Insanity :10 hours per manastone, there's like 12 people on the list now

[axisofebola]

And I don't know if I'd rather deal with camp horders or people who share accounts and hence get to halve or more their wait times. Since they are allowed to this, they fill up more slots as otherwise they would't have the gumption to camp it.

[Magikarp]

I believe 4 dropped today across about 10 hrs on teal. Still not great, but not as bad as a lot of ppl are assuming. EE seems to spawn more than his PH...or maybe it's actually just 50/50

Mileage may vary ofc!

[DMN]

Evil eye is supposed to spawn way more than the shaman. Drop rate should be a lot higher on the manastone, too.

Not sure where they got the numbers/stats for these drops. Probably after the drop rate was nerfed shortly before they removed it entirely. Used to be a "common" rare, like the mith 2 hander.

[Khikik]

50/50 you say?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOwLEVQGbrM

[bthomsen0312]

50/50 you say?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gOwLEVQGbrM

nothing better than the dude that spent 30 hours at the camp

"This has a 38% chance to be an EE and a 14% chance of being a manastone based on past results"

[M.J.]

And I don't know if I'd rather deal with camp horders or people who share accounts and hence get to halve or more their wait times. Since they are allowed to this, they fill up more slots as otherwise they would't have the gumption to camp it.

I fully agree with this! Manastone should be a condensed version of the AFK Checks at present, those who can interact with a quickly moving AFK Check box and then, at random, type the AFK human-check command before clicking OK, will eventually be the only ones to get a manastone, just like it as at present: but they'll have to prove they have the skill set worthy of earning this item meant for the elite!

Just done in half the time and without ever actually interacting with the mob - just like the majority of those in the camp at present - but shorter... thats key.

Make the camp shorter is the summary of the posts in this thread.

[Endonde]

And I don't know if I'd rather deal with camp horders or people who share accounts and hence get to halve or more their wait times. Since they are allowed to this, they fill up more slots as otherwise they would't have the gumption to camp it.

I agree with others that the drop rate shouldn't be so low, but the account sharing seems like a bigger problem to me.

The list is already at 30-40 hours long to get a manastone, and as the list length increases it will mean that the account sharers will be the only ones able to get manastones. So if the idea behind the list system was to open the camps up to everyone, and stop a specific group from permanently locking down the camp it has failed miserably.

[Dolalin]

The easy availability of new accounts creates problems on P99 that didn't exist on Live.

[Phaezed-Reality]

All i know is if i was staff i'd be looking very hard at every manastone camped like this, camping EE just like camping out at family member who is in the hospital and sitting next to them level seriousness.

things that make u go hmmm.

[M.J.]

I know probably most the people in this thread are actually in the camp with me right now, so I just want to ask whats the solution? Because the past system was FFA first come first serve, and I can't really see a happy medium here for demand vs difficulty.

The staff haven't made this camp hard on us, we're doing that. The spawn rate / drop rate are contested by those with Live experience, but making it easier would IMO just make it so players that need ANY item in the future come to the camp. We'd see not just more manastones, but manastones as a bartering piece for a firepot bind, or sold at the cost of a firepot bind (20k) + some tip change for anyone that runs that FUTURE /list racket.

Right now the majority are here for themselves, their future alts, or a friend. I can't see anything out of bounds for a classic server that bans boxing when it comes to friends sharing accounts. They're helping each other use a single character and gain an advantage FOR that character, sacrificing the advantage in every other scenario in the game that two players would gain playing together. There's only one manastone camp, but there are shorter /list items with harder criteria for those that meet the minimum level, and no one is complaining that two friends who show up at the same time and /list together gain an advantage in surviving a camp while gaining, potentially, DOUBLE the benefit of those without pals.

If they put in the time.

If players make X game mechanic more miserable for themselves, and there is no way of making X more enjoyable for all without removing an aspect of the very thing that drives them to engage in X, who wins then?

The difference between this camp and literally every single raid target in the game is that those people who could care less about raid loot WANT this game changing item and the benefits, and fun, possible from having it. And they're just going to keep showing up and recruiting friends to help - like they do for every other bit of content in this game.

Manastone access at 35 is already rather "punitive" for those that aren't able to grind through when ideal spots are camped or crowded during their play sessions, but making the /list feature available at 25 for Evil Eye would have had exactly the same result of attracting a crowd capable of the content and desirous of the rewards.

There would have been a raid force down here instead of a small group - and the closer this camp gets to a raid force the sooner it will become exactly that - and rules will have to be made clear about some sort of Evileye Greenzone. =P

I'd say that removing the distance limit for people over /list #5 for evil eye specificlaly will reduce the angst greatly. Rather than asking for the content to be further altered, just let it function like AC list or any other popular camp list where the person is informed they need to get their asses to the camp when the person ahead of them leaves. Or do the opposite, those not in the top 20 on the list CAN'T be in Guk and those not in the top 10 on the /list CAN'T be in the camp.

If people are going to make this shit as obnoxious as the p99 raid scene, embrace it and remove the "friend" penalty people are complaining about by making it so those with actual friends that would help them run into arbitrary cut offs even when they list at the same time. Then make it so no 3 people from the same guild can be in the Top 5 at the same time - to just fuck with it further.

Anything the staff can do to effectively limit the distribution of Manastones to people working together will just make the camp even less tolerable the more accessible the camp becomes to the general population.

I have absolutely zero solutions to the "problem" besides removing the limit of range for players, which will just result in everyone listing that can. Thus requiring some sort of middle ground where a "group" listing is introduced and groups doing the camps have some internal order if they're allowed in "camp" zones for /list that reduces friction, or excluded otherwise because they lack the ability to productively interact with dangerous camps - or by debasing the experience of the content by turning it into something it was never meant to be - a mini-raid on trivial content for max level players who carry whoevers ahead of them in line.

Except anything done to keep those gaming the system by NOT joining the list in any way makes the system ineffective, so everyone has to participate when in the vacinity of these camps. The more you try and force this game into a fair mold, the more it breaks, and the /list is an unhappy but tolerable medium as is for every camp BUT Manastone. Which is a camp so fucking fair it hurts.

[Domo]

I am solo on green, and its like impossible for me to get a MS as long there are people who share their accounts.

Sure I gonna try it and might make some trustfull friend who would do 1 camping shift for me while I am sleeping, but else I see no chance for me to get one.

[Domo]

Would be cool if you could store like 20min break time every 60min you're at the EE camp.

So if you camp the EE for 24h, you can log out for 8h without losing your postion.

Dunno, something like that, but it wont happen, so dont take this as a suggestion. Its just wishfull thinking from me

[SenoraRaton]

What if we scrap the entire list idea, and set up the camp like guilds used to do in eq. DKP. Time at the camp not afk aquires dkp. Whoever has the highest dkp when it drops gets the item, a lockout, and loses all dkp. This means the account sharers can amass dkp, but they lose it as well, and I can spend an hour a day at the camp, and potentially actually get a manastone. Time invested is directly rewarded.

This feels "healthier" from a real life perspective than expecting people to sit at their computers for days on end for virtual pixels. I understand, I have done it, doesn't mean we can't innovate.

[Endonde]

I know probably most the people in this thread are actually in the camp with me right now, so I just want to ask whats the solution? Because the past system was FFA first come first serve, and I can't really see a happy medium here for demand vs difficulty.

The staff haven't made this camp hard on us, we're doing that. The spawn rate / drop rate are contested by those with Live experience, but making it easier would IMO just make it so players that need ANY item in the future come to the camp. We'd see not just more manastones, but manastones as a bartering piece for a firepot bind, or sold at the cost of a firepot bind (20k) + some tip change for anyone that runs that FUTURE /list racket.

Right now the majority are here for themselves, their future alts, or a friend. I can't see anything out of bounds for a classic server that bans boxing when it comes to friends sharing accounts. They're helping each other use a single character and gain an advantage FOR that character, sacrificing the advantage in every other scenario in the game that two players would gain playing together. There's only one manastone camp, but there are shorter /list items with harder criteria for those that meet the minimum level, and no one is complaining that two friends who show up at the same time and /list together gain an advantage in surviving a camp while gaining, potentially, DOUBLE the benefit of those without pals.

If they put in the time.

If players make X game mechanic more miserable for themselves, and there is no way of making X more enjoyable for all without removing an aspect of the very thing that drives them to engage in X, who wins then?

The difference between this camp and literally every single raid target in the game is that those people who could care less about raid loot WANT this game changing item and the benefits, and fun, possible from having it. And they're just going to keep showing up and recruiting friends to help - like they do for every other bit of content in this game.

Manastone access at 35 is already rather "punitive" for those that aren't able to grind through when ideal spots are camped or crowded during their play sessions, but making the /list feature available at 25 for Evil Eye would have had exactly the same result of attracting a crowd capable of the content and desirous of the rewards.

There would have been a raid force down here instead of a small group - and the closer this camp gets to a raid force the sooner it will become exactly that - and rules will have to be made clear about some sort of Evileye Greenzone. =P

I'd say that removing the distance limit for people over /list #5 for evil eye specificlaly will reduce the angst greatly. Rather than asking for the content to be further altered, just let it function like AC list or any other popular camp list where the person is informed they need to get their asses to the camp when the person ahead of them leaves. Or do the opposite, those not in the top 20 on the list CAN'T be in Guk and those not in the top 10 on the /list CAN'T be in the camp.

If people are going to make this shit as obnoxious as the p99 raid scene, embrace it and remove the "friend" penalty people are complaining about by making it so those with actual friends that would help them run into arbitrary cut offs even when they list at the same time. Then make it so no 3 people from the same guild can be in the Top 5 at the same time - to just fuck with it further.

Anything the staff can do to effectively limit the distribution of Manastones to people working together will just make the camp even less tolerable the more accessible the camp becomes to the general population.

I have absolutely zero solutions to the "problem" besides removing the limit of range for players, which will just result in everyone listing that can. Thus requiring some sort of middle ground where a "group" listing is introduced and groups doing the camps have some internal order if they're allowed in "camp" zones for /list that reduces friction, or excluded otherwise because they lack the ability to productively interact with dangerous camps - or by debasing the experience of the content by turning it into something it was never meant to be - a mini-raid on trivial content for max level players who carry whoevers ahead of them in line.

Except anything done to keep those gaming the system by NOT joining the list in any way makes the system ineffective, so everyone has to participate when in the vacinity of these camps. The more you try and force this game into a fair mold, the more it breaks, and the /list is an unhappy but tolerable medium as is for every camp BUT Manastone. Which is a camp so fucking fair it hurts.

Well for one thing I don't think changing the range really helps the list system in any meaningful way, it just means more people would be away from the camp not helping kill the mob.

Also I don't think anyone is arguing that the camp shouldn't be hard, it's just that the current system is likely going to get to the point where a single person won't be able to handle the wait time required to get the item. I don't think it's really a good idea to create a system that actively encourages account sharing, because there are serious risks involved with that.

[M.J.]

This feels "healthier" from a real life perspective than expecting people to sit at their computers for days on end for virtual pixels. I understand, I have done it, doesn't mean we can't innovate.

I think it is less expectation and more resignation that /list is a less painful option for those running this box than ever expecting the pixel obsessed to work their shit out and find a compromise. I've gone from #9 to #4, and I could be in for another 20 hours or out of here in 5. Its as RNGesus wills it.

[aaezil]

Grown ass men spending 10-20 hrs not actually playing an emulation of a 30 year old mmo but just staring at the screen waiting in line?

[M.J.]

I've rediscovered my own terrible taste in music going through folders not opened since 2014, and watched about 6 movies now. But mostly I annoy everyone around me and feed on their suffering.

[Solist]

I've been at the manastone camp for 29 hours currently, and have been awake for a total of 37 or so hours.

I am #2 on the list which means ostensibly I need to continue clicking this check box every 5 to 15 mins for the next 10 to 20 hours straight.

This is beyond unhealthy but it is the only way to get one when the other guys just run a roster and sit in camp doing shifts. Its so blatantly obvious watching a toon LD, come back and cast entirely different spells and sit somewhere else for 6 hours+, then the original comes back etc.

I'm a bit afraid for my health but short of sharing accounts there's nothing that can be done except be at this camp for a minimum of 40 hours (MINIMUM) as the drop rate is so unclassic. Pretty soul destroying I gotta say.

Edit: Not knowing how the afk checks work is kinda shit too, the limits are not clearly defined. Running off for a shit, shower, prepare some fucking dogshit unhealthy meal praying this AFK check doesnt boot me from list is mega aids. Craving for the ability to just switch off for 30mins and enjoy a steak haha.

[Jack N]

I'm looking forward to P99 getting some national news coverage when some nerd croaks from a 120-hour manastone session.

[M.J.]

Well for one thing I don't think changing the range really helps the list system in any meaningful way, it just means more people would be away from the camp not helping kill the mob.

Also I don't think anyone is arguing that the camp shouldn't be hard, it's just that the current system is likely going to get to the point where a single person won't be able to handle the wait time required to get the item. I don't think it's really a good idea to create a system that actively encourages account sharing, because there are serious risks involved with that.

I don't think account sharing has ever been prohibited on P99, and don't particularly see a problem with it for the same duo opportunities lost when focusing on a manastone. The value of which is enough for you to assume there is no lost opportunity cost from such a setup, or that everyone that is doing as much is boxing or doing the equivalent of by helping a friend. I'm just not seeing the math work out on this complaint unless I presume a greater degree of "cheating" is going on.

From a human perspective I could see a /list cut off after 9 with a second list designed to randomly "reward" those on it a chance at joining a potentially 40 hour long camp. Which would be a cutoff those that design it probably wouldn't want to touch as they become like a blind bartender who is expected to keep track of who should be cut off for their "own" good - but more so for the bar owner and bar tenders potentially on the hook. We had a guy get the stone who said he felt it was bad for his health to stay up for over 30 hours, and I think leaving it up to players to keep at it - or not kill themselves - is probably the better stance.

But like some poster said above about grown adults doing 20 hour camps, they're grown adults. No one has to camp a manastone, those that do just want whats at the end of the rainbow.

[Tecmos Deception]

I'm looking forward to P99 getting some national news coverage when some nerd croaks from a 120-hour manastone session.

Let's get an R&F thread going for over under on manastone deaths (irl) in the next 6 months.


I can't wait for fungus staff /list

[skipdog]

Oh my, people crying about a long manastone camp already?

Oh boy. lol

[Arvan]

I've been at the manastone camp for 29 hours currently, and have been awake for a total of 37 or so hours.

I am #2 on the list which means ostensibly I need to continue clicking this check box every 5 to 15 mins for the next 10 to 20 hours straight.

This is beyond unhealthy but it is the only way to get one when the other guys just run a roster and sit in camp doing shifts. Its so blatantly obvious watching a toon LD, come back and cast entirely different spells and sit somewhere else for 6 hours+, then the original comes back etc.

I'm a bit afraid for my health but short of sharing accounts there's nothing that can be done except be at this camp for a minimum of 40 hours (MINIMUM) as the drop rate is so unclassic. Pretty soul destroying I gotta say.

Edit: Not knowing how the afk checks work is kinda shit too, the limits are not clearly defined. Running off for a shit, shower, prepare some fucking dogshit unhealthy meal praying this AFK check doesnt boot me from list is mega aids. Craving for the ability to just switch off for 30mins and enjoy a steak haha.

Big if true

[fadetree]

...

My God, why. Are Manastones *that* useful? I've had a couple on various chars, druid and cleric notably. I didn't notice they were that overpowering...handy, of course, but not life changing. Same for guises - which as far as I can tell are completely useless apart from some faction stuff. Manastones are at least useful.

I know they stop dropping. Who cares?

[Tecmos Deception]

...

My God, why. Are Manastones *that* useful? I've had a couple on various chars, druid and cleric notably. I didn't notice they were that overpowering...handy, of course, but not life changing. Same for guises - which as far as I can tell are completely useless apart from some faction stuff. Manastones are at least useful.

I know they stop dropping. Who cares?

This is like arguing over how you don't understand why other people like the taste of some random food, but you don't. You know that's asinine. Why would you try to argue about whether manastone camp is worth it or not?

Manastone is definitely "*that* useful" for clerics. Everyone else it's just convenient (like a sham who wants to canni down and afk but without spending the minute to do it instead of 8 seconds of stoning) or niche (like druids with clicky heal robe after kunark rolls around, or epic wizards, or chanters wanting to eat a berserker spirit that's going to expire).

Guises give large races a shrink without needing shrink/shrink pots. Plus ultravision. Those are not a trivial things. But yeah it's generally vanity and fashion quest I think.

[Endonde]

I don't think account sharing has ever been prohibited on P99, and don't particularly see a problem with it for the same duo opportunities lost when focusing on a manastone. The value of which is enough for you to assume there is no lost opportunity cost from such a setup, or that everyone that is doing as much is boxing or doing the equivalent of by helping a friend. I'm just not seeing the math work out on this complaint unless I presume a greater degree of "cheating" is going on.

From a human perspective I could see a /list cut off after 9 with a second list designed to randomly "reward" those on it a chance at joining a potentially 40 hour long camp. Which would be a cutoff those that design it probably wouldn't want to touch as they become like a blind bartender who is expected to keep track of who should be cut off for their "own" good - but more so for the bar owner and bar tenders potentially on the hook. We had a guy get the stone who said he felt it was bad for his health to stay up for over 30 hours, and I think leaving it up to players to keep at it - or not kill themselves - is probably the better stance.

But like some poster said above about grown adults doing 20 hour camps, they're grown adults. No one has to camp a manastone, those that do just want whats at the end of the rainbow.

It's really not a hard concept to understand, account sharing isn't against the rules but it's a dumb thing to do, characters get stripped by "friends" all the time.

When account sharing is an option at a camp like this it skews the difficulty of the camp, if there was no account sharing and everyone had to grind out their wait time the camp is fair, but when you add in account sharing, players who choose not to account share are at a severe disadvantage. Not only do account sharers have to spend less time individually at the camp, but they are able to cover a larger amount of time spent on the list. Two players who alternate 12 hour shifts can basically maintain a position on the list indefinitely, while a single player has an expiration date on the amount of time they can spend.

If Devs are fine with players account sharing to get manastones that's their choice I guess, but it doesn't seem to fit with the goal of the list system, and punishes players who make smart choices by not sharing account info with others.

[Domo]

I guess GMs wont respond to this topic right?

[M.J.]

It's really not a hard concept to understand, account sharing isn't against the rules but it's a dumb thing to do, characters get stripped by "friends" all the time.

....

If Devs are fine with players account sharing to get manastones that's their choice I guess, but it doesn't seem to fit with the goal of the list system, and punishes players who make smart choices by not sharing account info with others.

I could see a rule being made that account sharing for manastone against the rules specifically to avoid OWNERSHIP issues related to the stone, which the list is meant to prevent entirely. So while I disagree with your opinion on fairness for sharing accounts in every instance other than this one, I do agree that the ambiguity of sharing accounts to get an item messes with the design of the /list system's purpose - or at least my understanding of it.


Having said that, it might never be fair if sharing is allowed, at least for those that could do the full camp from a position outside the top 3 on the list, but some people due to their lives or prior commitments will never realistically be able to directly acquire a Manastone without sharing the load with friends who they've comfortably shared far more than EQ accounts with. I just don't see a fair fix for this unless people volunteer a second account for a lockout when sharing accounts or some such. And if the helper doesn't play at all and just takes over someones character for a few hours so they can recharge, what does that mean for the fairness debate?

Meh

[Solist]

Oh my, people crying about a long manastone camp already?

Oh boy. lol

You realise you can't go AFK in these camps, at all right?

More than a few mins risks a kick from the list and your rights to loot. Its all hard coded.

So for 50 hours you sit and click a random window on a random timer that pops on your screen, sometimes entering a code thats randomly generated... Your time away amounts to a short shit, prefrab/processed shit food or delivery, lack of any exercise or time away from PC, strain of any RL relaitonships (wife/gf/dog/kids) etc.

It is single handedly the most hardcore feature ever put on p1999. To qualify that statement I have previously:
Done no CSR VP and corpse camped people down multiple levels.
Tracked 5 day window dragons for 50+hrs at a time.
Done the loreseeker camp duo and trio for days at a time.
etc etc.

This is the singularly most draining activity ever forced upon the playerbase, if they're to contest with people who are sharing accounts. And if they're sharing accounts they have an extraordinary advantage. If I can go 50 hours straight doing this (and I can), they can do closer to 100hrs straight with a bit of sleep planning and it's minimal investment by the 2nd person. Even 6 or 8hours sleep extends your ability to poopsock a huge amount.

[cd288]

I've been at the manastone camp for 29 hours currently, and have been awake for a total of 37 or so hours.

I am #2 on the list which means ostensibly I need to continue clicking this check box every 5 to 15 mins for the next 10 to 20 hours straight.

This is beyond unhealthy but it is the only way to get one when the other guys just run a roster and sit in camp doing shifts. Its so blatantly obvious watching a toon LD, come back and cast entirely different spells and sit somewhere else for 6 hours+, then the original comes back etc.

I'm a bit afraid for my health but short of sharing accounts there's nothing that can be done except be at this camp for a minimum of 40 hours (MINIMUM) as the drop rate is so unclassic. Pretty soul destroying I gotta say.

Edit: Not knowing how the afk checks work is kinda shit too, the limits are not clearly defined. Running off for a shit, shower, prepare some fucking dogshit unhealthy meal praying this AFK check doesnt boot me from list is mega aids. Craving for the ability to just switch off for 30mins and enjoy a steak haha.

Dude...why? You're sacrificing your real life physical health for something so pointless. Especially considering the item doesn't work in Kunark or Velious; so unless you're a Cleric, or a Druid/Wizard who can port to old world then gate back to wherever you were in Kunark or Velious thereby reducing downtime, there's no really a significant use for the item. Adding onto that the fact that this is an emulated server of a 20 year old game, there's really no reason to be sacrificing physical health for anything in this game.

[Baler]

Did someone say get a manastone in 10 hours?

Where do I sign up? :o

[M.J.]

Dude...why? You're sacrificing your real life physical health for something so pointless. Especially considering the item doesn't work in Kunark or Velious; so unless you're a Cleric, or a Druid/Wizard who can port to old world then gate back to wherever you were in Kunark or Velious thereby reducing downtime, there's no really a significant use for the item. Adding onto that the fact that this is an emulated server of a 20 year old game, there's really no reason to be sacrificing physical health for anything in this game.

Leveling to 60 is a significant use, and classic easily supports multiple groups leveling to 55 on guards and then to 60 (slowly) on various single spawns around the world. Also, I do believe it is usable in the Hole, which has loot that is still relevant in Kunark in addition to some sweet ass exp.

[AegnorP99]

So if it's 10 hours per manastone, we can assume 2 per day.

6 months x 30 days x 2 per day x 2 servers = 720. Just say 700 to account for the week and a half it took to get to farm status.

700 manastones with a peak population of 2300... It shouldn't really be that rare an item and it's really only useful in a few niche cases. Do we expect the insanity with the /list system to continue til Kunark? Or will the most hardcore people continue to wait in line for manastones after manastone?

[Domo]

I wouldnt be supriced if some poopsocker would farm a 2nd and 3rd one for their twinks hehe

[Arvan]

So if it's 10 hours per manastone, we can assume 2 per day.

6 months x 30 days x 2 per day x 2 servers = 720. Just say 700 to account for the week and a half it took to get to farm status.

700 manastones with a peak population of 2300... It shouldn't really be that rare an item and it's really only useful in a few niche cases. Do we expect the insanity with the /list system to continue til Kunark? Or will the most hardcore people continue to wait in line for manastones after manastone?

Guise/manastone stops dropping in like 6 months

[turbosilk]

I've been at the manastone camp for 29 hours currently, and have been awake for a total of 37 or so hours.

I am #2 on the list which means ostensibly I need to continue clicking this check box every 5 to 15 mins for the next 10 to 20 hours straight.

This is beyond unhealthy but it is the only way to get one when the other guys just run a roster and sit in camp doing shifts. Its so blatantly obvious watching a toon LD, come back and cast entirely different spells and sit somewhere else for 6 hours+, then the original comes back etc.

I'm a bit afraid for my health but short of sharing accounts there's nothing that can be done except be at this camp for a minimum of 40 hours (MINIMUM) as the drop rate is so unclassic. Pretty soul destroying I gotta say.

Edit: Not knowing how the afk checks work is kinda shit too, the limits are not clearly defined. Running off for a shit, shower, prepare some fucking dogshit unhealthy meal praying this AFK check doesnt boot me from list is mega aids. Craving for the ability to just switch off for 30mins and enjoy a steak haha.

As someone who camped the EE on the list this post appears to be trying to create false hysteria. The afk checks don't come at 5min or even 10. You get a check every 15min and you have to respond to a check before the next check. That means you have nearly 30 min before you get removed from the list.

There is like 6 months of it still being in the game and this is very similar to the long lists for jboots in OOT. Not everyone in game is going to have jboots, manna robe, manastone, fungi tunic, full set of rubicite, etc, etc. It's intended and ok. Let's not get swept up in modern MMOs where everything is handed to everyone because logging in means you deserve it.

[Bazia]

its obvious that this incentives like 3 friends sharing account info and taking turns on each others accounts to beef up lines singular people could not possibly wait through

i feel kinda stupid that i didnt realize this is what would happen fairly quickly

[turbosilk]

So if it's 10 hours per manastone, we can assume 2 per day.

6 months x 30 days x 2 per day x 2 servers = 720. Just say 700 to account for the week and a half it took to get to farm status.

700 manastones with a peak population of 2300... It shouldn't really be that rare an item and it's really only useful in a few niche cases. Do we expect the insanity with the /list system to continue til Kunark? Or will the most hardcore people continue to wait in line for manastones after manastone?

My experience with camping the EE and talking to all of the other people camping is once they got the manastone they went to continue playing the game. Too much goodness and adventure out there to stick with one camp.

[Solist]

they're not every 15, I just got one after 6mins.

[Solist]

So if it's 10 hours per manastone, we can assume 2 per day.

6 months x 30 days x 2 per day x 2 servers = 720. Just say 700 to account for the week and a half it took to get to farm status.

700 manastones with a peak population of 2300... It shouldn't really be that rare an item and it's really only useful in a few niche cases. Do we expect the insanity with the /list system to continue til Kunark? Or will the most hardcore people continue to wait in line for manastones after manastone?

Don't quote me too hard on the 10hr math, was a random figure for ease of math. Seems to be a 1 in 15 drop so far, on a 28min repop and maybe 50 or 60% spawn rate. Work it out.

[AegnorP99]

Don't quote me too hard on the 10hr math, was a random figure for ease of math. Seems to be a 1 in 15 drop so far, on a 28min repop and maybe 50 or 60% spawn rate. Work it out.

1/2 spawn chance x 1/15 drop x 2 spawns per hour = 1 manastones per 15 hours. Yay math. That's a bit worse so drop the 700 I calculated earlier to maybe 450-500.

[Baler]

I estimated about 400 total when I crunched the numbers in my head.

Then I think how many will make it to velious. People who still stop playing, manastones banned off the server.

I'd bet around 200 or less will make it to velious and be active.

[Cen]

and then how many will actually be of any use to content or groups or raids?

There's only one class who can use the manastone for free at 0 cost to their health and can use it in Kunark / Velious at no mana cost as well to leave to a classic zone, and the majority of the users will not be that class ;p

[Solist]

Agree, and given the absolute stupendous conditions around camping them, and the singular nature of most peoples manastone acquisition, you won't be 'trading' for them very much or often, And that's ignoring any 'future' investment from people betting on a blue merger and hoarding their little investment.

With whats involved it's easily the most hardcore, and most difficult item I've ever tried to obtain so far in 10yrs of p1999.

[Baler]

I mean cleric and druid are the main users of manastone in classic lands where it works.

Not sure how many people are aware it doesn't work in kunark/velious zones.

[Gustoo]

I got it,

Lets just give everyone a manabone when you create a new toon.

[sentinel]

Jesus, I had a manastone on my cleric on another classic server. It was nice, but it wasn't nearly as godly as most are making it out to be. Essentially with complete heal you never went OOM, but you had to click that damn thing and recast CH so many times it sucked the fun out of the game.

[Palemoon]

The easy availability of new accounts creates problems on P99 that didn't exist on Live.

This. I've been preaching that only one or two accounts should be allowed per human player. It would kill so many problems with one stone.

[Kron]

Spent 14hrs at camp before calling it quits. I knew it was a long shot and honestly my class ENC will not need it once Kunark drops so it was more for they "Hey I tried back when it was a thing".

During that time I did track my AFK checks with stopwatch (nothing to do) and it would run anywhere from 6 mins to 12 min gaps.

Also some people would drop and others joined so it's not a static list. I personally like the list system since I know I won't be bullied out of my spot by some group who can perma camp the spot.

Perfect example of no list is the Shralok Pack in Kithicore Forest. I tried to go get one it's not super hard mob and I found a guy sitting on camp so I respect his there first and wait.... He killed and got the pack so I said ok cool it's my turn... Nope he refused to leave the camp and said he was after 3 more.... I said screw that man you got one I'm taking next one... GM threats was made by him and essentially I was ask to leave when 4 of his guildies showed up and said he was holding camp for them...

SOOOoooo I'm beyond glad this list system exist and a solo player like me can get a chance at these unique items.

[AegnorP99]

I wonder how much of the more hardcore Green/Teal population exists solely to obtain a manastone before heading back to Blue. Probably more than a few. Be interesting to see what happens to the population at that six month mark.

[Veeshan31]

Spent 14hrs at camp before calling it quits. I knew it was a long shot and honestly my class ENC will not need it once Kunark drops so it was more for they "Hey I tried back when it was a thing".

During that time I did track my AFK checks with stopwatch (nothing to do) and it would run anywhere from 6 mins to 12 min gaps.

Also some people would drop and others joined so it's not a static list. I personally like the list system since I know I won't be bullied out of my spot by some group who can perma camp the spot.

Perfect example of no list is the Shralok Pack in Kithicore Forest. I tried to go get one it's not super hard mob and I found a guy sitting on camp so I respect his there first and wait.... He killed and got the pack so I said ok cool it's my turn... Nope he refused to leave the camp and said he was after 3 more.... I said screw that man you got one I'm taking next one... GM threats was made by him and essentially I was ask to leave when 4 of his guildies showed up and said he was holding camp for them...

SOOOoooo I'm beyond glad this list system exist and a solo player like me can get a chance at these unique items.

If you were smart, you would of started clearing all the other PHers for Shralok. Every giant spider on the south wall can become Recfek Shralok. People only camp that one spawn because it doesn't roam (and its listed on the wiki as the spawn spot). If you want a more active (and much more profitable) shralok camp, then clear all the roaming spiders. Then it doesn't matter if that one static spawn is camped.

[Daldaen]

There are clearly two issues.

One the Manastone is too rare a drop from the EE compared to the bag. See literally every other classic named from vanilla that has a common/rare drop and check the drop rate on those. In every case you see the common about 60-80% of the time and the rare 20-40% of the time. The Manastone should be no different but it sounds like it is set to a 5-10% rate currently.

Second is the account sharing issue. If your IP changes inbetween logging in and out, you should be removed from the list. I’m sure there may be one or two people who go LD and have their IP cycle before they get back on who get screwed by such a change but this is a necessary evil to counter the nonsense that is present at the camp currently.

[korzax]

And this is why the manastone was removed, too much hassle for csr

[Kaedain]

how badly do you REALLY want that manastone

[Tecmos Deception]

Probably more than a few.

I would sincerely doubt it.

[Erati]

Account sharing makes this really gross camp.

No other item in EQ is it this beneficial to simply hand out your info for 10 hrs at a time.

[Daldaen]

Oh and I forgot the third issue.

The list lockout should be 6 months not 1 week. People who share accounts are going to chain farm this by taking shifts and alternating which nerd sits behind the screen.

Every person who wants more than 1 Manastone should need to level additional characters to 35 or buy them from other players. The list mechanic should be a once per character lifetime limit.

[Isomorphic]

Most of the issues are resolved if you make the drop rate in line with other items, say 25%. But for some god awful reason it is very rare.
Edit: 1 every 10 hours seems way off.

[Arvan]

just put 1 manastone and guise in every chars inventory... no more neckbeards dying at their computers from not getting up for 30 hours straight

[drdrakes]

Guild member did 43 hours of straight afk checks to get his.

[Polixa]

It wouldn't surprise me that some people want a manastone because they have dreams of eventually selling it for a million plat on blue. However:

1. There will be so many stones they won't command that sort of price any more.
2. No-one will be hanging around on blue to buy one, because green 2.0 will be out and that's where everyone will immediately go.

[Meiva]

It's easier to ask to borrow a friends, then go link dead, then log back in when he's not on to transfer to a mule to sell later.

[Pozzey]

I'm looking forward to P99 getting some national news coverage when some nerd croaks from a 120-hour manastone session.

I seriously think this will happen when Rogean eventually pulls the plug.

[AegnorP99]

It wouldn't surprise me that some people want a manastone because they have dreams of eventually selling it for a million plat on blue. However:

1. There will be so many stones they won't command that sort of price any more.
2. No-one will be hanging around on blue to buy one, because green 2.0 will be out and that's where everyone will immediately go.

Good points.

[Baler]

But for real who says it's 10 hours.

I'd do it again if it's 10 hours.

[Grimstrike]

But for real who says it's 10 hours.

I'd do it again if it's 10 hours.

More like 30 hours... some people dont even work that much in an entire week. Just sayin.

[Solist]

I don't think this is the forum for discussing the merits of a manastone.

I've been clicking a stupid afk box every 6 to 15 minutes at random, and never been away from my computer longer than 6 minutes for nearly 40 hours now. Fourty straight hours of sitting here clicking this shit.

It is in need of a review and change to the system, maybe only requiring #1 to do afk checks as an example, adding more complication to the check and reducing the frequency etc. Something >.<

[Zeboim]

You could also just not get a manastone.

Sorry for your struggles with your 100% voluntary problem.

[turbosilk]

Guild member did 43 hours of straight afk checks to get his.

Hard to believe because I don't believe it.

[Lone Gnome]

A manastone is supposed to be a rare item

[Nisrak]

I like the suggestion of kicking you from the list if you LD and come back with a new IP. With ISPs these days, going LD is so rare that the amount of people affected that aren't sharing accounts would be minimal. If people couldn't stay on the list by sharing accounts, the average list length and required camp length would drop dramatically.

[ZiggyTheMuss]

Dude...why? You're sacrificing your real life physical health for something so pointless. Especially considering the item doesn't work in Kunark or Velious; so unless you're a Cleric, or a Druid/Wizard who can port to old world then gate back to wherever you were in Kunark or Velious thereby reducing downtime, there's no really a significant use for the item. Adding onto that the fact that this is an emulated server of a 20 year old game, there's really no reason to be sacrificing physical health for anything in this game.

[port9001]

This thread should be archived as a cautionary tale

[stakka]

If you're afraid of not getting manastone, and you're holdin' on, you'll see devils tearin' your life away. But if you've made your peace, and dont care about getting it, then the devils are really angels, freein' you from the world

[DMN]

But for real who says it's 10 hours.

I'd do it again if it's 10 hours.

Probably not if there are 10 people in front of you.

But that's right the current rates are probaly closer to what a few others have suggesting: about 1/15.

[LiQuid]

Is there actually any downside to just doubling or tripling the droprate? There's going to be hundreds of these things in the game by the time they no longer drop, what does it matter if it's hundreds or thousands? Somebody is legitimately going to get hurt or die camping this and it's literally just a stupid pixel trinket on an emulated server of a 20 year old game.

I understand the developers here are in love with their gimmick of making these servers "classic" and it's a cute dream but ultimately this server is a nostalgia toybox and it's not worth going thru this bullshit over. Just make the damn stone drop super fast and have a LIFETIME lockout on getting one per account

[tg822]

Is there actually any downside to just doubling or tripling the droprate? There's going to be hundreds of these things in the game by the time they no longer drop, what does it matter if it's hundreds or thousands? Somebody is legitimately going to get hurt or die camping this and it's literally just a stupid pixel trinket on an emulated server of a 20 year old game.

I understand the developers here are in love with their gimmick of making these servers "classic" and it's a cute dream but ultimately this server is a nostalgia toybox and it's not worth going thru this bullshit over. Just make the damn stone drop super fast and have a LIFETIME lockout on getting one per account

This is the correct answer.

[aaezil]

*autistic screeching*

[Baler]

*autistic screeching*

[Tecmos Deception]

*autistic screeching*

Reeeeeeeeee

[kaluppo]

I am embarrassed to say that I don't even know what a manastone is. I never heard of the item when I started playing on live (oct 2000 so just before velious) and I never heard of it here on blue when I first started playing p99 in 2018.

I assume it's an item that helps you regen mana. I've lived without it for so long that I suppose it won't matter if I keep living without it :D

[Psyborg]

Is there actually any downside to just doubling or tripling the droprate? There's going to be hundreds of these things in the game by the time they no longer drop, what does it matter if it's hundreds or thousands? Somebody is legitimately going to get hurt or die camping this and it's literally just a stupid pixel trinket on an emulated server of a 20 year old game.

I understand the developers here are in love with their gimmick of making these servers "classic" and it's a cute dream but ultimately this server is a nostalgia toybox and it's not worth going thru this bullshit over. Just make the damn stone drop super fast and have a LIFETIME lockout on getting one per account

I don’t like this argument because you can distill the entire game down to “stupid pixel trinkets on an emulated server.” Almost everything we do in EQ boils down to camping mobs for prolonged periods of time for pixels. The manastone camp is absolutely no different. If this isn’t your thing then you’re playing the wrong game. I just finished killing Hasten and other PHs over and over for 12 hours and my payoff was far less than a manastone.

[drdrakes]

Hard to believe because I don't believe it.

There will be many more with similar times, like the guy above you.

[galach]

https://i.imgur.com/lCryWU7.gif

[kaluppo]

https://i.imgur.com/lCryWU7.gif

WOW! That's a blast from the past. Wargames with a very young Matthew Broderick.

[Lulz Sect]

https://i.imgur.com/slboUMU.gif

[Castle2.0]

One per account you say?

*creates new account for free*

*powerlevels halfling warrior 1-35 with 50 druid buddy*

*gets manastone*

*repeat*

There is no good solution, only a decision. Get it. Or don't.

[Siege]

Is there actually any downside to just doubling or tripling the droprate? There's going to be hundreds of these things in the game by the time they no longer drop, what does it matter if it's hundreds or thousands? Somebody is legitimately going to get hurt or die camping this and it's literally just a stupid pixel trinket on an emulated server of a 20 year old game.

I understand the developers here are in love with their gimmick of making these servers "classic" and it's a cute dream but ultimately this server is a nostalgia toybox and it's not worth going thru this bullshit over. Just make the damn stone drop super fast and have a LIFETIME lockout on getting one per account

If there's one thing I've learned from living in a technologically advanced liberal democracy for my entire life, it's that making people's lives easier has disastrous consequences. Once you start mitigating the effects of natural selection, the party's over.

I guess what I'm trying to say saying is that you shouldn't stop the guy with the cleft pallet and weirdly spaced eyes from sticking his tongue in an exposed power outlet if that's what he wants to do.

[Elrood]

If there's one thing I've learned from living in a technologically advanced liberal democracy for my entire life, it's that making people's lives easier has disastrous consequences. Once you start mitigating the effects of natural selection, the party's over.

I guess what I'm trying to say saying is that you shouldn't stop the guy with the cleft pallet and weirdly spaced eyes from sticking his tongue in an exposed power outlet if that's what he wants to do.

Yes, preventing that person from dying will have disastrous consequences.

[Widan]

Make these mobs FFA. Whoever does the most damage gets the loot. Still ban people for intentionally training and whatnot though.

[LiQuid]

I don’t like this argument because you can distill the entire game down to “stupid pixel trinkets on an emulated server.” Almost everything we do in EQ boils down to camping mobs for prolonged periods of time for pixels. The manastone camp is absolutely no different. If this isn’t your thing then you’re playing the wrong game. I just finished killing Hasten and other PHs over and over for 12 hours and my payoff was far less than a manastone.

The manastone camp absolutely is different because the only way it's conceivable for you to obtain said item is by staying awake for 48+ hours while clicking a checkbox on your screen every 10 minutes... There's no way for you to "luck" your way into getting it the way you can just zone into RM and find Hasten up, or wander into a named mob uncamped and get an item. There's an element of luck and RNG to almost every other camp in this game. It took me about 60 hours camping Pained Soul to get my VP key, that's likely longer than it will take any one person to get a Manastone, but I did it over the course of 3 (still excruciating) sessions and got some god damned sleep in between because it wasn't a perma-camped /list mob with a revolving door of yayhoos sharing accounts that were immune to the human body's need for sleep

edit: that's all not even to mention the fact that all those other items won't stop dropping in the game in a few months. The element of finality of the manastone dropping in the game and the rush to get one while you still can is also adding to the fervor, so again I absolutely think this camp is different than any other camp you can think of in the game and it's a perfect storm to hurt players

[Psyborg]

The manastone camp absolutely is different because the only way it's conceivable for you to obtain said item is by staying awake for 48+ hours while clicking a checkbox on your screen every 10 minutes... There's no way for you to "luck" your way into getting it the way you can just zone into RM and find Hasten up, or wander into a named mob uncamped and get an item. There's an element of luck and RNG to almost every other camp in this game. It took me about 60 hours camping Pained Soul to get my VP key, that's likely longer than it will take any one person to get a Manastone, but I did it over the course of 3 (still excruciating) sessions and got some god damned sleep in between because it wasn't a perma-camped /list mob with a revolving door of yayhoos sharing accounts that were immune to the human body's need for sleep

edit: that's all not even to mention the fact that all those other items won't stop dropping in the game in a few months. The element of finality of the manastone dropping in the game and the rush to get one while you still can is also adding to the fervor, so again I absolutely think this camp is different than any other camp you can think of in the game and it's a perfect storm to hurt players

The only thing causing that is the /list system. Instead of calling for free manastones for everyone you should be calling for the removal of /list.

Also, do you have any proof that anyone who has looted a manastone has been up for 48 hours? I don't think it has even gotten to the 24 hour mark from what I've seen.

[Natewest1987]

Had a guild mate today that had been there for 21 hours before I went to dinner... they were still there after dinner. So I’m guessing about 23 hours or more. I didn’t follow up any later than that. Hopefully they got it !

[DMN]

The only thing causing that is the /list system. Instead of calling for free manastones for everyone you should be calling for the removal of /list.

Also, do you have any proof that anyone who has looted a manastone has been up for 48 hours? I don't think it has even gotten to the 24 hour mark from what I've seen.

At this point you would consider yourself lucky to get a manastone in 48 hours.

[zodium]

i read like one post, anyway good try on /list but it's time to crank the drop rate up to 11 and cure the sickness

[Videri]

My friend went 44 hours and was #2 on the list. He fell asleep on his keyboard and got booted from the list.

[Psyborg]

My friend went 44 hours and was #2 on the list. He fell asleep on his keyboard and got booted from the list.

Your friend is a moron for staying up for that long. Hell, I’m a moron for staying up 1/4 as long to camp anything.

[Magikarp]

Wew, this thread blew up fast. Can someone remind me if we still not talking about teal?

quietly clicks manastone earned after just 4 or 5 hours in camp while playing peggle:o

[Endonde]

From what people are saying from Teal about manastone drop rates, it really is sounding like Green just has awful luck. There were people saying 4 manastones dropped on teal yesterday, and Green has gone over 24 hours without a manastone drop at this point.

Getting a manastone on Green at the moment in under 40 hours would require some good luck, #1 on the list has been here over 50 hours, #2 has been here roughly 48 hours, #3 has been here 40 hours, so it would require a really lucky stretch of drops to be able to get one in under 40 hours.

[branamil]

Imagine being 40, overweight, diabetic, underemployed, and being EXTREMELY UPSET at how often a mystical mana globe appears on disposable elf world #262678

[DMN]

Imagine being 40, overweight, diabetic, underemployed, and being EXTREMELY UPSET at how often a mystical mana globe appears on disposable elf world #262678

Very original.

[Siege]

From what people are saying from Teal about manastone drop rates, it really is sounding like Green just has awful luck. There were people saying 4 manastones dropped on teal yesterday, and Green has gone over 24 hours without a manastone drop at this point.

Getting a manastone on Green at the moment in under 40 hours would require some good luck, #1 on the list has been here over 50 hours, #2 has been here roughly 48 hours, #3 has been here 40 hours, so it would require a really lucky stretch of drops to be able to get one in under 40 hours.

The most important question is are they using socks, ziplock bags, or socks inside of ziplock bags?

[Videri]

Green has gone over 24 hours without a manastone drop at this point.

Getting a manastone on Green at the moment in under 40 hours would require some good luck, #1 on the list has been here over 50 hours, #2 has been here roughly 48 hours, #3 has been here 40 hours, so it would require a really lucky stretch of drops to be able to get one in under 40 hours.

anti-camp radius /nod

*trains out of the zone without warning*

[Solist]

The only thing causing that is the /list system. Instead of calling for free manastones for everyone you should be calling for the removal of /list.

Also, do you have any proof that anyone who has looted a manastone has been up for 48 hours? I don't think it has even gotten to the 24 hour mark from what I've seen.

Dude I literally got to 42? hours and shut down. I couldnt even type the codes in properly and the adds for youtube videos woke me up twice. Sat on a wooden box instead of a chair so my body was forced to stay upright and not 'rest'. Someone took over for me while i slept 5 hours.

Guy ahead of me passed out for 30mins at #1 and lost his spot before he got a stone. He had been there 45 hours straight.

Guy behind me has been on for 50hours now, is still #3. Hasn't logged off once.

Guy currently ahead of me at #1 currently goes LD occasionally and i suspect has changed humans once or twice.

Guy 2 slots behind me in 4th is at 35hrs or so i think now. 5th is in the 30's too. And a bunch are 20+ through to 8 or 9.

[Solist]

Comparing this to any other camp is laughable, I thought I made that clear in my first post that I've done every single 'hardcore' camp there is to do in p99's history, and this is by far significantly harder. Pained soul for 60 hours is a fucking dream, I'll do that ANY day nonstop, as I can have 5min microsleeps, and if I afk 15mins to walk my dog I don't lose my camp. 30 hours straight for verix about 2 months ago was nothing for me, doesnt even rate a mention in the top 20 for shitty camps ive done. This manastone shit is soul destroying and physically demanding.

That said there should be a solution, not whinging.


Possible solutions in my eyes:

Make manastone 2 different items. Make the ones that drop on green and teal no-drop "a manastone" to remove this cross server bullshit for potential server mergers or changes. Make the normal manastone also drop and just be ridiculous rare like spirit wracked cords were. So rare it doesn't rate a mention as a speculative drop, just a nice treat for someone lucky enough.

Add an ability to "/list afk 60" Where you can afk for 60mins and keep your spot on the list and advance on the list without doing afk checks. But you can only do so every 4 hours.

Add an ability to /list afk sleep, where your position gets paused in the list, others can overtake you as the list moves, so you could stay position 5 while sleeping and position 6 goes to 4, as something is looted. Stays current for 8 hours, only able to do once per day.

Make all list positions IP locked. No change of IP allowed. Or MAC address locked so you cant change devices for instance. Or add geofencing to the IP so you cant change IP's from an area (so as an australian in Brisbane I'd need to have someone at least in my city, at least allowing my IP to change at ISP level). You should be one human per camp, not one toon.

Have list position decay if you fail afk checks. So fail a check = knocked back 2 positions from 1 to 3, or 3 to 5 etc. Not from 1 to nonexistent.

[DMN]

11 people at eye and the number 1 guy has been there 60 hours. someone really is gonna die there

[Endonde]

11 people at eye and the number 1 guy has been there 60 hours. someone really is gonna die there

Yea, I'm all for items being rare on EQ, and people needing to work to get those rare items, but this goes back to what I was talking about earlier. The amount of time you are required to spend on the list to get a Manastone is so large that it's either impossible for 1 individual to do, or incredibly unhealthy.

If you really want to do Manastone right now you should be prepared to account share with some friends so you can all get sleep, take showers, cook dinner, a single individual can't really do any of those things while maintaining their spot on the list.

[Swish]

11 people at eye and the number 1 guy has been there 60 hours. someone really is gonna die there

Must have gone through the whole Marvel catalogue by now.

[skorge]

I've been reading this and must say this is an actual threat to the P99 community. The staff really needs to address this. The /list at the EE camp is a huge fail at this point.

I also know for a fact that the manastone should be the common drop. When EQ first launched Verant had no clue how powerful the stone was. Get this, even though the stone was common, nobody bothered to camp it, until one day some dude realized how powerful of an item it was, then it caught on like fire. Several months after launch Verant decided to make it more rare. Then, even later, they removed it all together.

True story.

On Red launch the stone dropped commonly. I know. I was there. We saw several a day drop without even a line. My suggestion. Make it drop like 75% of the time like it should be.

/thread

[Solist]

After 27.5 hours between manastone drops, one just dropped for Pine. Soo happy for him!

[skorge]

After 27.5 hours between manastone drops, one just dropped for Pine. Soo happy for him!

One should be dropping about every 3 hours or so. They have the drop rate completely wrong here. That is the problem. Even on Red the stone was dropping commonly. No clue what made them reverse the drop rates on Green. It's not classic.

[Dolalin]

If the ph isn't being killed for some period of time, everyone on the list should be kicked off and blacklisted for a bit.

[Endonde]

If the ph isn't being killed for some period of time, everyone on the list should be kicked off and blacklisted for a bit.

This has not been the case at Manastone, the PH is instantly killed every time it spawns.

[Quinas]

The law of unintended consequences.

[Enshadowed]

Dude I literally got to 42? hours and shut down. I couldnt even type the codes in properly and the adds for youtube videos woke me up twice. Sat on a wooden box instead of a chair so my body was forced to stay upright and not 'rest'. Someone took over for me while i slept 5 hours.

Guy ahead of me passed out for 30mins at #1 and lost his spot before he got a stone. He had been there 45 hours straight.

Guy behind me has been on for 50hours now, is still #3. Hasn't logged off once.

Guy currently ahead of me at #1 currently goes LD occasionally and i suspect has changed humans once or twice.

Guy 2 slots behind me in 4th is at 35hrs or so i think now. 5th is in the 30's too. And a bunch are 20+ through to 8 or 9.

This just makes me sad. Go to sleep, guys. This isn't worth it.

[skorge]

This just makes me sad. Go to sleep, guys. This isn't worth it.

The sad thing is these guys should have long had their manastone. They have the drop rate so screwed up it's taking over 20 hours for one stone to drop. They should be dropping like candy right now in this era. 5+ a day should be dropping.

[nicemace]

ive gotta say this is concerning eh. don't make any changes, just let people afk so they can actually look after themselves.

[cd288]

Dude I literally got to 42? hours and shut down. I couldnt even type the codes in properly and the adds for youtube videos woke me up twice. Sat on a wooden box instead of a chair so my body was forced to stay upright and not 'rest'. Someone took over for me while i slept 5 hours.

Guy ahead of me passed out for 30mins at #1 and lost his spot before he got a stone. He had been there 45 hours straight.

Guy behind me has been on for 50hours now, is still #3. Hasn't logged off once.

Guy currently ahead of me at #1 currently goes LD occasionally and i suspect has changed humans once or twice.

Guy 2 slots behind me in 4th is at 35hrs or so i think now. 5th is in the 30's too. And a bunch are 20+ through to 8 or 9.

This is dangerous man. People need to stop doing this. It also makes no sense. In that amount of time you could farm enough plat to buy multiple manastones when they stop dropping. You don't even need to farm for that many hours straight; you have 6 months to farm enough plat. There's no reason to spend 60+ hours camping some item that won't even be that beneficial to most classes once Kunark comes out and you're leveling in those zones rather than the classic world.

[Fammaden]

30 hours straight for verix about 2 months ago was nothing for me.

I've spent a LOT of time pulling KC basement on my ranger and I can not imagine any scenario where it takes 30 hours to get a verix.

[toasteroven]

Was the drop rate changed? In the last week or during the launch of Teal?

My recommendations

1. You must be on the engage log, else you cannot loot and it passes to the next person on the list. Ex. If you are #1 and aren't on the engage log and MS drops, #2 can loot, and #1 retains position to try again next time.

2. 30 Seconds or less response on AFK checks. Like any other camp in the game.

3. If you disconnect, log, or leave the area you get knocked off the list (like any other camp). Maybe this is too harsh, but at least reduce the amount of time from 900 seconds to 300.

The list will turn over more often, but it won't feel as painful losing your place

[roks1]

anti-camp radius /nod
*

Now that's a player theory i've not seen in a damn coons age.

[Solist]

ANNNND I was just kicked off of the list after over 50 hours of being on it, being on almost if not EVERY single PH and eye encounter log.

I was literally typing in /say talking to the other guys here, and in the middle of a sentence got the 'You have been removed from the list for failing AFK checks'. Checks I never even got on my screen.

This is heartbreaking. I can understand failing AFK checks for being AFK, falling asleep etc. But not even getting them and being kicked is fucking brutal. Whole line up of people on the list here agree I was here, active, and talking at the time even.


So it might have some glitches... Maybe it has a hard built time limit?

[cd288]

Was the drop rate changed? In the last week or during the launch of Teal?

My recommendations

1. You must be on the engage log, else you cannot loot and it passes to the next person on the list. Ex. If you are #1 and aren't on the engage log and MS drops, #2 can loot, and #1 retains position to try again next time.

2. 30 Seconds or less response on AFK checks. Like any other camp in the game.

3. If you disconnect, log, or leave the area you get knocked off the list (like any other camp). Maybe this is too harsh, but at least reduce the amount of time from 900 seconds to 300.

The list will turn over more often, but it won't feel as painful losing your place

No changes are needed to the list system itself. The item either needs to be changed to reflect classic drop rates (which likely won't happen because it's somewhat OP in the classic era and the only reason it dropped more frequently at the time was because Verant didn't realize how OP it would be) or people just need to accept the fact that it's going to be a really long slog for this item in particular.

Also, I don't really see the point to your number 1. Most people on the list are participating in downing the spawn, especially if they are at the top of the list. And if they're not, who cares. Others will still help kill the spawn regardless of whether the person at the top is on the engage log because the faster the spawn and PHs are killed, the faster the list moves.

[cd288]

ANNNND I was just kicked off of the list after over 50 hours of being on it, being on almost if not EVERY single PH and eye encounter log.

I was literally typing in /say talking to the other guys here, and in the middle of a sentence got the 'You have been removed from the list for failing AFK checks'. Checks I never even got on my screen.

This is heartbreaking. I can understand failing AFK checks for being AFK, falling asleep etc. But not even getting them and being kicked is fucking brutal. Whole line up of people on the list here agree I was here, active, and talking at the time even.


So it might have some glitches... Maybe it has a hard built time limit?

Based on replies in this thread it does not have a built in time limit for how long you can be on the list itself

[Fammaden]

Remove these fucking "legacy items" and delete existing ones from the server. They were removed because Verant recognized that they never should have existed, we could have started green with them "fixed" by never being in the spawn table in the first place. I dont want to see P99 end up national news when someone goes to the hospital or worse.

Added bonus this would likely ease population and remove some of the most greedy assholes playing.

[Solist]

Based on replies in this thread it does not have a built in time limit for how long you can be on the list itself

How do you figure? I don't think anyone's been on any list on the server longer than me in any camp? Pretty sure the guy ahead of me only joined an hour or so before me and he's been gone for 5.5hrs.

[Psyborg]

Dude I literally got to 42? hours and shut down. I couldnt even type the codes in properly and the adds for youtube videos woke me up twice. Sat on a wooden box instead of a chair so my body was forced to stay upright and not 'rest'. Someone took over for me while i slept 5 hours.

Guy ahead of me passed out for 30mins at #1 and lost his spot before he got a stone. He had been there 45 hours straight.

Guy behind me has been on for 50hours now, is still #3. Hasn't logged off once.

Guy currently ahead of me at #1 currently goes LD occasionally and i suspect has changed humans once or twice.

Guy 2 slots behind me in 4th is at 35hrs or so i think now. 5th is in the 30's too. And a bunch are 20+ through to 8 or 9.

This seems more like an issue with an unlucky string of drops on Green. Teal hasn't had this issue. Things will straighten out over there. The person who proposed making it always drop is still wrong. That's not how camping a coveted item in EQ should work.

[cd288]

How do you figure? I don't think anyone's been on any list on the server longer than me in any camp? Pretty sure the guy ahead of me only joined an hour or so before me and he's been gone for 5.5hrs.

Because it wouldn't make sense to code in a hard limit for the list if you are reducing the item drop rate and you already have AFK checks. You'd only need a hard limit if you weren't implementing AFK checks and were therefore worried about people generally going AFK periodically while laying claim to a camp for tens of hours.

It was probably just a bug in the system. Post in the petition forums about it.

[Rust1d?]

Just make the spawn time lower or up the drop rate. Also make the stone no drop.

[ilgart112]

YOU ARENT ENTITLED TO A MANASTONE. THIS ISNT P99 EVERYONE GETS A MANASTONE. 99% of you will not get a manastone. get over it.

[Lone Gnome]

i think it should be more rare then 1 manastone per 10 hours, it wasnt like this on real classic

[cd288]

i think it should be more rare then 1 manastone per 10 hours, it wasnt like this on real classic

Classic was apparently more common, since Verant didn't know how somewhat OP the item would be

[Chocolope]

I got mine right about the 12 hour total mark (10 hours as #1). The duo behind me (who sat with me for about 8 of my 10) had not seen another for 24 hours after mine dropped. Not sure on total time because it had still not dropped as of very early this morning.

If you want a stone you should have a plan within the current given rules, be that handing off the account, having a RL friend over for the weekend to shift swap or whatever. Now when I say handing off the account I want to clarify, that as P99 currently has no rules against it, I have no issue with handing off the SINGLE char to a friend who is not playing their char at the time so you can get a nap. A group of 6 people taking shifts managing the list for their group however, is called boxing, which is against the rules and should be reported if this behavior is seen.

The current system is rugged and in need of refinement imo. Its also a big commitment and you have to consider your health. I know many joke about unhealthy play time and we all have our own personal abilities and desires... just be careful guys as I said have a plan, be prepared, know your limits.

To be honest my anxiety is still through the roof from that AFK button and worrying about missing it while I ran upstairs to refill my cup of water.

Lastly... change your afk alert box from transparent to bright red... helped me at least.

[ilgart112]

the only solution would be enable pvp in the vicinity of the camp, other than that prepare for a 50+ hour camp or dont do it.

[DMN]

My solution to this would have been: make the stone no drop. Must be level 35 to loot. Keep the original drop rates. I don't know exactly what they were, but they were close to the mith 2 hander drop rates. Well over 30% of the time. A month or so before they were removed the drop rate was significantly reduced.

[ilgart112]

Your solution is terrible because it goes against everything this server stands for, which is a classic remake. my pvp idea is also a terrible idea because the same issue its not classic. would you rather have 1 guild farming it 24/7 and you have no chance? stop crying its so pathetic.

[cd288]

My solution to this would have been: make the stone no drop. Must be level 35 to loot. Keep the original drop rates. I don't know exactly what they were, but they were close to the mith 2 hander drop rates. Well over 30% of the time. A month or so before they were removed the drop rate was significantly reduced.

I thought you had to be pretty close to the level of the mob to get on the list and loot the item. Or did that pre-launch proposal not end up getting implemented?

[Coridan]

Your solution is terrible because it goes against everything this server stands for, which is a classic remake. my pvp idea is also a terrible idea because the same issue its not classic. would you rather have 1 guild farming it 24/7 and you have no chance? stop crying its so pathetic.

A true classic remake would not allow people the foresight to know what items were going to be removed and when.

[cd288]

A true classic remake would not allow people the foresight to know what items were going to be removed and when.

-_-

[branamil]

Dude I literally got to 42? hours and shut down. I couldnt even type the codes in properly and the adds for youtube videos woke me up twice. Sat on a wooden box instead of a chair so my body was forced to stay upright and not 'rest'. Someone took over for me while i slept 5 hours.

Guy ahead of me passed out for 30mins at #1 and lost his spot before he got a stone. He had been there 45 hours straight.

Guy behind me has been on for 50hours now, is still #3. Hasn't logged off once.

Guy currently ahead of me at #1 currently goes LD occasionally and i suspect has changed humans once or twice.

Guy 2 slots behind me in 4th is at 35hrs or so i think now. 5th is in the 30's too. And a bunch are 20+ through to 8 or 9.

Reminder that you went through physical torture to get a mystical wizard pod in disposable elf world #26782. EVerything ok in real life?

[ilgart112]

Manastone camp is working perfectly please dont change a thing.

[Deliverator]

Manastone camp is NOT working perfectly. They even looked up evidence to prove that their spawn rates and drop rates were wrong. And yet, they haven't changed a thing.

[Daldaen]

A true classic remake would not allow people the foresight to know what items were going to be removed and when.

The better fix for a classic experience would’ve been to throw Manastone on a different named mob.

How many people would find the Manastone if they’d put it on a named Spiroc in OOT or on a named in Cazic Thule, etc.

People knowing where items drop is far more important than when it’s being removed.

Regardless I think the unclassic drop rate needs to be removed which should help with the listing issues. Also set the list limitation to one per lifetime. If people want to grind 35 halfling warriors to get more Manastones fine.

[cd288]

The better fix for a classic experience would’ve been to throw Manastone on a different named mob.

How many people would find the Manastone if they’d put it on a named Spiroc in OOT or on a named in Cazic Thule, etc.

People knowing where items drop is far more important than when it’s being removed.

Regardless I think the unclassic drop rate needs to be removed which should help with the listing issues. Also set the list limitation to one per lifetime. If people want to grind 35 halfling warriors to get more Manastones fine.

Lol that would've been great if they just randomly switched up the mobs that drop things

[tg822]

Think what we’re seeing is just because you can do something, like create “classic” Everquest doesn’t mean you should attempt it. Did the devs not see Jurassic park?

[ilgart112]

maybe you guys should start your own server and make manastones drop from spirocs in the karanas see how many people play on your server.

[baakss]

There's 2-3 people with 50+ hours on the current list so far. This is getting to the point where it can't be done by a single person without health risks.

The only way to do it right now is to pass off your character between RL people in shifts.


If that's what was intended, I'd be surprised.

[ilgart112]

an online game that requires friends to win, what a terrible concept

[Wwen42]

I've been at the manastone camp for 29 hours currently, and have been awake for a total of 37 or so hours.

I am #2 on the list which means ostensibly I need to continue clicking this check box every 5 to 15 mins for the next 10 to 20 hours straight.

This is beyond unhealthy but it is the only way to get one when the other guys just run a roster and sit in camp doing shifts. Its so blatantly obvious watching a toon LD, come back and cast entirely different spells and sit somewhere else for 6 hours+, then the original comes back etc.

I'm a bit afraid for my health but short of sharing accounts there's nothing that can be done except be at this camp for a minimum of 40 hours (MINIMUM) as the drop rate is so unclassic. Pretty soul destroying I gotta say.

Edit: Not knowing how the afk checks work is kinda shit too, the limits are not clearly defined. Running off for a shit, shower, prepare some fucking dogshit unhealthy meal praying this AFK check doesnt boot me from list is mega aids. Craving for the ability to just switch off for 30mins and enjoy a steak haha.
The real solution is don't do any of this to begin with. Priorities! End the MS drops prematurely and listen to the lamentations of the hardcore.

[baakss]

an online game that requires friends to win, what a terrible concept

You're suggesting tag teaming the same character so that you can sleep for 4 hours to continue a 70 hour marathon is reasonable?

Dude, what is your deal? Like I can't make out why you're so zealous in defending the list system. You're not in Guk right now on the list. Have you tried this system yet?

[DMN]

Your solution is terrible because it goes against everything this server stands for, which is a classic remake. my pvp idea is also a terrible idea because the same issue its not classic. would you rather have 1 guild farming it 24/7 and you have no chance? stop crying its so pathetic.

And /list is classic?

[Natewest1987]

The real solution is don't do any of this to begin with. Priorities! End the MS drops prematurely and listen to the lamentations of the hardcore.

ending the drop prematurely is nuts. HOWEVER, giving every person 1 stone per account... sounds lovely.

[Wwen42]

They could have made it a random drop off any mob in LGUK, but In the end we can't underestimate the lengths some.... wizards will go to obtain an E-peen item from their misspent youth. I tip my fedora to these gentlemen and will pour out a white Monster in their honor tonight before making love to my wife.

[turbosilk]

an online game that requires friends to win, what a terrible concept

You are exceedingly full of wisdom today.

[Lulz Sect]

you could always not camp it

(lol)

[Wwen42]

you could always not camp it

(lol)

Ok, boomer.

[ilgart112]

I'm for the system because nobody is entitled to anything. EQ is supposed to be brutal, you deserve nothing. go earn it if you cant get over it. 99% of the pop WONT GET A MANASTONE. YOU DESERVE NOTHING. THIS IS WHAT MAKES EQ GREAT

[ilgart112]

if you want to be the same as everyone else go play wow

[baakss]

I'm for the system because nobody is entitled to anything. EQ is supposed to be brutal, you deserve nothing. go earn it if you cant get over it. 99% of the pop WONT GET A MANASTONE. YOU DESERVE NOTHING. THIS IS WHAT MAKES EQ GREAT


Brutal does not automatically mean better.

If your character got randomly deleted and you had to start over now, that'd be pretty brutal, but is it better?

The game is typically very punishing for mistakes, and that's good. Some camps can be extremely time intensive, like pained soul, which is also good.

This is another level entirely. 70+ hours of no real AFK's. No shower, no cooking, no going outside. The only way to do this without health risk is to allow someone else to play your character while you do these things or sleep. That's brutal, but it is not better.

I've seen two people lose the #1 spot with 50+ hours invested, one due to a technical bug, and one because the person passed out on their desk and all the caffeine in the world couldn't save them. This isn't normal dude.

[glencastle]

someone is going to die while waiting at this camp. Every day that dev's do nothing to adjust the list system, they are condoning the type of activities that one must endure to get a manastone (30+ hours of sedentary with limited AFKs inbetween).

There has to be a better way

[cd288]

someone is going to die while waiting at this camp. Every day that dev's do nothing to adjust the list system, they are condoning the type of activities that one must endure to get a manastone (30+ hours of sedentary with limited AFKs inbetween).

There has to be a better way

The devs aren’t condoning anything. Just because you’re dumb enough to threaten your own health and stay up 50+ hours in a row for an item on an emulated server of a 20 year old game when that item is barely useful once Kunark hits, doesn’t mean the deva condone your idiocy.

It would be stupid of me to drink a fifth of liquor when I have work the next day but I don’t blame the distillery when I’m hungover because I chose to be an idiot

[Endonde]

The devs aren’t condoning anything. Just because you’re dumb enough to threaten your own health and stay up 50+ hours in a row for an item on an emulated server of a 20 year old game when that item is barely useful once Kunark hits, doesn’t mean the deva condone your idiocy.

It would be stupid of me to drink a fifth of liquor when I have work the next day but I don’t blame the distillery when I’m hungover because I chose to be an idiot

Kind of flawed logic here, they aren't actively encouraging people to display this behavior, but by having the current system they are in a way condoning it.

By allowing players who log off or go LD 15 minutes to return, it opens the door for people to account share, by allowing account sharing it means that people who would normally log out and leave the list after 16 or 24 hours, will just have someone log on their account and they never leave the list. So now people will rarely leave the list, they will just account share which will increase the overall amount of time spent listing for everyone. So if you don't want to account share, which is something P99 staff has recommended you don't do in the past, the current system is basically telling you to either risk your health or get fucked.

It's easy to say people shouldn't stay awake for 48+ hours at a time sitting at Manastone camp, it's obvious that we should say that, and there is nothing wrong with saying that, but it's also important that we acknowledge there are some serious problems with the current system.

[ilgart112]

would you prefer they use the classic ruleset of whoever first claimed the camp and never left passing the camp back and forth between friends over the current list system?

again complaining you need to work with friends in an online game to accomplish goals, pathetic

[baakss]

Kind of flawed logic here, they aren't actively encouraging people to display this behavior, but by having the current system they are in a way condoning it.

By allowing players who log off or go LD 15 minutes to return, it opens the door for people to account share, by allowing account sharing it means that people who would normally log out and leave the list after 16 or 24 hours, will just have someone log on their account and they never leave the list. So now people will rarely leave the list, they will just account share which will increase the overall amount of time spent listing for everyone. So if you don't want to account share, which is something P99 staff has recommended you don't do in the past, the current system is basically telling you to either risk your health or get fucked.

It's easy to say people shouldn't stay awake for 48+ hours at a time sitting at Manastone camp, it's obvious that we should say that, and there is nothing wrong with saying that, but it's also important that we acknowledge there are some serious problems with the current system.

Bingo. The system created facilitates this kind of playing.

You cannot leave your computer to shower / eat / cook / whatever without risking losing 50+ hours of work. The only way you can do those things is to account share.

Basically the reduced droprate, AFK check, and LD recovery have created the perfect storm for crazy ridiculous windows.

I've done 10+ pained souls, tracked entire windows, done instant coth races, you name it. Nothing compares to this camp.

[baakss]

again complaining you need to work with friends in an online game to accomplish goals, pathetic


Account sharing != playing with friends. When I group I play with friends. When I account share, I'm not playing with them, I'm asking them to do me a favor of 4 hours of work so I can nap.

[ilgart112]

god close this thread, this crying and whining is so gross

[ilgart112]

i feel so bad for rogean, dude if youre reading this everything is working great, just relax and enjoy yourself. everything working great and as intended. You doin a fine job boss

[cd288]

Bingo. The system created facilitates this kind of playing.

You cannot leave your computer to shower / eat / cook / whatever without risking losing 50+ hours of work. The only way you can do those things is to account share.

Basically the reduced droprate, AFK check, and LD recovery have created the perfect storm for crazy ridiculous windows.

I've done 10+ pained souls, tracked entire windows, done instant coth races, you name it. Nothing compares to this camp.

Blaming the devs for the player being an idiot and spending 50+ hours trying to get a somewhat pointless item on an emulated server of a 20 year old game might be one of the dumbest things I’ve heard in awhile.

[skipdog]

Just imagine how hard people would be crying and whining without the list system. There'd be a name and shame thread every other day for the 'monsters' who held the camp without giving it up.

[supermonk]

lock a player out from the list for like idk 30 days if they've already looted a manastone?

[baakss]

i feel so bad for rogean, dude if youre reading this everything is working great, just relax and enjoy yourself. everything working great and as intended. You doin a fine job boss

Nobody is anti staff here. It's hard to come up with a system that is perfect on the first pass. It's not like they have people testing this camp the way we play it ahead of time to know how nasty this will be. The fact that they tried something to begin with is great, but this definitely needs to be looked at again.


Honestly, you haven't done this camp, so I think your opinion about how great it works is pretty useless.

[skipdog]

Honestly, you haven't done this camp, so I think your opinion about how great it works is pretty useless.

Ooohhhh we're already at the 'if you haven't done the 50 hour camp yourself, your opinion doesn't matter' stage of gatekeeping hilarity!

[baakss]

Ooohhhh we're already at the 'if you haven't done the 50 hour camp yourself, your opinion doesn't matter' stage of gatekeeping hilarity!

Sorry if my dismissiveness upsets you. But yes, I don't think Ilgart or you have any idea what you're talking about.

You don't know how bad the AFK checks are without having done it. It's easy to say, "I like the concept of AFK checks" without knowing what the implementation is like when you have to keep it up for tens of hours on end.

[skipdog]

Sorry if my dismissiveness upsets you. But yes, I don't think Ilgart or you have any idea what you're talking about.

You don't know how bad the AFK checks are without having done it. It's easy to say, "I like the concept of AFK checks" without knowing what the implementation is like when you have to keep it up for tens of hours on end.

LOL, I'm fully aware of how the afk checks work and have experienced them.

Yeah, keep trying to pretend that anyone who thinks you're all huge babies for crying and whining about how long the manastone list is just "doesn't know what it's like".

[Swish]

A little truth bomb: these lists are only going to get worse.

I'm going to farm plat and buy one later on.

[Danth]

Obviously the correct approach would've been to never have legacy items drop at all.

Danth

[Zaes]

Obviously the correct approach would've been to never have legacy items drop at all.

Danth

Probably the best answer but not #classic

[jacob54311]

Obviously the correct approach would've been to never have legacy items drop at all.

Danth

The problem isn't so much the legacy items, but how obsessed some players get about looting one.

[Swish]

Obviously the correct approach would've been to never have legacy items drop at all.

Danth

https://i.imgur.com/LdCm8tR.gif

[tg822]

The most classic thing actually is to remove them once it becomes obvious how problematic they are, ie now.

[Swish]

The most classic thing actually is to remove them once it becomes obvious how problematic they are, ie now.

https://i.imgur.com/apRp7TQ.gif

Leave them in, the strong will endure.

[Fammaden]

Probably the best answer but not #classic

Neither is the AE mob limit, or rooted ToV dragons. But things like this are done when the player behavior is creating a far less classic experience than the changes designed to address the problem behaviors.

I highly doubt there were fifty hour wait lists for the EE in LGuK on week three of vanilla EQ. Player made wait lists certainly never required a manual afk check every five to fifteen minutes, you just got a tell when it was your turn to join camp and you had to be in the XP group regardless.

In retrospect, IMO, removing the items that artificially create this insane reaction from the players was the lesser of all evils. I've felt this way, and have mentioned so a few times, basically since green was officially announced.

I do however understand why the decision would feel bad and why they highly preferred to keep these things as part of the timeline. If nothing else it would have created slippery slope feelings like "then why is this hybrid penalty bullshit still in game" for example. But sometimes you just have to draw a line, and its been done due to player behavior in P99 before.

[jacob54311]

The most classic thing actually is to remove them once it becomes obvious how problematic they are, ie now.

By that line of reasoning, they'd also have to get rid of other things that were taken out once they realized they were really bad ideas like the heavy xp penalty on hybrids and making pet casters research all their pet spells after level 20.

You might be on to something.

[Swish]

By that line of reasoning, they'd also have to get rid of other things that were taken out once they realized they were really bad ideas like the heavy xp penalty on hybrids and making pet casters research all their pet spells after level 20.

You might be on to something.

It'd literally shred the game of what it was in 1999.

If you want EQ Lite, go and say hi to Daybreak. They could use the extra players.

Or go back to blue <3

[MasterCS]

Yes, preventing that person from dying will have disastrous consequences.

So the responsibility falls on the server hosts to protect people from themselves? Get a grip. If someone is willing to risk their health over something so meaninglessness, they have bigger issues. Also, where do you people get the time to even camp this for more than a few hours? Are all of you on vacation (tic)?

[skipdog]

Also, where do you people get the time to even camp this for more than a few hours? Are all of you on vacation (tic)?

Welfare and Disability would be your answers.

[Fammaden]

So the responsibility falls on the server hosts to protect people from themselves? Get a grip. If someone is willing to risk their health over something so meaninglessness, they have bigger issues. Also, where do you people get the time to even camp this for more than a few hours? Are all of you on vacation (tic)?

Again, for the good of the server and everyone's ensured continuing play experience I don't want P99 to end up in the news, or on the wrong end of a frivolous lawsuit, because some beard afk checked himself into severe dehydration or a manic sleep deprivation episode.

Not to say that extreme neckbearding is the devs' fault, but certain realities have to be considered here. This shit is not normal, even by EQ standards, and the BEST case scenario is the account sharing behavior which itself is no real improvement on the community experience for the server.

[DMN]

I have an idea that just might work with minimal adjustment to the list system:

You go and get on the /list but instead of being ordered in how you arrived, the "winner" of the stone will be RANDOMLY chosen. 'Still rewards neckbeards for longer camp times, and normies have at least a chance to happen upon one.


Change the lockout to a month , too.

[ZiggyTheMuss]

Just imagine how hard people would be crying and whining without the list system. There'd be a name and shame thread every other day for the 'monsters' who held the camp without giving it up.

Mmhmmm

if you want to be the same as everyone else go play wow

Yep

you could always not camp it

(lol)

*nods*

Honestly, you haven't done this camp, so I think your opinion about how great it works is pretty useless.

If you even consider sitting at your computer for 50+ hours an option then you have made very poor life decisions therefore I think your opinion regarding healthy human behavior is pretty useless.

Sat on a wooden box instead of a chair so my body was forced to stay upright and not 'rest'.

LOL!

[baakss]

If you even consider sitting at your computer for 50+ hours an option then you have made very poor life decisions therefore I think your opinion regarding healthy human behavior is pretty useless.


Character sharing is how everyone is doing it. Which is also dumb.

[turbosilk]

i feel so bad for rogean, dude if youre reading this everything is working great, just relax and enjoy yourself. everything working great and as intended. You doin a fine job boss

As someone who has camped the EE for varying times over a varying number of days I agree. Great implementation Rogean and the rest of the staff.

[Vexenu]

Is it against server rules to hire the services of Chinese gold farmers to sit on the Manastone list for you?

I feel like that could be the new meta.

[jacob54311]

As someone who has camped the EE for varying times over a varying number of days I agree. Great implementation Rogean and the rest of the staff.

Message boards always tend to attract the malcontents.

You can go to movie message boards for some of the most popular movies in history and half the posts will be extremely negative.

[Gustoo]

Is it against server rules to hire the services of Chinese gold farmers to sit on the Manastone list for you?

I feel like that could be the new meta.

Fully meta RMT activity

[turbosilk]

Character sharing is how everyone is doing it. Which is also dumb.

Also not true.

[SenoraRaton]

Also not true.

Then those people are silly. Why would I not organize a buddy or 2 to help me with the current rule set? Why bother risking your health, sleep and have your friends help. Sure you might have to camp it 3 times as long, but at least you can spread it out. Having friends help you is how it SHOULD be done at the moment. Otherwise its a health risk, and its not logical to even attempt it.

[Swish]

Then those people are silly. Why would I not organize a buddy or 2 to help me with the current rule set? Why bother risking your health, sleep and have your friends help. Sure you might have to camp it 3 times as long, but at least you can spread it out. Having friends help you is how it SHOULD be done at the moment. Otherwise its a health risk, and its not logical to even attempt it.

Friends give items back they borrowed though Senora. Nice to see you back ;)

[baakss]

Also not true.

The current #1 has been at the camp about 60 hours now. The one before him was over 50 hours.

Nobody is doing this for 60 hours without tagging out to rest occasionally.

[Swish]

So if you work in a team of 2-3, who owns the item when its looted? The /list guy or whoever is holding onto it?

Its an interesting can of worms to open up.

[turbosilk]

My friends had 1-2 of us that would list for a x hours over a whichever days we carved out time and those not on list would help with kills. We also helped kill the mobs for whoever was #1 on the list.

Didn't stay up late either and eat into our sleep. No reason not to get full nights of sleep and this stuff is in game for 6 months. 6 months is an eternity almost and at the same time the game is still the best around if people don't get a manastone. The guise has more long term value for me.

[ilgart112]

I actually have a manastone thank you very much, please dont speak for me pleb.

[turbosilk]

I actually have a manastone thank you very much, please dont speak for me pleb.

Are you referring to me?

[ilgart112]

i dont know turbo whoever said i didnt have one and my opinion is invalid, im not going back two pages of this thread to check.

[Polycaster]

I'm looking forward to P99 getting some national news coverage when some nerd croaks from a 120-hour manastone session.

Free publicity? I think you've discovered the devious plan cooked up by the P99 devs.

[GnomeCaptain]

Are these camp times real? People are really doing this?

This is profoundly unhealthy. Please don't do this.

[DMN]

i dont know turbo whoever said i didnt have one and my opinion is invalid, im not going back two pages of this thread to check.

I think he meant to say your opinion is invalid because it's so stupid.

Of course unemployed neckbeards are happy with the system. They already got their stones.

[ZiggyTheMuss]

Are these camp times real? People are really doing this?

This is profoundly unhealthy. Please don't do this.

Yep, this guy sat on a WOODEN BOX and stayed awake over 50 hours probably doing irreparable damage to his already frail immune system and he didn't even get his MERNASTONE!

[ilgart112]

I'm dedicated to the quest what can I say. you must not be as big of an EQ fan as I am. Thats why i have a manastone, and you want to post on the forums to get yours.

[DMN]

No, I have job and real life commitments. That's why I don't have stone. It's also why I don't intend on getting one either.

[turbosilk]

I'm dedicated to the quest what can I say. you must not be as big of an EQ fan as I am. Thats why i have a manastone, and you want to post on the forums to get yours.

I got my manastone before you?

[Bazia]

i can hear the heavy breathing coming from the end of this thread

[Lhord99]

Too late to do this on Teal? Less than 1/2 the pop

[Modwolf]

Is there actually any downside to just doubling or tripling the droprate? There's going to be hundreds of these things in the game by the time they no longer drop, what does it matter if it's hundreds or thousands? Somebody is legitimately going to get hurt or die camping this and it's literally just a stupid pixel trinket on an emulated server of a 20 year old game.

I understand the developers here are in love with their gimmick of making these servers "classic" and it's a cute dream but ultimately this server is a nostalgia toybox and it's not worth going thru this bullshit over. Just make the damn stone drop super fast and have a LIFETIME lockout on getting one per account

[Bazia]

Too late to do this on Teal? Less than 1/2 the pop

guildy on teal just got one after 32 hours

[Vexenu]

Pro tip: camp the Manastone while sitting on top of a coffin, that way when you collapse and die after 50 straight hours ingesting Mountain Dew, cigarettes and Zebra Cakes the paramedics who discover your body can just ignominiously roll you inside and cart you away.

Advanced tactic: actually lay inside the coffin while playing, with monitors suspended overhead, Sam Deathwalker-style.

God-tier: bury yourself underground in a coffin with a laptop so that nothing can disturb you while camping the Manastone.

[Siege]

i can hear the heavy breathing coming from the end of this thread

That's a fart muffled by a shit-filled sock.

[zodium]

Is there actually any downside to just doubling or tripling the droprate? There's going to be hundreds of these things in the game by the time they no longer drop, what does it matter if it's hundreds or thousands? Somebody is legitimately going to get hurt or die camping this and it's literally just a stupid pixel trinket on an emulated server of a 20 year old game.

I understand the developers here are in love with their gimmick of making these servers "classic" and it's a cute dream but ultimately this server is a nostalgia toybox and it's not worth going thru this bullshit over. Just make the damn stone drop super fast and have a LIFETIME lockout on getting one per account

turn that last paragraph on its head: we knew exactly this would happen because of classic; because of Blue. it was called in advance. by many people.

look at what is being done and the gameplay being incentivized just to maintain drop rates at what we currently believe was classic. its like we went to santa's workshop but everything's dark as hell and the elves are deformed mutants. the only people who think this is good are forumquesters and red players. this is madness.

[zodium]

Pro tip: camp the Manastone while sitting on top of a coffin, that way when you collapse and die after 50 straight hours ingesting Mountain Dew, cigarettes and Zebra Cakes the paramedics who discover your body can just ignominiously roll you inside and cart you away.

Advanced tactic: actually lay inside the coffin while playing, with monitors suspended overhead, Sam Deathwalker-style.

God-tier: bury yourself underground in a coffin with a laptop so that nothing can disturb you while camping the Manastone.

bigly disappointed you didn't go for the "kill yourself" punchline, or at least "log off"

[aaezil]

Need to stop this sharing accounts to stay on the list 50 hours crap. If you gotta sleep too bad the list keeps moving and you try the next day

[zodium]

Need to stop this sharing accounts to stay on the list 50 hours crap. If you gotta sleep too bad the list keeps moving and you try the next day

yeah once aaezils personally designs some rules so clever it'll logic ludomaniacs out of gambling themselves to death this will all be np

[zillabunny]

I've been reading this and must say this is an actual threat to the P99 community. The staff really needs to address this. The /list at the EE camp is a huge fail at this point.

I also know for a fact that the manastone should be the common drop. When EQ first launched Verant had no clue how powerful the stone was. Get this, even though the stone was common, nobody bothered to camp it, until one day some dude realized how powerful of an item it was, then it caught on like fire. Several months after launch Verant decided to make it more rare. Then, even later, they removed it all together.

True story.

On Red launch the stone dropped commonly. I know. I was there. We saw several a day drop without even a line. My suggestion. Make it drop like 75% of the time like it should be.

/thread

Yes this is true

[Axlrose]

Just a wild suggestion for the /list element.

Players accumulate "camp" time towards the list in the following ways:

- For every hour (and minute) active at these particular camps accumulates time towards the "camp".
- For every hour (and minute) offline from these particular camps accrues a fifty percent penalty loss per the amount of time offline.
- The order of the /list is based upon whomever has the greatest amount of "camp" time accumulated.

Example:

Four players all begin camping at the exact same moment. I will use hour 32 as the end point for my example.

- Player #01 does a 24 hours stint and logs for 08 hours. (24-(8/2)) = 20 hours.
- Player #02 does a 32 hours stint and does not log. (32-(0/2)) = 32 hours.
- Player #03 does a 04 hours stint and logs for 12 hours, then returns for a 16 hour stint. (04-(12/2)+16) = 14 hours.
- Player #04 does an 08 hours stint, logs for 08 hours, then does another 08 hours stint before logging off for 08 hours. (08-(08/2)+08-(08/2)) = 08 hours.

Thus the order of the list at the 32nd hour would be: Player #02, Player #01, Player #03, and Player #04.

Let's say Player #05 started at hour 16 and was in the middle of a 16 hour stint. Thus he would have accumulated 16 hours and thus would fall into the /list after Player #01 and before Player #03 at the original 32nd hour.

It may sound a bit confusing, but you reward those players that put in the time while giving them an option to recollect themselves in real life without losing everything they built up over the long haul. Over a long haul, one may collect enough "camp" time to keep the first /list spot, even with breaks.

[Bazia]

why arent they dropping as much as they are suppose to in the first place?

[Polycaster]

Grown ass men spending 10-20 hrs not actually playing an emulation of a 30 year old mmo but just staring at the screen waiting in line?

Grown ass men commenting on a 20 year old mmo by using a question instead of a declarative statement?

[Danth]

Some folks in this thread are acting as though their characters are going to be deleted if they don't get manastones. List too long? Easy solution--don't do it. I will never understand nor sympathize with the complaints about people who make themselves suffer doing totally optional activities.

Dropping characters that change IP from the list is a good idea, however. Account sharing, while not (and should not be) against the rules, should never be directly encouraged, either.

I warned people about potentially low drop rates pre-launch. Saw that coming from a mile away.

Danth

[Polycaster]

Yes, preventing that person from dying will have disastrous consequences.

Have you been to Walmart? Realize they vote, and breed at disproportionate numbers. Now look at how the % of the population that drains tax money is rising while the % that pays taxes is decreasing. Where do you think that ends?

[Nirgon]

You don't have to camp these items

[Wwen42]

It'd literally shred the game of what it was in 1999.

If you want EQ Lite, go and say hi to Daybreak. They could use the extra players.

Or go back to blue <3

Well shit dood, we should just stay where we are at now. Kunark is too new for me, man. Let's just kill Vox and Naggy until the Heat Death of the Universe.

I'm sure my Asperger's is manageable if I saw a professional.

[Polycaster]

god close this thread, this crying and whining is so gross

Your whining is the most egregious, and the most womanly. STFU

[Khorza]

Not sure where they got the numbers/stats for these drops. Probably after the drop rate was nerfed shortly before they removed it entirely

Going off 10 year old memory, but I remember originally on Blue the Evil Eye being fairly rare compared to the shaman, but the Manastone was a common drop. In fact, I believe the first Evil Eye kill on Blue resulted in a Manastone.

It was like this for awhile, Penoy camped 30 Manastones, and then they changed it to a rare drop. This was still a few months before the Manastone was removed from the drop table, I believe. I don't remember any reason for the nerf, so I figure it was just a custom change by the devs because they felt that too many Manastones were entering the game.

[Isomorphic]

Grown ass men commenting on a 20 year old mmo by using a question instead of a declarative statement?

Yes?

[fadetree]

Your whining is the most egregious, and the most womanly. STFU

Most "womanly"? Yeesh.

[Soothsayer]

This nonsense makes me fearful of the rubicite breastplate list. I'm sure it won't be quite as bad, but these horror stories definitely give me pause.

[Tiger_King]

Let’s be realistic here in the broad sense of play.... increase the drop rates convert the item to no drop and lore item status and be done with it.

I’m not about to compete with people account sharing whom have stacked onto a list heavily favored towards botting and RMT proliferation.

I think it’s hilarious to think account sharing is not on the same level as RMT but hey if you got the cash to hire out some people to log into your account for 40+ hrs straight....Guess what!!
You’re in luck it’s not real RMT because it’s “your character” you didn’t buy it from someone else in fact the opposite occurred!! How dare the “plebs and normal folk want a realistic change after 20yrs of repeat offenders” with camping mechanics.

Just pay that low price fee $10 /hr to some randoms and $400 later the item is yours.

Hell im sure some people would likely pay their own friends that $10/hr to do this for them in cash. Good luck catching any of these culprits p99 team!

People are asking for respectful means to have fun, not bloodletting and punishment.

[sentinel]

Well, the tinfoil people have always maintained that this whole P99 was a RMT venture. I don't believe it, but whatever

[worm4real]

The obsession is kind of funny. People got along quite well on the whole not having manastones in the original game. Yet in this attempt to recapture those days everyone's decided they need one. It's almost like there is some kind of premeditated attempt to turn this into as much of a perversion as possible by the players.

[jacob54311]

You gotta fight, for your right, to Manastone!

[Madbad]

only 10 hours?

[jacob54311]

only 10 hours?

Something must be done. By the time they remove it, they'll be too many of them in the game.

Definitely got to nerf that drop rate.

[brokenkiller]

Also with the rate they are dropping lockout should be longer than a week. That's ridiculous some may get more than one before people camping it for days at a time get even their first one right?

[MrPanther]

How about this? 1 manastone per account permanent limit? Enforce by IP address. If someone wants to pay for a VPN to make seperatr accounts then fine.

[MrPanther]

Your whining is the most egregious, and the most womanly. STFU

Christ dude how sexist can you be? It's no longer the 1970s.... Put down the MAGA hat and take a chill (not red) pill

[jacob54311]

How about this? 1 manastone per account permanent limit? Enforce by IP address. If someone wants to pay for a VPN to make separate accounts then fine.

Seems reasonable. Also probably good for the physical and mental health of the players who are camping the manastone.

[stewe]

Christ dude how sexist can you be? It's no longer the 1970s.... Put down the MAGA hat and take a chill (not red) pill

Typical progressive, projecting himself unto others

[gnomishfirework]

Lol.

Everyone wants the rules changed so they personally can get a manastone.


Just stop. System is perfect. Want a manastone? Have fun playing clickquest for 20+ hours.

Perfect. Let the fools waste their time. Less camps taken for the rest of us.

[DMN]

Lol.

Everyone wants the rules changed so they personally can get a manastone.


Just stop. System is perfect. Want a manastone? Have fun playing clickquest for 20+ hours.

Perfect. Let the fools waste their time. Less camps taken for the rest of us.


System is far from perfect. It still allows a small subset of people to monopolize camps, and /list is of course not at all classic. Also, 20+ is a joke. Try more like 50+ hours.

[Swish]

Everyone wants the rules changed so they personally can get a manastone.

[jacob54311]

Typical progressive, projecting himself unto others

So Mr. Panther is the real sexist... for criticizing a guy for using "womanly" as an insult?

Okay...

[zodium]

legacy items should drop 6 at a time

[Amatsu]

At the rate manastone drops, the account sharers/retired/unemployed people are just getting a breather on the lockout period if we're being real, 30+ hours still no drop on teal, I feel horrible for #1 on the list right now lol. Never was this hard to get, Majority of our spawns were evil eyes too, think I've physically seen about 18 bags drop now and rot, its a shame. Would be nice to see it put on a set timer with a higher drop chance than just leaving it up to good ol RNGesus to take the wheel and decide if you're about to lose a night or two of sleep just to obtain it.

Or realistically just have a better camp location so you could atleast do something other than stare at a wall clicking a box the whole time. Most items with this much of an intense difficulty atleast have options to occupy yourself, here not so much lol.