players that created this response in the first place. Nothing happens until players fix what other players started.

At the time the intent was not to allow an enchanter to travel from the bottom of a kunark/velious dungeon to say the bank in Neriak in a minute with zoning. Not for them selves or for guild mobilization reasons.
I can already do this, as I have a spell called gate. The only difference is that it would cut out the middleman, or put in a middleman, depending on how you look at it. :rolleyes:
not that I would do that anyways, since I'm not suicidal enough to venture into more than 3-5 zones without rebinding.

I say all this as an player with a gating char bound at the pots.
rebind yourself if you really agree with this point. I don't like listening to hypocrites lecture. :rolleyes:

[indiscriminate_hater]

OP just ask your in-game friends for a port when you need it. You seem like the type of guy who has lots of friends

[Ruhtar]

Since this thread was created to ask questions, here are the answers:

Is anything stopping players from just killing themselves there and having a "stored corpse" for clerics to revive as a form of "bind" ?:rolleyes:

No, nothing is stopping a player from creating a corpse to be resurrected at firepots. Though, that set up and maintenance of said set up would take too much time to be considered efficient or worth the trouble.

Is it really that bad for people to bind at pots now? With all the massive amounts of players doing teleports left and right with alts left and right, is this so much of an issue still or just a biased derogatory viewpoint against solo players?

It's less about good vs bad and more about what happened on live and replicating such a major change to make it "classic" on P99. You're also trying to push this as some sort of hate against solo players, but EQ was never made to be played by yourself. If the devs started to cater to all QoL changes to accommodate every type of person and scenario, the game wouldn't look too much different than current live.

[d3r14k]

OP, you're losing it here.

You won't ever be able to bind at pots if you aren't already bound there. No amount of lobbying for a non-classic change will help, especially when your argument is quality of life / time saved. This isn't a server that caters to either of those things. Also, when you say "well what about just for Enchanters, because I play an Enchanter" it is not going to help your position either.

[Danth]

If you want relatively quick firepot access you can bind in Firionia Vie. The ship there has a fairly quick (~18 minute) maximum cycle time, after which it's just a short run across Timorous to the firepots.


Danth

[Rimitto]

OP just ask your in-game friends for a port when you need it. You seem like the type of guy who has lots of friends
I actually do. :confused:
Though personally I rarely use ports, I prefer SoW since you get to experience more of the game by running(aside from hhk with the giant face in the wall). :rolleyes:

Since this thread was created to ask questions, here are the answers:



No, nothing is stopping a player from creating a corpse to be resurrected at firepots. Though, that set up and maintenance of said set up would take too much time to be considered efficient or worth the trouble.



It's less about good vs bad and more about what happened on live and replicating such a major change to make it "classic" on P99. You're also trying to push this as some sort of hate against solo players, but EQ was never made to be played by yourself. If the devs started to cater to all QoL changes to accommodate every type of person and scenario, the game wouldn't look too much different than current live.

I'd like to argue that point. EQ was meant to be played in any way you want to play it. It has a punishing system but that doesn't mean it's not free and open. You're never "FORCED" to use magic as a magician, You're not forced to group up to kill and level up, and you're never forced to only align with 1 part of the world faction-wise. The devs went out of their way to make it as free and open as possible while still maintaining form.

Personally, I don't believe firepots were ever intended to be for everyone. They seem more like an abandoned quest line to me. Which, let's be honest, is a pretty common thing in this game. Another reason I believe them to be a quest line specifically for enchanters is because of the significance.
There are 12 pots in the room, and only 13 races (half elf not included). Enchanters specifically are the only class that can become all 13 races, and furthermore, these teleports are all to "safe" locations that are just outside of places where enemies would auto-aggro. That's 2 reasons right there why I think this area was specifically built for enchanters by the devs, or at the very least, to test illusion magics or breaking into towns with aggro and factions. (again why I say it might also be for necromancer).
The whole "miragul's highway" thing is another firm evidence/reason why I believe that this was supposed to be for enchanters.

I respect your ideals but I respectfully disagree that this should remain as is... at least for enchanters.

[Trzzle]

Drugs.

[Ataxio]

Enchanters are one of the most broken classes. You don't need special treatment... PLUS your one of the few classes that gets a FREE OT hammer.

Find a beach, locate the sand, proceed to pound it.

[the_only_jake]

Drugs.

When crack dealers get high on their own supply !

[Tethler]

Lol, OP is as terrible at making convincing arguments as he is at playing enchanter. No surprise he's reaching for any crutch possible.

Says he prefers sow to ports so he can see more of the game while complaining about being too late to bind at pots. Thanks for the laugh.

[platapus]

Play on Green. Level your Enchanter in the first year. When Kunark arrives bind yourself there during the brief window when it's possible and never re-bind elsewhere.

Problem solved.

I was going to suggest that maybe for some solo type classes there was a custom quest to bind yourself there or something but then you said this and this is basically a custom epic quest that only the most legendary of enchanters can go on so hey there you go.

Problem solved.

[platapus]

Enchanters are one of the most broken classes.

what they gain in solo they make up for by not having any fun raiding.

balanced!

now go say 10 karanas for your blasphemes.

[Ravager]

Binds are for wusses. Corpse and bank runs are classic. Why play here if you aren't looking for the classic experience?

[Troxx]

Binds are for wusses. Corpse and bank runs are classic. Why play here if you aren't looking for the classic experience?

Lol it’s funny you mention that. From 2000 until I stopped playing live I always kept a complete backup set of gear in the bank. Without thinking about it I still do this on many of my p99 toons. Any nodrop alternatives I have sit in the bank just in case it’s needed.

It’s never needed though :p

Old habits die hard.

[Ravager]

Same, my bank is littered with useless things like that, also a sow pot and some gems for the corpse runs.

[Baylan295]

what they gain in solo they make up for by not having any fun raiding.

balanced!

now go say 10 karanas for your blasphemes.

If enchanters aren’t fun at raids you aren’t taking an active enough role in the raid. Bind sight, charm, memblur, tash, slow, cripple. Lots of things to do.

[Rader]

Never understood not being able to bind in Timorous Deep. I get that binding at the pots room is a game changer, but they could have just made Timorous unbindable, EXCEPT at Ogre Island... running or swimming from there to the pot room takes forever, only an idiot would choose that over just asking for ports from a normal druid/wiz ring

[Rader]

If enchanters aren’t fun at raids you aren’t taking an active enough role in the raid. Bind sight, charm, memblur, tash, slow, cripple. Lots of things to do.

Another option - don't raid. Raiding is usually a time sink where you actually lose xp and waste time while hoping to gain enough DKP to get some worthy pixels.

[Coridan]

then why even have the pots in the game in the first place? why should they exist? :rolleyes:
Clearly they were a dev room product and should be immediately removed. :rolleyes:

It's not a dev room product, it's an Easter egg to the development of Kunark. On the Kunark forums before launch there was a "Mysteries of Norrath" thread about conspiracy theories for Norrath. One of them was about the locked fire pot in Neriak. There was talk that there were firepots for every city. Another was about the giant sea monster in Rathetear (Mwgalodon), Faydedar and the firepots rooms are callbacks to that thread.

[Baylan295]

Another option - don't raid. Raiding is usually a time sink where you actually lose xp and waste time while hoping to gain enough DKP to get some worthy pixels.

I mean, that’s an option. But raiding and killing some of the biggest and baddest monsters is fun.

[Baa]

I remember when I came back on my enc after my last hiatus....and rebound over my pots bind. Broke my heart a little.

[Kayso2]

Imagine the convenience of being bound just a click away from a dozen places that no one really needs to go.

[Qtip]

I actually do. :confused:
Though personally I rarely use ports, I prefer SoW since you get to experience more of the game by running(aside from hhk with the giant face in the wall). :rolleyes:



I'd like to argue that point. EQ was meant to be played in any way you want to play it. It has a punishing system but that doesn't mean it's not free and open. You're never "FORCED" to use magic as a magician, You're not forced to group up to kill and level up, and you're never forced to only align with 1 part of the world faction-wise. The devs went out of their way to make it as free and open as possible while still maintaining form.

Personally, I don't believe firepots were ever intended to be for everyone. They seem more like an abandoned quest line to me. Which, let's be honest, is a pretty common thing in this game. Another reason I believe them to be a quest line specifically for enchanters is because of the significance.
There are 12 pots in the room, and only 13 races (half elf not included). Enchanters specifically are the only class that can become all 13 races, and furthermore, these teleports are all to "safe" locations that are just outside of places where enemies would auto-aggro. That's 2 reasons right there why I think this area was specifically built for enchanters by the devs, or at the very least, to test illusion magics or breaking into towns with aggro and factions. (again why I say it might also be for necromancer).
The whole "miragul's highway" thing is another firm evidence/reason why I believe that this was supposed to be for enchanters.

I respect your ideals but I respectfully disagree that this should remain as is... at least for enchanters.


Your belief is that the original devs put the firepots in the game as a broken quest for enchanters to test their illusions? Now you're asking for the no bind rule to be removed for enchanters, when the original game designers removed them to begin with?

How do you come up with this shit?

[DMN]

Isn't halas about the only decent firepot shortcut(almost everyone is going to be KOS in cabalis)? Sure, nice if you need/want to go there, but how often will that be?

Iksars/enc probably gain the most from it. As long as you have a decent porting population the rest are pretty meh. But do you really want to do CR in Seb or HS or wherever and have to come all the way from cabilis? You are going to go to the commons and get a port instead.

[Justinian]

OP has the weakest reasoning I've seen on these forums yet, which is saying a lot.