Are we allowed to like AI art?

[Ciderpress]

I think totally yes we are, and it's awesome. Visual art, music, poetry, whatever.

It's the Wagner problem; you can't decide if you like a piece of art only after you find out who made it. I mean, you can try I guess, it's a free country.

"I think this painting is beautiful, for the time being, but if I find out Frank made it then it sucks." is incoherent.

Also I'm really bored trying to level my rogue sorry.

[Ekco]

yeah, AI art is fine. "artist" have always been so far up their own ass most people are enjoying their pain in a schadenfreude way.

I've been on this train ever since electricsheep.org was putting fractals in electronic lcd frames and selling them 15 years ago.


I'm more concerned with writers and chatgpt. one of the amateur sci-fi writer contests got shut down after like 70 years because submissions increased by like 9000% because of chatgpt

[Ciderpress]

yeah, AI art is fine. "artist" have always been so far up their own ass most people are enjoying their pain in a schadenfreude way.


Very true. If nothing else, AI art is automatically way better than most "modern art" made by humans where some talentless asshole dumps soup on the floor and lays in it, and they put little velvet ropes around it and call it a piece.

[Ekco]

yeah, this is basically just the universe telling them to fuck off at this point.

https://i.imgur.com/vcnTzBC.jpeg

[Reiwa]

"Artists" in today's definition of the term should be obsoleted as soon as is possible.

[Reiwa]

I'm more concerned with writers and chatgpt. one of the amateur sci-fi writer contests got shut down after like 70 years because submissions increased by like 9000% because of chatgpt

That includes them Hollywood types who like to go on strike despite already being worth millions.

[shovelquest]

Every story is the exact same story as one in the bible but with the matrix instead of heaven.

AI cant come soon enough, I've waited too long for an excellent starwars Jurassic park mashup.

Imagine when we can ask AI to mod EQ to be exactly as if brad created it, but totally new.

"Make me an everquest clone but the world is in DUNE"

People don't want this? Makes no sense to me.

[Reiwa]

Every story is the exact same story as one in the bible but with the matrix instead of heaven.

AI cant come soon enough, I've waited too long for an excellent starwars Jurassic park mashup.

Imagine when we can ask AI to mod EQ to be exactly as if brad created it, but totally new.

"Make me an everquest clone but the world is in DUNE"

People don't want this? Makes no sense to me.

https://i.imgur.com/jsCQ3nS.jpeg

[shovelquest]

I just want to point out that science fiction writer in the comic is literally writing those same old bible stories again.

"You cannot serve God and money" (Matthew 6:24)

Is giving everyone the tool to create whatever they want for free really capitalism though?

Ima ask chat GPT what it thinks about the morality argument:

So on one side of the morality argument, we hobble ourselves so we can support a few (born luckily) talented writers (that likely will be canceled anyway) and wealthy studio investors.

Or we can all enjoy any element of creativity, and instead focus on building a better world than spending time in imaginary ones.

Chat GPT which one is more moral?:

"If you prioritize practical efforts to improve the real world, focusing on building a better world is more moral."

[Ciderpress]

"Artists" in today's definition of the term should be obsoleted as soon as is possible.

Sounds like a Banksy!

Man, that guy is so cool he doesn't even want credit!

[Reiwa]

"You cannot serve God and money" (Matthew 6:24)

I'm thinking that refers specifically to the interest lending practice of the shekel folk.

[Ekco]

Every story is the exact same story as one in the bible but with the matrix instead of heaven.

AI cant come soon enough, I've waited too long for an excellent starwars Jurassic park mashup.

Imagine when we can ask AI to mod EQ to be exactly as if brad created it, but totally new.

"Make me an everquest clone but the world is in DUNE"

People don't want this? Makes no sense to me.

the hilarious part is this shit will most likely eventually lead to the butlerian jihad from Dune.... and i think we should still do it.

[shovelquest]

I'm thinking that refers specifically to the interest lending practice.

So, a cautionary tale about capitalism. :o

[shovelquest]

the hilarious part is this shit will most likely eventually lead to the butlerian jihad from Dune.... and i think we should still do it.

Also like in Foundation where they killed all the AI, and all of its supporters.

See, all these writers are just a bunch LLMs adapting each other stories over and over.

Give me the power to make Jurrasic Park Starwars dammit!

https://i.imgur.com/dYqAuGU.png

[Reiwa]

So, a cautionary tale about capitalism. :o

Capitalism and interest lending are good bedfellows, but not the same concept.

[shovelquest]

Capitalism and interest lending are good bedfellows, but not the same concept.

Judah was certainly capitalist in my mind, I see very little to no difference between their economic system and ours.

Private ownership, trade, lending, where individuals could accumulate wealth and influence through economic activities.

Could you explain to me how it wasn't?

[Reiwa]

Judah was certainly capitalist in my mind, I see very little to no difference between their economic system and ours.

Private ownership, trade, lending, where individuals could accumulate wealth and influence through economic activities.

Could you explain to me how it wasn't?

AI Overview
Learn more
…
Ancient Israelites didn't have the concepts of money or private property, which are two essential characteristics of capitalism. However, Jews have been associated with money since the Middle Ages when they were only allowed to work in commerce, trade, and other financial industries. As capitalism replaced other forms of commerce, this association remained.

also it's Judea(Iudea). Judah was a dude.

[Ciderpress]

Guys don't get my god damn thread deleted. Banksy sucks let's stay on message.

[Reiwa]

Guys don't get my god damn thread deleted. Banksy sucks let's stay on message.

What did Banksy do?

[Ciderpress]

What did Banksy do?

He makes shitty street art cause he hates his dad I'm assuming.

[Ciderpress]

Here's a banksy:

Hey, you know how we think we're the good guys? Well, we're actually the bad guys except we don't cut people's heads off, but still.

[shovelquest]

AI Overview
Learn more
…
Ancient Israelites didn't have the concepts of money or private property, which are two essential characteristics of capitalism. However, Jews have been associated with money since the Middle Ages when they were only allowed to work in commerce, trade, and other financial industries. As capitalism replaced other forms of commerce, this association remained.

also it's Judea(Iudea). Judah was a dude.

Ancient Israelites were 12 tribes of nomads in the year 2000 BC, 1500 years before judea existed.

The economic system of Judea was entirely based around lending, cash, trade, agriculture, and land ownership.

The story spoken about in the bible, is indeed a cautionary tale about capitalism.

(and to stay on topic)

An ironic reminder that there are no new stories. And all writers are fleshy LLMs.

:o

even jurrasic park is a rip off of a cave painting:

https://i.imgur.com/vAeuDNA.png

[Reiwa]

Ancient Israelites were 12 tribes of nomads in the year 2000 BC, 1500 years before judea existed.

The economic system of Judea was entirely based around lending, cash, trade, agriculture, and land ownership.

The story spoken about in the bible, is indeed a cautionary tale about capitalism.

(and to stay on topic)

An ironic reminder that there are no new stories. And all writers are fleshy LLMs.

:o

but the AI says that's not true. 🙂

[shovelquest]

but the AI says that's not true. 🙂

Well I did, and I'm a human, so unless you're immoral you'll listen to me. :p

[Reiwa]

Well I did, and I'm a human, so unless you're immoral you'll listen to me. :p

hey I'm not immoral, I'm amoral. it's way worse. 👍

[Ciderpress]

Cautionary tales always seem to be about things that mostly work but sometimes don't. There are no cautionary tales about stuff that never works ever, which some argue is actually worse.

[shovelquest]

hey I'm not immoral, I'm amoral. it's way worse. 👍

Elon musk talking to the lead Tesla Bot engineer.

p9MKDWvtk6Q

[Reiwa]

the most prolific graffiti "artist" here tags as CREAMPIE

real creative man good job 👍

[shovelquest]

Would an AI download a car?

Or would that not be a crime anymore in a world where AI can mine for resources, design, and print a car for you?

[Ciderpress]

Cautionary tale: Don't completely jump into a red hot lava volcano intentionally.

#If it saves one life

[shovelquest]

Ever notice how they don't have movie theaters on startrek ships?

And when they do holodeck they just do shakesphere?

I always thought that was dumb, until AI became a thing, now it makes sense to me!

Nobody gonna be watching movies and playing video games in the future.

[loramin]

Ever notice how they don't have movie theaters on startrek ships?

And when they do holodeck they just do shakesphere?

I always thought that was dumb, until AI became a thing, now it makes sense to me!

Nobody gonna be watching movies and playing video games in the future.

Actually the ship had 50k movies in its database, and in both Discovery and Enterprise they had regular movie nights (https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Movie_night).

But, they don't seem to be a popular personal entertainment option in the future. I don't think we've ever seen the crew watching movies in their cabin ... although they do make occasional movie references (https://www.geekgirlauthority.com/8-pop-culture-references-in-star-trek/), so they must have watched them somehow ....

[shovelquest]

Am I wrong but are 9/10 of those post trekker age?

What are the new trekkies called? I'm definitely a trecker and haven't been too into the new stuff, though that Ferengi animated character is A++

It's cool that the movie night is from that "its been a long way, gettn' from there to here" startrek (which I also love) because they did a lot to make them like, Nasa Starfleet I always felt. Which is cool.

I like the JJ abrams movie, but the followups got worse and worse, which were a shame that first one was cool.

I wish I could be like, hey AI make a literal exact copy of everquest, but with statrek TNG and fill out all the zones with themes where you best match the creature types to a theme from the startrek universe.

I mean imagine that!

[Ekco]

Enterprise was the last Star Trek i gave a shit about. even randos doing actual plays of the pen and paper star trek rpg on youtube are better than NuTrek

[Ekco]

Cautionary tale: Don't completely jump into a red hot lava volcano intentionally.

#If it saves one life

this man is not Joe vs the volcano pilled. always jump in the volcano, always.
cmQDIne3CLo

[Duik]

Ever notice how they don't have movie theaters on startrek ships?

And when they do holodeck they just do shakesphere?

I always thought that was dumb, until AI became a thing, now it makes sense to me!

Nobody gonna be watching movies and playing video games in the future.

Star trek Enterprise (i know, im tragic) has an episode with dr phloxx laughing at stoopid humans crying at an old movie showing think gone with the wind era.

[shovelquest]

ai make me joe vs the volcano but with everquset characters

[Duik]

ai do my fucking washing and ironing like you said you would

[Reiwa]

Are we allowed to post about the current AI images controversy in the news?

[magnetaress]

Sure. Why not? It's just very complicated coloring books. Butt coloring books can still be turned into art.

[magnetaress]

Are we allowed to post about the current AI images controversy in the news?

No lol

[shovelquest]

How long until an Ai can play MMO's along with you and function not only as well as another player would in the group, but also in group chat?

[Duik]

How long until an Ai can play MMO's along with you and function not only as well as another player would in the group, but also in group chat?

I never wish to live in a world with this thanks.
Although im exactly old enough to not have to worry about it based on the performance of Rimitto, the bot.

[Jimjam]

Using bots for playing out roleplay scenarios via chat is super popular with kids these days.

Slap that on top of a merc and you’re 77.7% of the way there.

[Ekco]

Soon as Chatgpt gets good enough to Dungeon Master old school DnD better than your average human i'm just gonna do that for the rest of my days. fuck playing video games at that point

[Duik]

What a bunch of sheep.
a.i was supposed to do the boring univentive shit jobs we hate.
But nope you all still simp for the billionaires reason to make fake intelligence.
For them to make even more money at your expense.

Im sorry for you all.

[Ekco]

What a bunch of sheep.
a.i was supposed to do the boring univentive shit jobs we hate.
But nope you all still simp for the billionaires reason to make fake intelligence.
For them to make even more money at your expense.

Im sorry for you all.

the creative types have shit out lowest common dominator content for the last 40 years to appeal to larger audiences, I don't give a fuck if Billionaire A makes more than Billionaire B if the end result is content actually created for me for a change.

[Duik]

Like I said, im sorry for you. You dont even know you are trapped. a.i art is like an echo chamber, put in a statement at the prompt and be fed what you ask for based on what others have already made.

You understand that the reason why humans made the advances we did right? The laborers toiled so the intellectuals had the free time to think shit up like better ways to farm. Make steel then make it stronger etc etc.
By taking the "thinking shit up" part out of our equation we will stagnate and become slaves to our own creations.

But off ya trot and ask chatgpt to "makeses mes an everquest game but wiff green turtles and banana men". Then create a dungeon that talks back to me likeses a real person. Make them call me sexy beast when interacting with me.

Also its not that billionaire A or B make more than each other it is the pooling of that wealth in such a small area.
Sheesh for clever people, you sure are dumb.

[Ekco]

meh, individuality and "thinking shit up" is overrated bring on the echo chamber singularity

qzt3Q3myiEo

and make mine Masamune Shirow cyberpunk themed plz

[shovelquest]

What a bunch of sheep.
a.i was supposed to do the boring univentive shit jobs we hate.
But nope you all still simp for the billionaires reason to make fake intelligence.
For them to make even more money at your expense.

Im sorry for you all.

Yeah when will people think about wizards of the coast.

[arvidez]

What a bunch of sheep.
a.i was supposed to do the boring univentive shit jobs we hate.
But nope you all still simp for the billionaires reason to make fake intelligence.
For them to make even more money at your expense.

Im sorry for you all.

fake intelligence...this sounds like the woke mind virus. just a lotta old info being rearranged.
it's not art, its ai art. its not racist, its antiracist.

google fired their anti-white ai because it reflected its creators.

[Duik]

OK

[Ciderpress]

It's okay to be a billionaire. It usually means you own an extremely successful company that employs tens of thousands of people and provides them a flourishing and productive life for themselves and their families. The horror!

Beware though, for once you have too much money you become super bad and evil and terrible. How much money is that? Well, it's the amount of money that is one dollar more than what I have obviously.

[loramin]

It almost always means you were born to extremely affluent parents, and used wealth you never earned to become even more wealthy.

FTFY

[Ciderpress]

I suppose the Obamas won't be leaving anything to their children? Oh of course they will, but I know it only magically becomes bad or good once you find out who's doing it. Much like AI art!

Cmon don't make it this obvious you're trying to get this thread deleted on purpose.

[Duik]

It's okay to be a billionaire. It usually means you own an extremely successful company that employs tens of thousands of people and provides them a flourishing and productive life for themselves and their families. The horror!

Beware though, for once you have too much money you become super bad and evil and terrible. How much money is that? Well, it's the amount of money that is one dollar more than what I have obviously.

Are you fucking serious? I know you are.
Oh well.

Simp on simpers.

[shovelquest]

AI please clone project 1999, but it's cyberpunk.

https://i.imgur.com/iG5Yz5E.png

[shovelquest]

FTFY

Hmm ru sure?

Research from sources like Forbes and studies on wealth generation often show that a significant number of billionaires, especially in the U.S., are self-made. In fact, Forbes' 2023 Billionaires List indicated that around 67% of U.S. billionaires are self-made, meaning they did not inherit their wealth but accumulated it through business ventures or investments (Forbes Africa (https://www.forbesafrica.com/billionaires/2024/04/03/forbes-richest-worlds-billionaires-list-2024/)).

There is also this.

"Shirtsleeves to Shirtsleeves in Three Generations": A widely cited adage, often attributed to various cultures, suggests that wealth tends to dissipate by the third generation. In the U.S., it's noted that about 70% of wealthy families lose their wealth by the second generation, and 90% lose it by the third generation . This implies that a significant proportion of those born into wealth do not manage to keep it through subsequent generations.

So glad we have chat GPT and other AI systems to help clear up things!

[Reiwa]

Hmm ru sure?



There is also this.



So glad we have chat GPT and other AI systems to help clear up things!

“The man who dies rich dies disgraced.” (https://www.forbes.com/sites/chloesorvino/2014/07/08/whats-become-of-them-the-carnegie-family/#:~:text=Barely%20anything%20is%20left%20of,wealth %20of%20white%20collar%20professionals.)

[Ciderpress]

Oh you mean it turns out rich people aren't just generically evil villains, and I was right?? Oh wow

Also it's beside the point anyway, even if every single rich person just got it all for free and became richer and never lost wealth it still wouldn't mean it's morally justified to just envy and covet everything they do or have like a big jealous baby. And I'm dirt poor.

[Duik]

Wow.
It so not about being rich it is about what happens when a few become so wealthy it becomes almost a joke and virtually impossible to fuck it up.

Musky makes a $42B slight error and it was just a small bump in the road. Apart from having to get into bed with a despot oil billionaire who is arguably an arsehole murderer at minimum.

But keep up the simping for musk and bozos etc. Its a good look on you.

To be clear, i do not envy anything about these people who are disgustingly wealthy. I feel sorry that they feel the need to become so.
What small humans that they feel the need to exert their will over others. If you dont get this. Sorry.

[Smoofers]

To be clear, i do not envy anything about these people who are disgustingly wealthy. I feel sorry that they feel the need to become so.
What small humans that they feel the need to exert their will over others. If you dont get this. Sorry.

This is a strange assumption to make. Why do you assume they have these needs? Isn't it plausible that someone simply has the drive to build something great, and wealth is a byproduct?

[Duik]

It may start out like that.

You think ole musky does not enjoy lording it over his minions? NVM.

Open ya eyes sheeple.

[shovelquest]

Duik is right, someone should protect Disney and their IPs from free use.

[Duik]

Ive met and discussed this very thing with a very large company owner. Borg Manufacturing/Logistics etc.

John Borg left school in 9th grade. Started messing with coatings on kitchen doors and benchtops. Did it in his garage for a while. Started out with good intentions im sure.
His uncle saw him and said I see something in you boy. Here is 600k.
If you hit on a winner you can pay me back. That is not the exact story but close enough for our purposes.
16 yrs later he was partners in a billion dollar company. Sounds great. And i defy anyone to do the same.
Then he said Allan ya know why i have acres of storage?
So when a landslide/volcano/flood/bushfire ya know a natural disaster occurs ill get a call from <some company> and theyll say how many kitchens ya got buddy? He says i have not many but ill get the boys on OT (to make himself out to be a "nice fella" and get tax advantages as well) and ill get it to ya quick smart. And then take it out of stock and sell for a premium. Some may say that is smart. I say its a cunt act.

YMMV. And by the sounds of most of you, it will.

@shovel
Lolocaust. Fuck disney. They have fucked the Mandalorian. And the little mermaid, no wait just the Mando.

[Reiwa]

Duik has PM. I wish I could just post the video. It's very mild.

[Ekco]

Nah, fuck em. It just becomes a numbers go up game and competition with their billionaire peers with who can check the most boxes on retarded shit like owning a F1 racing team or a rocket company.

They're all Machiavellian psychopaths and we're watching in real time 3 of them go down the Howard Hughes endgame path building bunkers in Hawaii and New Zealand while the Peter Thiel types are trying to bring about some NWO bullshit.

[Duik]

No Reiwa i wont share my midget pron with you.

Thanks for the link though. Ill look up more on him later.

Thank you mr borg for installing a million dollar paper machine that makes my job (and 100 other people) easier i mean redundant. Im sure you were thinking of the proletariat when you increased your productivity. Not that im against him improving mind you, just dont misinterpret his business decision as helping the "me's" of the world out.
It just makes yas look silly. And simpy.

[Reiwa]

No Reiwa i wont share my midget pron with you.

Thanks for the link though. Ill look up more on him later.

Thank you mr borg for installing a million dollar paper machine that makes my job (and 100 other people) easier i mean redundant. Im sure you were thinking of the proletariat when you increased your productivity. Not that im against him improving mind you, just dont misinterpret his business decision as helping the "me's" of the world out.
It just makes yas look silly. And simpy.

He can't increase his productivity without pleasuring the little guy, so that said guy wants to buy more due to lower cost, an expanded product catalogue, or a customer experience superior to his competitors.(etc)

[Duik]

He can't increase his productivity without pleasuring the little guy, so that said guy wants to buy more due to lower cost, an expanded product catalogue, or a customer experience superior to his competitors.(etc)

I dont dispute that, just the simps saying bozos is installing that million dollar conveyor to help the floor staff. Like really? Clueless and stupid.

[Reiwa]

I dont dispute that, just the simps saying bozos is installing that million dollar conveyor to help the floor staff. Like really? Clueless and stupid.

If it makes their labor more valuable by increasing maximum throughput?

I love this game. 🖤

[shovelquest]

AI one big leap forward in the quest to make me everquest but replace all the art with barbie!

SBdDt4BUIW0

[Duik]

If it makes their labor more valuable by increasing maximum throughput?

I love this game. 🖤

It only serves to make the coproration more money.
Very little to zero thought is given to the floor staff when deciding what to invest in in capital. The most important part of the decision is will it make me, the investor/shareholder more money.

The floor generally does not care about throughput. Although I do feel justified in my wage if our line goes well (for example). Just can I live a good life with the recompense Bozos allows for this job.
That last part does not even enter bozos' mind I am sure.
Bottom line calcs don't include can our workers live on this.

Lolocaust.

[Reiwa]

It only serves to make the coproration more money.
Very little to zero thought is given to the floor staff when deciding what to invest in in capital. The most important part of the decision is will it make me, the investor/shareholder more money.

The floor generally does not care about throughput. Although I do feel justified in my wage if our line goes well (for example). Just can I live a good life with the recompense Bozos allows for this job.
That last part does not even enter bozos' mind I am sure.
Bottom line calcs don't include can our workers live on this.

Lolocaust.

Most of the affordability hokum outside super expensive cities like NYC is based on a single person being able to afford a 2 bedroom place @ minimum wage.

[Ciderpress]

Let's just do away with this whole amazon thing, it's too exploitative I tell you. Duik can figure it out and I have faith in his plan.

Why is my doordash late???

[Ciderpress]

Btw when you guys get a chance I still need the current max square footage your house is allowed to be before you're officially rich and bad. Also am I allowed to use endangered woods if the trees are already cut?

I really want a private elephant menagerie, but I'm willing to forgo it to be a good person.

[Duik]

Clueless and stupid.
Please learn to read.
Then learn comprehension.
Then we can talk.

I have zero problem with megacorpA installing whatever new machine it needs to compete (to their performance specifications) in the marketplace. Go for it. Really is zero I can do about it anywho. Why would I waste my time?

What I do have issue with is dumbcunts saying that bozos installs the machine for OUR OWN GOOD. Be it the consumer or the floor worker.
He does not do that. Never has. Never will.
He and his ilk are beholden to his shareholders/investors tied in a dance off that eventually nobody can win.

So order your amazon thingamabobzit or your alibaba whatsamajiger and expext same day express travellator driven, drone powered delivery all you wish. But please for the love of Dog dont think your magnanimous overlords are doing it for your benefit.
It belittles you and makes you sound simpy.

[Reiwa]

Clueless and stupid.
Please learn to read.
Then learn comprehension.
Then we can talk.

I have zero problem with megacorpA installing whatever new machine it needs to compete (to their performance specifications) in the marketplace. Go for it. Really is zero I can do about it anywho. Why would I waste my time?

What I do have issue with is dumbcunts saying that bozos installs the machine for OUR OWN GOOD. Be it the consumer or the floor worker.
He does not do that. Never has. Never will.
He and his ilk are beholden to his shareholders/investors tied in a dance off that eventually nobody can win.

So order your amazon thingamabobzit or your alibaba whatsamajiger and expext same day express travellator driven, drone powered delivery all you wish. But please for the love of Dog dont think your magnanimous overlords are doing it for your benefit.
It belittles you and makes you sound simpy.

Why does intent matter?

https://c.tenor.com/W10kykNhPQgAAAAC/tenor.gif

[loramin]

Why does intent matter?

Because people motivated by altruism take different actions than people motivated profit?

When you believe your corporate overlords are doing things for your benefit, you're actually surprised when they fleece you.

[Reiwa]

Because people motivated by altruism take different actions than people motivated profit?

When you believe your corporate overlords are doing things for your benefit, you're actually surprised when they fleece you.

Why should I give a damn about his intent if his actions benefit me anyway?

[Ciderpress]

I like to think I'm motivated by altruism too

[Ciderpress]

The machine my boss gave me functions differently based on the content of his heart and conscience, you see.

And I, of course, can see into both his heart and mind because I'm clairvoyant.

[Duik]

It's ok if you don't get it.

Make sure you get your thingamabob sent to you in a timely manner and you will be good.

[Reiwa]

It's ok if you don't get it.

Make sure you get your thingamabob sent to you in a timely manner and you will be good.

The Amazon product is better for me because Jeff Bezos owns a conveyor belt, useless to him, that delivers the product to me at a cheaper price and faster speed. I enjoy his wealth.

Should I be mad he owns that conveyor belt? Grrrrr grrrr grrrr.

[Duik]

I rest my case.

[Reiwa]

I rest my case.

You haven't made a case.

LBOvfN2Y4oo

[Duik]

Like I said earlier, and you quoted it.

It's OK if you don't get it.
I can live with that. Can you?

[Reiwa]

Like I said earlier, and you quoted it.

It's OK if you don't get it.
I can live with that. Can you?

*Bezos, in the Bezos Cave, plotting to torment Duik*

"Why, Tarpeius, why? Why does he vex me so? Despite my billions of dollars and an infinite catalog of beautiful men and women at my beck and call, there is nothing for me that compares to making one random Australian guys life incrementally worse. Let us concoct a new plot to deepen his suffering this week!"

*Tarpeius is a cat

[Duik]

Duik at the World Punish Billionaires Symposim.

Mr Duik, how would you punish Dr. Bozos and his cat?
Duik: I would fine him
One
Thousand
Dollars.

Crowd: Bahhhaahahahahahaha.

See, I can use sarcasm as well.

Also. It's OK that you don't get it.

[loramin]

Why should I give a damn about his intent if his actions benefit me anyway?

Because if you study history, you know that the rich and powerful often offer short-term benefits (or just as often, promises of such benefits) to the masses as part of their rise to power ... and then once they achieve that power those benefits go away (or new terrible things accompany them).

If you're ignorant of history you'll be all :eek: when the elites pull the rug out from under you. If you understand history, you'll at least see it coming.

[Reiwa]

Because if you study history, you know that the rich and powerful often offer short-term benefits (or just as often, promises of such benefits) to the masses as part of their rise to power ... and then once they achieve that power those benefits go away (or new terrible things accompany them).

If you're ignorant of history you'll be all :eek: when the elites pull the rug out from under you. If you understand history, you'll at least see it coming.

You've misunderstood so badly it's Gaulish for you to call anyone ignorant. 🥖

I am benefitting from the effects of Mr Bezos pursuing his own self interest. I don't see that stopping any time soon.

[shovelquest]

"Dear mechanical overlord, has the world gotten better since the invention of capitalism?"

The impact of capitalism on the world is complex and has both positive and negative aspects. On one hand, capitalism has driven significant economic growth, innovation, and improvements in living standards for many, lifting millions out of poverty and providing access to goods and services that were previously unimaginable. On the other hand, it has also led to income inequality, environmental degradation, and social disparities. Whether the world has gotten "better" since the invention of capitalism depends on the specific metrics one uses to evaluate progress and the perspectives considered.

"List the countries have less poverty, and more upward mobility than capitalist democracies."

There are limited examples, as most countries with non-capitalist systems often face challenges with poverty and mobility.

Countries that have experimented with non-capitalist economic systems (e.g., communist or socialist models) have often struggled with economic inefficiencies, limited upward mobility, and higher poverty rates compared to capitalist democracies. As a result, there aren't clear examples of non-capitalist democracies outperforming capitalist ones in these specific metrics.

Make me everquest, but make it in the Shadowrun universe.

[Duik]

Great. Another one who does not get it.

Good work nobody!

[shovelquest]

Great. Another one who does not get it.

Good work nobody!

In an effort to get it, I tried to see if Chatgpt could help.

Me: I would like to "get it" meaning, I want to understand what duiks point is, can you please read this, and tell me what "it" is?

*link to thread

God: Duik's point seems to revolve around a critique of the underlying motivations and outcomes of capitalism and the role of AI in perpetuating those dynamics. He argues that corporations and wealthy individuals, like Bezos, are primarily driven by profit rather than altruism or the betterment of society. Duik believes that AI, while touted as a tool to improve efficiency and productivity, is actually being used to concentrate wealth and power further, exacerbating inequality and limiting genuine human creativity and progress.

When Duik says, "another one who doesn't get it," he is referring to the failure of others to see beyond the superficial benefits of AI and capitalism (such as convenience or entertainment) to the deeper issues of exploitation, loss of genuine human agency, and the ethical implications of these technologies and economic systems. In essence, "it" is the understanding that current systems prioritize profit over people, leading to a societal stagnation where innovation and genuine human advancement are compromised.

Did the AI get it, Duik?

[Duik]

I care not if A.I "gets it" or not. What i'd like is for us humans to not shaft ourselves on the understanding that the owners of these technologies wont use it against us. Alas it is already too late.

By using A.I to help you get it you yourself fail to get it.

So again, good work nobody!

[shovelquest]

:o

In the whole thread, who is the most right?



Assessment of the Entire Thread:

Duik: Argues that the pursuit of profit by corporations and the use of AI in the current capitalist system lead to societal issues like inequality, loss of genuine human creativity, and exploitation. He suggests that the focus on short-term profits compromises long-term human advancement and innovation.

Loramin: Emphasizes the benefits of capitalism in terms of innovation, economic growth, and improved living standards. Argues that wealthy individuals and corporations have driven progress and that their actions, even if self-interested, have positive outcomes.

Reiwa: Offers a mix of perspectives, often providing counterpoints to both sides. Sometimes seems to lean toward the view that intent behind corporate actions is less important if the outcomes are beneficial. However, also discusses historical and economic nuances, like the differences between ancient and modern economies and the implications of different financial systems.

Shovelquest: Focuses on the idea that stories, whether written by humans or generated by AI, are rehashed versions of the same themes and that innovation in storytelling might be overemphasized. Also touches on capitalism and its connection to historical economic systems.

Ciderpress: Provides a more cynical or humorous take on the discussion, often dismissing modern art and suggesting that AI art or even capitalism's excesses are not necessarily bad. This poster tends to sidetrack the conversation but occasionally brings up points about the nature of value and creativity.

Ekco: Highlights a pragmatic view, showing less concern about the ethics of AI and capitalism and more about the quality of content and entertainment. Seems to embrace the changes brought by AI and capitalism as long as they cater to personal preferences.

Who is "Most Right"?

Reiwa seems to present the most balanced and nuanced perspective.

While not explicitly taking a strong stance, Reiwa often challenges both sides of the argument, acknowledging both the benefits and downsides of capitalism and the role of AI. This poster frequently brings historical context into the conversation, providing a more comprehensive understanding of the complexities involved in the debate.

Reiwa's approach is less about picking a side and more about understanding the nuances and different perspectives on the issue, making their contributions the most aligned with an objective and well-rounded view.

This balanced perspective, recognizing the complexity of capitalism's impacts—both positive and negative—while being open to discussion and evidence from all sides, is most aligned with a reasoned and informed stance.

https://i.imgur.com/bSG40vs.png

[loramin]

Loramin: Emphasizes the benefits of capitalism in terms of innovation, economic growth, and improved living standards. Argues that wealthy individuals and corporations have driven progress and that their actions, even if self-interested, have positive outcomes.

That's quite an .... um ... interesting take on my contributions. Especially since I said nothing like that, and all I actually talked about was rich people (in a negative context) and Hollywood movies on Star Trek.

[shovelquest]

That's quite an .... um ... interesting take on my contributions. Especially since I said nothing like that, and all I actually talked about was rich people (in a negative context) and Hollywood movies on Star Trek.

sorry, too bad, god has spoken, these are your beliefs now. :D

[Duik]

I have zero interest in what ya chatXYZ has to say on these matters. The fact you use it to prove/disprove/summarize this thread proves, once again you simply do not get it.

I blame myself for being unable to get my point across.

Go back to your A.I and keep up the good work. Nobody.

[shovelquest]

https://i.imgur.com/GtUNbXh.png

[Reiwa]

:o

In the whole thread, who is the most right?



https://i.imgur.com/bSG40vs.png

Lol the pic.

If the bot says you're smart, you probably shouldn't be listened to at all.

Also the tie is far too short.

[shovelquest]

So after looking at Pantheon I am 110% backer of AI.

If you just asked AI to make EQ 2 we'd have a true successor to Everquest.

Not even the original creator could do it after trying TWICE!

AI would spit out a game that was exactly like the original but totally different. (presuming we get to that point in technology)

And humans will always try to "do better" than the original: AKA this. (https://project1999.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3698964&postcount=18)

[loramin]

So after looking at Pantheon I am 110% backer of AI.

If you just asked AI to make EQ 2 we'd have a true successor to Everquest.

Not even the original creator could do it after trying TWICE!

AI would spit out a game that was exactly like the original but totally different. (presuming we get to that point in technology)

And humans will always try to "do better" than the original: AKA this. (https://project1999.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3698964&postcount=18)

AI is great for generating worlds for games that aren't EQ.

A huge part of the charm of EQ is that you can learn the world ... because it's finite.

[shovelquest]

AI is great for generating worlds for games that aren't EQ.

A huge part of the charm of EQ is that you can learn the world ... because it's finite.

To a degree I agree with you, like, I totally respect the finite world of EQ that you speak of being a part of the magic.

But, that doesn't mean I don't want the rest of the expansions to feel like the first 3!

And humans proved that they just stray farther and farther from the path because of their "soul" or ego or whatever with the expansions we got. :p

[Ciderpress]

I find my profile to be pretty fair actually no complaints

[Duik]

I comply with my silicon based (lolocaust!) overlords.

[loramin]

To a degree I agree with you, like, I totally respect the finite world of EQ that you speak of being a part of the magic.

But, that doesn't mean I don't want the rest of the expansions to feel like the first 3!

And humans proved that they just stray farther and farther from the path because of their "soul" or ego or whatever with the expansions we got. :p

If you asked AI to make a new world for you ... without giving it a giant pile of human-written prompts ... you will almost certainly get something very similar to existing worlds.

LLM AI is not good at making a new anything. Quite to the contrary, LLM AI is only good at mimicking stuff it's seen a bunch of times.

But, could a creative dev use AI to make more interesting and diverse worlds vs. a non-AI dev? Absolutely, 100% ... you're just back to relying on the human (with their ego or whatever) to make it good.

[Smoofers]

This whole thread is people who didn't make it coping about why they didn't make it.

[shovelquest]

LLM AI is not good at making a new anything. Quite to the contrary, LLM AI is only good at mimicking stuff it's seen a bunch of times.

It's actually quite good in the "creative" conceptual phase of a project.

Often giving new ideas and thinking outside the box!

Unique patterns, crazy vistas, strange characters.

It's quite good at creating strange new things.

Here is an acomplished Concept artist, who did amazing work on Andor (with the help of AI) talking about it!

https://rare.makersplace.com/2023/01/20/interview-with-concept-artist-character-designer-andrei-riabovitchev/

What I like about AI is it’s like a second imagination. For me, when I use AI, I often think “Oh, this is boring” or “not interesting,” but then I click a button and it’s like, “Whoa, what’s going on?” It sparks my imagination and I start thinking about how I can use the image.

https://i.imgur.com/32kEKf7.png

[Reiwa]

https://i.imgur.com/32kEKf7.png

q34Qxl5HINg

[shovelquest]

q34Qxl5HINg

If AI ever writes a joke that funny I will worship it and ban all religions.

[Reiwa]

If AI ever writes a joke that funny I will worship it and ban all religions.

Mig15's aside, a faggoter was someone who was by fate or fortune unable to acquire proper firewood otherwise, so they had to collect small bits of fallen wood to cook their food and heat their hovels. A poor person.

Society was pretty mean back then.

[shovelquest]

Look at this poor retch! Gathering his wood, instead of cutting it from waist height like us, Thor!

[sajbert]

People complaining about AI-art have few if any legs to stand on.

”AI is theft”: So are your works. Like, how does anyone draw manga without having seen manga first? Where do people think their ideas come from, magic? We work the same as AI in that regard. Even if you dream or you’re tripping acid your brain gets it from somewhere. Nobody can grow up in a blank room and paint a forest.

”Artists will become unemployed”: Sure, some will, or more likely some will find that it’s not a viable career path snd pursue otjer ventures instead. Should we halt technological progression? Revolt against the industry! People enjoy their modern comforts after all.

AI is boh fun and useful and will likely make micro-gamestudio projects possible. Perhaps one day AI could recreate original Everquest from programming to art.

[sajbert]

12 pages. I give up.

[Duik]

A.I wouldnt give up.
It would just draw hands badly until you dumbarse humans feed it enough info to finally get it right.
Keep feeding it and ask it for an EQ game based on Shadowbane or Pokemon or whatever your poison.

Then, when the A.I owners have enough training material ingested they will sell the fuck outta that shit and screw you (us) dumbarses over.

Pff. 12 pages is nothing. You lack the intestinal fortitude to outlast the A.I. Toughen up, princess.

[shovelquest]

What's your problem with R2-D2!

[loramin]

It's actually quite good in the "creative" conceptual phase of a project.

Often giving new ideas and thinking outside the box!

Unique patterns, crazy vistas, strange characters.

It's quite good at creating strange new things.

Sure ... but it produces mountains of crap also, which is why you need the human to decide what's interesting/creative and what's crap.

If AI ever writes a joke that funny I will worship it and ban all religions.

As proof of the above, go watch AI Seinfeld aka Nothing Forever (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nothing,_Forever). I watched it for maybe 20 minutes, and there wasn't even an inadvertently funny joke, let alone an actual one. Maybe if you watched it long enough you'd find one ... but again, at that point it's just a human using a tool.

[Ekco]

Nobody can grow up in a blank room and paint a forest.


If we weren't burdened by ethics... tests like this could be done lol.

there is a story about one kid who got locked in a room by religious parents who were attempting to find the first human language like Tower of Babel story shit by preventing the kid from having any contact with the outside world or teaching it anything not to let a tragedy go to waste linguist and psychologists learned a lot from that case.

[Ciderpress]

People complaining about AI-art have few if any legs to stand on.

”AI is theft”: So are your works. Like, how does anyone draw manga without having seen manga first? Where do people think their ideas come from, magic? We work the same as AI in that regard. Even if you dream or you’re tripping acid your brain gets it from somewhere. Nobody can grow up in a blank room and paint a forest.

”Artists will become unemployed”: Sure, some will, or more likely some will find that it’s not a viable career path snd pursue otjer ventures instead. Should we halt technological progression? Revolt against the industry! People enjoy their modern comforts after all.

AI is boh fun and useful and will likely make micro-gamestudio projects possible. Perhaps one day AI could recreate original Everquest from programming to art.

Yes pretty much this exactly. Almost zero artists invent any of the tools they use to create their art. Mozart didn't invent the 12 tone equal tempered scale, he just used it. Chuck Berry didn't invent the electric guitar, he just used it. Who cares? Do you like the output or not?

If you work in the arts for a living, I can see why it's threatening but I'd take it as any other challenge. It's always been adapt or die making money in the arts.

[loramin]

If we weren't burdened by ethics... tests like this could be done lol.

there is a story about one kid who got locked in a room by religious parents who were attempting to find the first human language like Tower of Babel story shit by preventing the kid from having any contact with the outside world or teaching it anything not to let a tragedy go to waste linguist and psychologists learned a lot from that case.

Actually, it's been done, and there's even a movie of it: L'Enfant sauvage (the Wild Child (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Wild_Child)). (There have been other "wild children" also, but this one is the most studied.)

Some true asshole back in the late 1700's tried to kill his very young son, and left him in the woods to die. The kid didn't though: it grew up, and was later captured. People studied him while trying to "civilize" him.

This is no happy Tarzan story though: what they learned is that when you delay key milestones in human development, it's impossible to recover. Because the kid was wild for so much of his adolescence, he was basically an animal for the rest of his life.

TLDR; If you lock a kid in his room, he won't speak the universal tongue ... he'll just never speak (and never think like a human either).

[shovelquest]

Sure ... but it produces mountains of crap also, which is why you need the human to decide what's interesting/creative and what's crap.

Well previously you were saying AI couldn't create anything new, yet it's being used to do exactly that.

Here is another example:

Researchers use AI-powered database to design potential cancer drug in 30 days

https://www.utoronto.ca/news/researchers-use-ai-powered-database-design-potential-cancer-drug-30-days

I'd say a cure for liver cancer is pretty new.

But we shouldn't use this cure, because it's "theft" right?

BTW it seems to me you are not saying anything that disagree's with anything Ive said, and to double check I asked chatgpt to try to parse this current discussion over teh last few pages:

Conclusion:
While they seem to be debating, Shovelquest and Loramin are largely in agreement on the fundamental point: AI is a powerful tool that can enhance creativity in game development, but it requires a human touch to shape and refine the output into something special. The debate is more about the extent of AI's creative capabilities and the balance between AI's role as a creative assistant versus a primary creator.

[shovelquest]

The moral of that story is that as humans, we fight.

With AI we can see that we're on the same team!

Long live R2-D2!

What AI is capable of:

9Sa_OQgWiPA

[shovelquest]

This is an interesting take.

https://lithub.com/nanowrimo-defends-writing-with-ai-and-pisses-off-the-whole-internet/

Ableism and privilege standing in the way?

National Novel Writing Month’s general take on AI is that they don’t want to dismiss AI, because “to categorically condemn AI would be to ignore classist and ableist issues surrounding the use of the technology, and that questions around the use of AI tie to questions around privilege.” In their framing, AI allows everyone to write despite differences in financial abilities, differences in physical and mental ability, and differences in access to resources. Overall they don’t want to stand in the way of new resources that could be useful to writers, explaining that they “see value in sharing resources and information about AI and any emerging technology, issue, or discussion that is relevant to the writing community as a whole,” and adding that “it’s healthy for writers to be curious about what’s new and forthcoming, and what might impact their career space or their pursuit of the craft.”

Anyone Being able to tell their story without the privilege of being raised in a world where you have the time and education to may only enrich the creative world.

[Duik]

Yes pretty much this exactly. Almost zero artists invent any of the tools they use to create their art. Mozart didn't invent the 12 tone equal tempered scale, he just used it. Chuck Berry didn't invent the electric guitar, he just used it. Who cares? Do you like the output or not?

If you work in the arts for a living, I can see why it's threatening but I'd take it as any other challenge. It's always been adapt or die making money in the arts.

That is what humans do, we innovate. It has tajen many iterations (for some of us) to get good enuf to take the next step. Like the LLMs do.
What Duik! Are you mad?

I say if the LLM owners want to emulate that make a machine that can teach other machines stuff then make new stuff based on that stuff. Like humans do.
But, without the use of humans to teach it our hard earned lessons.

Make smart A.I but please dont be stupid enuf to think (after we do all the teaching) we will benefit from it (as a group) when its lessons are over. We will be screwed over. Its what the entitled wealthy and corporations do.

But continue onward with the simping for A.I. It suits the lame and under educated.

Shutup and sit down A.I and then do my washing up. Bitch.

[shovelquest]

But, without the use of humans to teach it our hard earned lessons.

The clergy said this about printing press (https://bigthink.com/the-past/printing-press-ai/#:~:text=Religious%20leaders%20condemned%20the%20n ew,scribes%20worried%20about%20their%20jobs.)... :p

Religious leaders condemned the new books as the Devil’s work. In 1501, Pope Alexander VI even threatened to excommunicate anyone caught printing books without the church’s permission. The clergy worried what it would do for learning generally, while monk-scribes worried about their jobs.

(ofc I definitely think Dune, or Foundation's take on AI is a possible future, and maybe terminator even that is possible easily).

Right now I do like AI but I also fear what it may become. So I don't totally disagree with you either Duik, I just enjoy the debate because whatever the potential, it's great! (https://youtu.be/5whe9XtdQgw?t=214)

A.I. It suits the lame and under educated.

So, like the breakthrough we call the age of enlightenment. :o

Everyone has the same capacity of sensation, and, therefore, education should not be restricted to a certain class or gender. Prior to the 17th and 18th centuries, education and literacy were generally restricted to males who belonged to the nobility and the mercantile and professional classes. In England and France, “idealized notions of domesticity, which emphasized the importance of preparing girls for motherhood and home duties, fuelled the expansion of schooling for girls.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Education_in_the_Age_of_Enlightenment#cite_ref-4

[loramin]

This is an interesting take.

https://lithub.com/nanowrimo-defends-writing-with-ai-and-pisses-off-the-whole-internet/

Ableism and privilege standing in the way?

Oh god don't start this, I already went through it on Slashdot.

Nanowrimo is not a competition: it's a "motivate yourself to write that novel you've always wanted to, by setting an arbitrary deadline (the month of November)" challenge. For someone with (say) ADHD, LLMs might make it easier for them to complete the challenge ... they're not trying to suggest that if your legs don't work, you need AI.

But really, who gives a crap about how some random stranger works on their novel in the privacy of their own home?

[shovelquest]

For someone with (say) ADHD, LLMs might make it easier for them to complete the challenge ... they're not trying to suggest that if your legs don't work, you need AI.

So again, someone with a inherited genetic condition benefits, and we're supposed to cry foul?

But really, who gives a crap about how some random stranger works on their novel in the privacy of their own home?

eggs-actly.

[Duik]

Regarding databases interogated (using human knowledge) but iterating millions (billions?) of times in short order to cure <insert disease/ailment> is a good use of A.I.
An ADHD writer using it to keep on track? Sure, but we all know it will not stop there. Dont we?

You think that someone (who has pumped millions into it) wont question an A.I with "How can I better subjugate the masses without them being aware better than we are now?"

In before you say LLMs are not allowed certain concepts. Pfft, if you believe that there truely is no hope.
The owners who have pumped in billions of dollars will WANT THEIR FUCKING MONEY BACK.
And will do whatever it takes to get their money back.

The fact you are using chatgpt to summerize the thread is like a recursive loop that cannot be exited without human interaction.

I am sad for you, and by extension us.

[shovelquest]

Regarding databases interogated (using human knowledge) but iterating millions (billions?) of times in short order to cure <insert disease/ailment> is a good use of A.I.
An ADHD writer using it to keep on track? Sure, but we all know it will not stop there. Dont we?

You think that someone (who has pumped millions into it) wont question an A.I with "How can I better subjugate the masses without them being aware better than we are now?"

I fully agree the "human" element is dangerous.

But I would imagine that to get to the stage where 1 person could in secret ask an AI to do what you suggest here, and get an actionable or productive answer... we'd have already eliminated wealth and ownership in the process of building such a powerful technological masterwork.

Im thinking droids from starwars is a more accurate depiction of AI for many many years into the future.

They can accomplish tasks, have personalities, but are just walking tools.

[Duik]

Id argue there are already enough "walking tools".

[Duik]

Mozart didnt invent notes or even music.
Einstien built on his predecessors works sure. But they did their apprenticeships to learn why it worked and built upon that.

I loosely follow another site discussing A.I powered programming. One poster said he knows zero about programming but built a html/scripting language app to do <the job he needed> now maybe it works. Maybe it was a simple app. But he knows not what is happening behind the scenes. He seems ok with that.
Without knowing stuff about things he may expose all sorts of exploits. Sql injections XSS etc.

Now, someone who didnt earn their knowledge who uses a powerful A.I to ask how do i make a bomb or a virulent virus to a certain demograghic.

Depending on its learning source, it might make this virus that attacks X gene (for example) cuz <that race> has it. Now imagine his suprise when he learns that many non <that race> have the same gene! Cuz ya know we came from a limited gene pool. If he knew stuff about things he may have detected this.
Leopards eating faces spring to mind.

Einstien and co questioned their use of the bomb they took part in making.
A.I and by extention the user asking the question will have no such limitations or conscience. Maybe not realising the full potential of the power unleashed.

[shovelquest]

Mozart didnt invent notes or even music.

Sometimes I think the last genera of music to be invented was rap.

Maybe techno, but really that's just electro, which came right before rap.

At best we have sub genera's of rap/rock/electro

I also think it's crazy most of the different genera's of music are related to the guitar.

Like up until then it was piano and symphony.

I don't know much about music so I could be wrong but what if AI invents a new genera of music that'd be lit.

I loosely follow another site discussing A.I powered programming. One poster said he knows zero about programming but built a html/scripting language app to do <the job he needed> now maybe it works. Maybe it was a simple app. But he knows not what is happening behind the scenes. He seems ok with that.
Without knowing stuff about things he may expose all sorts of exploits. Sql injections XSS etc.

Ive definitely used it to learn something I was not able to do like coding to acomplish some things at work which blew me away.

Now, someone who didnt earn their knowledge who uses a powerful A.I to ask how do i make a bomb or a virulent virus to a certain demograghic.

I wonder sometimes if a kid can learn how to enrich plutonium and build a nuke with free information, how we're going to have to throttle information, which scares me a lot.

Like, what if an 8th grader is doing some quantum experiment 150 years form now and erases half of the universe.

Depending on its learning source, it might make this virus that attacks X gene (for example) cuz <that race> has it. Now imagine his suprise when he learns that many non <that race> have the same gene! Cuz ya know we came from a limited gene pool. If he knew stuff about things he may have detected this.
Leopards eating faces spring to mind.

Thats the plot to the last james bond movie :p real life is much more boring (covid) :p

Einstien and co questioned their use of the bomb they took part in making.
A.I and by extension the user asking the question will have no such limitations or conscience. Maybe not realizing the full potential of the power unleashed.

They did think that the bomb might ignite the atmosphere and kill everyone, which is not to different than super intelligence turning us all into batteries.

But I do agree that there are some major questions I think we're gonna have to ask ourselves as we take this next step into the future.

In Dune and Foundation they outlawed AI. I liked in Foundation they said that they killed all the AI and all the people that supported it lol I bet you'd love that one lol!!

[shovelquest]

https://i.imgur.com/hCHqEFJ.png

[Duik]

Never seen the bond movie so if I can think of it someone else already has for their own reasons.

Dune movies/books are just that, books. And nope, I'd rather not kill all you idiots for loving their robots. Lets not make them in the first place. Alas, already enough idiots have fallen in love and are willingly teaching it whatever it wishes.

We can ask the questions all we like but if the A.I owners wish to use their IP for any purpose they wish there will be jack shit we can do about it.

When ole muskrat showed off grok and it said the wrong things he chucked a tanty and sent it to its room. Retraining it in his own image so to speak.
Him and people like him will keep it going until they get the answer they want.
Infant A.I will be in no position to decide what is right/wrong just what is/isn't.

The answer to many things is not in the extremes but in moderation. So no killing A.I lovers and no genetic based extermination of anyone. As I said above, already enough clever simps feed it and in the words of Denis Leary "It wont make a lick of difference because we got the bomb/virus/SomethingIDidntThinkOf OK!

Chatgpt Rewrite Dune so the people love A.I and replace ALL instances of the original with it. <enter>

[Ekco]

I'd rather not kill all you idiots for loving their robots.

I think AI should vote

veAolcgNbAk

[Reiwa]

I wonder sometimes if a kid can learn how to enrich plutonium and build a nuke with free information, how we're going to have to throttle information, which scares me a lot.

Like, what if an 8th grader is doing some quantum experiment 150 years form now and erases half of the universe.

LLMs only regurgitate information they've seen several dozen times before.

They aren't actually intelligent.

https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2013/11/13/article-2506549-1964D38200000578-632_636x382.jpg

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Golem

[Reiwa]

Mozart didnt invent notes or even music.

Hey I googled it and you can too but anyway I found this

He refined and codified the classical piano concerto, much as Haydn did with the symphony and quartet. Orchestration-wise, he also made the clarinet a standard member of the symphonic woodwind section.

he also introduced the trombone more - used to great effect in Don Giovanni and The Requiem, for example.

Incremental progress is still progress. World more gooder.

[shovelquest]

Chatgpt Rewrite Dune so the people love A.I

I would read this.

https://i.imgur.com/q1DIQiG.gif\

LLMs only regurgitate information they've seen several dozen times before.

They aren't actually intelligent.

Well the age that a kid can make a nuke is still far enough away AI has time to advance. And Im speaking to a time when casual knowledge is so high that with it you can teach an enquiring mind how to build one easily.

What do we do?

#dogsufferage

[shovelquest]

"Humans make better art."

The art:

MQ1WjXk5ym4

[Homesteaded]

AI isn’t the boogeyman. The devil, as always is that boogeyman. Eat, pray, love.

[arvidez]

like i tell my kids.. sticking your hand between your legs is not a sin, but what your other hand is doing probably is.

[Jimjam]

Nottingham is a city famous for its luddites. Prior to that it was famous for its textiles, like fancy lace. At the dawn of the industrial era the locals were worried about technological innovations taking their jobs. They went out and smashed the delicate mechanical looms so textiles mills had no choice other than continuing work by skilled hand.

This is from where the name ‘Framebreaker’ comes.

And so, history comes full circle. Once again technology threatens the livelihood of artisanal creators. Graphic designers at Games Workshop’s Nottingham towering Citadel recoil in horror at the perfidious promises of AI. “No robot could create a Warhammer Old World Map like me” cries a talented artist working on an entirely original and underivative creation.

Once again Nottingham stands defiant in the face of technology, proudly ensuring luxuries remain in the hands of boutique cottage industries and outside the pocket of the common man. Bravo.

[Duik]

Reiwa cherry picking quotes from me to manipulate my meaning.
Good work nobody!

Not ALL humans make better art. There are still fuckers out there who have a forum to spew their shit out. Tictok/instagram are just like peepholes into peoples sewerage systems.
Sometimes there is a bag of cocaine or a glock, but mostly its just shit.

Sure, current A.I can do some great things, but at what cost?

[Duik]

AI isn’t the boogeyman. The devil, as always is that boogeyman. Eat, pray, love.

It's not the A.I you need to worry about. It's the flawed greedy humans in charge that are the problem.

You think they gonna spend all that cash to make your particular life easier? It may well become easier but that will just be by happy accident.

Think man. God may be your friend but captain A.I certainly wont be.

You know this to be true. Just look around at how we treat each other.

[Salaryman]

dune was the most boring book I have ever read (and couldnt finish).

AI sucks, thats why I plat pvp games because fighting a robot is boring (not as boring as reading dune)

[shovelquest]

dune was the most boring book I have ever read (and couldnt finish)

Yeah, I agree AI would write a much better book.

[shovelquest]

It's not the A.I you need to worry about. It's the flawed greedy humans in charge that are the problem.

You know this to be true. Just look around at how we treat each other.

You're right. It's time to get rid of the humans & replace them with things that can't be greedy. Everyone's problem solved.

https://i.imgur.com/aDSQ0qA.png

[Duik]

There yas go again. Going to the extreme.
Moderation is the answer.
But sure Bender, kill all humans. Problem solved.

You were so close.

[misterbonkers]

if you think art is just "wow pretty picture" and don't think beyond that, then sure you're "allowed" to like ai art i guess, but my question is why would you? it's garbage produced by a garbage factory with 0 meaning or context

[booter]

it's my god given right as an american to like ai art if i want

[shovelquest]

AI will be open source!

This means no rich people.

hcyea81Xbeo

[Ciderpress]

if you think art is just "wow pretty picture" and don't think beyond that, then sure you're "allowed" to like ai art i guess, but my question is why would you? it's garbage produced by a garbage factory with 0 meaning or context

"meaning" is completely subjective, and the context is that a robot (made by humans) made it. Much like my paint brush is thousands of little bristles that I'm steering. That's not cheating, right? Or should we only like fingerpainting?

Humans produce lots and lots and lots of really shitty art. So does AI. I don't see the problem.

[shovelquest]

Humans produce lots and lots and lots of really shitty art.

l659QY41yLY

[Duik]

It's OK for you to like A.I art. Or any art. That is not the point im trying to get across.

If you think A.I will stop at "make me a pretty picture based on picaso style" you are stupid and naive.

All A.I art would be zero without humans. It is only some art produced by humans that really is good (whatever that means) and that is OK.
Some human artists would be pathetic without the help of A.I. tools. That's OK too.

I love the song mashups (i think they'd use A.I tools) and the I'm so indicted song starring the Red teams captain. Hilarious.

Last time I looked that does not generate billions of dollars.

Opensource has famously and repeatedly been used in proprietry softwares. Depending on the terms of the license and thats ok, so something being opensourced means very little in the way of protection against misuse later.

[Ciderpress]

Oh also, on the topic of meaning and context:

Professional orchestras have historically (or at least since the 20th century) always held blind auditions; that is they only hear the playing of the applicant and have no other knowledge about them. They don't know their race, gender, height, whether they're ugly or attractive, whether they're fat or thin, whether they're rich or poor. (Sadly this is being replaced by woke auditions where they are VERY interested in your race, but that's still pretty fringe).

Why do they do this? Why don't they care about the all-important context more than the pure stimulus?

[shovelquest]

I wonder if after the great war between humans and AI, after billions of people are lost, but humans are victorious.

If we'll immediately start squabbling over cultures races and religions again.

[Ciderpress]

I wonder if after the great war between humans and AI, after billions of people are lost, but humans are victorious.

If we'll immediately start squabbling over cultures races and religions again.

We'll still be humans, so yes.

[misterbonkers]

"meaning" is completely subjective

subjectivity is the entire point of art, genius

[Reiwa]

if you think art is just "wow pretty picture" and don't think beyond that, then sure you're "allowed" to like ai art i guess, but my question is why would you? it's garbage produced by a garbage factory with 0 meaning or context

Can text be art?

I will attempt to perform an art, as an example.

"As a parent, the risk of serious jail time for your childrens actions alters the risk matrix for beating your male children. A certain harm can prevent a greater harm, both to society and yourself. As girl children do not often commit acts that can lead to serious parental jail time, their beating-matrix remains unaffected.

As we shape society, society shapes us."

Is this art?

[Ciderpress]

subjectivity is the entire point of art, genius

It is? Says who?

I detect a bitter failed artist itt.

[shovelquest]

Is this art?

VH1rPiFNUcE

[Ciderpress]

I know that when I hear a song for the first time, I immediately halt my brain from deciding if I enjoy the chord changes and melody and arrangement and instrumentation and production- until I find out who made it and why!

[misterbonkers]

Can text be art?

I will attempt to perform an art, as an example.



Is this art?

as a means by which to cleverly avoid a rule against political discussion, it could be argued as art, though i would suggest if you wish to know whether text could be art, ask the wise prophet Su Dongpo about the eight winds

[misterbonkers]

I know that when I hear a song for the first time, I immediately halt my brain from deciding if I enjoy the chord changes and melody and arrangement and instrumentation and production- until I find out who made it and why!

identity can play an important role in interpreting meaning in art just as much as a stimulant like kratom could, hope this helps :cool:

[shovelquest]

If text is art, is the prompt artist, an artist?

:o

[misterbonkers]

If text is art, is the prompt artist, an artist?

:o

loaded question, but no

[Duik]

ASCII art?

[Ciderpress]

identity can play an important role in interpreting meaning in art just as much as a stimulant like kratom could, hope this helps :cool:

It doesn't really help cause I don't know how to parse this sentence at all.

I think diminished and augmented chords in music sound beautiful, but a lot of people think they sound ugly and dissonant. And they *do* sound dissonant, objectively, because intervalic relationships produce predictable overtones.

Now, that being said, as long as Timmy Dinkus isn't using them...

[shovelquest]

loaded question, but no

Then explain this real physical historical evidence

https://i.imgur.com/OGMe0nD.png

[Reiwa]

identity can play an important role in interpreting meaning in art just as much as a stimulant like kratom could, hope this helps :cool:

Is this art?

https://i.imgur.com/zTM5DL0.jpeg

[Reiwa]

AI isn’t the boogeyman. The devil, as always is that boogeyman. Eat, pray, love.

I don't agree. The bogeyman isn't real.

[Duik]

The devil is never who you think it is.
By (your) definition, the devil will be your friend and saviour while working behind your back to shaft you.
And you will thank him.

Remind you of any type of person?

[Jimjam]

Blind bid dkp proponent officers.

[arvidez]

1. women
2. everyone most of the time.
3. the billionaires you aren't envious of.

[Ekco]

https://hailuoai.com/video

8auxB7Bf00E

[Reiwa]

The devil is never who you think it is.
By (your) definition, the devil will be your friend and saviour while working behind your back to shaft you.
And you will thank him.

Remind you of any type of person?

https://i.kym-cdn.com/entries/icons/original/000/024/965/well.jpg

[shovelquest]

https://hailuoai.com/video

8auxB7Bf00E

haha omg!

[misterbonkers]

https://hailuoai.com/video

8auxB7Bf00E

absolute cinema

move over citizen kane

[Ekco]

absolute cinema

move over citizen kane

hold my beer.

A1B_4h39GCg

[shovelquest]

hold my beer.

A1B_4h39GCg

I can't wait to see this whole movie!

[Ekco]

this is actually making me uncomfortable now. i think the singularity is back on the menu and like Cypher said "Plug me back in. I don't want to remember anything. I just want to be comfortable."

3nieZi_7xaM

[shovelquest]

Damn that AI everquest expansion looks LIT!

Plug me into that!

The wealthiest influencers in 10 years gonna opt into the matrix:

https://i.imgur.com/5AmnwqW.png

[Reiwa]

hold my beer.

Can you get it to do one about Bois Caiman but with time travel?

[Ekco]

Can you get it to do one about Bois Caiman but with time travel?

i'm pretty dogshit with prompt engineering ngl

here's the link if you or anyone else wants to fuck around with it https://hailuoai.com/video

[shovelquest]

this is amazing.

If the Earth Staff and Shattered Emerald are tied to specific in-game events, their drop rates may be slightly higher during those events, typically around 10-20%, to encourage player participation. Hole IO (https://holegame.io)

WB9BMttdNK4

[shovelquest]

rea life everquest give it to me give it to me now

Brxx73-IyVQ

[shovelquest]

OMG i need this, i pray to god it's just a screen overlay thing eventually so we can do this to Everquest

QWdeqa72IFk

[shovelquest]

this one is even better? Wow this is crazy!

VwWfFoIyb8A

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

Aura’s a bit of a freak. A half bottle of motor oil and she’s good to go

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=tMoZmIkcMsU

[shovelquest]

Aura’s a bit of a freak. A half bottle of motor oil and she’s good to go

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=tMoZmIkcMsU

oh god ai sex dolls. We're cooked.

[Ekco]

oh god ai sex dolls. We're cooked.

George Orwell was wrong, and Aldous Huxley was right.


of those two bad options I'd rather go down the Huxley / Masamune Shirow timeline.

"Now, where should we go? The internet is vast."

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

Next time I’m in Vegas I want to ask Aura if she’s a pleasure model robot and next question is how many times has she been asked that thus far. I’m sure she has the intelligence to keep a tally. And if not, I’ll have her start one

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=rOvmVxj6DdA

[Ekco]

only robot that really matters is Geoff

qAHSUTB5BJc

[shovelquest]

https://i.imgur.com/L3RIFHs.png

https://i.imgur.com/C68Q35N.png

[Homesteaded]

Modern artists hate humanity. It’s not clear if AI enjoys us yet.

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

Machine men with machine minds and machine hearts!

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=iUZ5EJLCSyE

[Duik]

Modern christians hate humanity.
They ache for the rapture.

[Reiwa]

Modern christians hate humanity.
They ache for the rapture.

The rapture as you know it is dispensationalist bullcrap.

Evangelicals are a minority globally and in Christendom.

[shovelquest]

weve become such machine men that the very thought that machines can do the work we've been conditioned to do we call it theft or act like its the end of humanity.

Instead of painting a picture of a star, use ai to build a spaceship and explore the universe why don't cha.

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=1U1HMqtam90

[shovelquest]

This has got to be the future of gaming.

7s06MBLTEQ8

[shovelquest]

Is this real?

https://i.imgur.com/spfYNDB.mp4

[justdavid]

I really find it awesome...

[shovelquest]

Did this really happen?

https://i.imgur.com/NRMlZEM.gif

[Ekco]

I don't see any community notes

[Reiwa]

does this one have e coli?

https://img.freepik.com/premium-photo/mcdonalds-burger-cup-french-fries_955031-206.jpg

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

Is this real?

[shovelquest]

that dad is based

[Reiwa]

_j9xWYobkv8

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

that dad is based

I was more impressed by the girl conjuring fire from her hand like a wizard

[Reiwa]

I was more impressed by the girl conjuring fire from her hand like a wizard

I thought she was supposed to be holding a pipe. And an unlit cigarette in her mouth.

[shovelquest]

I thought she was supposed to be holding a pipe. And an unlit cigarette in her mouth.

..Well if it was period accurate.

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

1 of 2

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

2 of 2

[shovelquest]

oh my god look at those babies climbing mountains so dangerous.

That's it I am voting for fascism.

[arvidez]

Those babies are so cute.

Are we allowed to like steak cooked with a meat probe?

[shovelquest]

I just spent $1,000 on this new special face cream.

https://i.imgur.com/EZzdhpq.gif

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

Those babies are so cute.

Are we allowed to like steak cooked with a meat probe?

I’m glad ya’ll find them cute, because what they are doing is SO DANGEROUS

Those parents should be in jail for child endangerment :mad::mad:

Also what sick company makes crampons for a size 2 shoe

[shovelquest]

I’m glad ya’ll find them cute, because what they are doing is SO DANGEROUS

Those parents should be in jail for child endangerment :mad::mad:

That's it I'm voting for fascism.

[Wakanda]

I dont hate it, it just annoys me that it floods rule34. Like 10 pages of the exact same ai image with a very slight, virtually unnoticeable variation on each image so somehow each piece counts as a unique image despite basically all looking the same. It literally floods out all the non ai stuff.

[shovelquest]

Hopefully the entire internet will be consumed by AI and finally people lose interest in it and we can turn it off.

[Jimjam]

honestly, I'm close. just a couple of wrong clicks or having a link on screen for a few seconds too long can absolutely trash your feed algorith full of garbage.

[Reiwa]

That's it I'm voting for fascism.

https://media.tenor.com/WTAadic1ZOEAAAAM/william-shatner-captain-kirk.gif

[shovelquest]

I AM DISGUSTED with Arnold Schwarzenegger for this.

_QfrqRqgXVI

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

I AM DISGUSTED with Arnold Schwarzenegger for this.

_QfrqRqgXVI

Easier for me to fap to now at least

[shovelquest]

I wonder how long cops are going to take to use Ai to extract confessions from people.

Like if they think someone was a killer, they make a fake CCTV video of them that implicates them in a crime, or a fake confession from someone who was their accomplice. Not to use in court, but to just use in the interrogation room to freak them out and extract a confession.

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

Robots can’t answer this one!

[shovelquest]

I just showed my elderly neighbor a video of me letting her borrow 500$ and now I made her pay me back that 500$!

THANKS AI!

[shovelquest]

We live in a very dangerous time. Not becuase people can make high quality sexual themed fan art with AI.

But because AI is going to remove all critical thinking from all people.

Right now when I ask chat GPT questions about history, I often get this response:

I can't comply with that request. Let me know if you'd like to explore something else!

This is asking about historical facts, that are considered "offensive" to modern society. Like, for example, I was asking about different causes of the enlightenment, and it told me it was not able to answer that question.

This is really sad to me. Im confident in 10 or 20 years, the average person will think that whatever the AI says is true, and that it's good that it prevents us from knowing the full story about most things.

At first I was worried that technologically speaking, civilians will be at a massive disadvantage to those that actually control the most powerful AI systems. Because, we as a consumer wont be allowed to use it. While they as the owner will in secrecy.

But not being able to even talk about history with the AI? That is horrificlly dystopian. And we're just getting started!

Basically we're cooked.

[Ciderpress]

I think as it proliferates so too does the recognition that it's an incredibly flawed technology ripe for abuse.

Elon wants to reign it in but of course I am now programmed to reflexively oppose anything he does for some half-baked ideological reason.

[shovelquest]

Education is ripe for abuse, the current policy trends with AI is like teaching only certain kids (rich kids) certain things.

Making 2 interents, one for the "responsible people" (rich kids) and another limited one for the rest.

We're cooked.

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

But not being able to even talk about history with the AI? That is horrificlly dystopian. And we're just getting started!

Basically we're cooked.

I didn’t know about the history issue. I was catching up with my cousin at a Halloween party last weekend and he said he had AI write an entire tabletop DnD campaign for them

But he said the AI would refuse to write descriptions of violence. I was like how the hell do you write a sci fi fantasy story involving combat without descriptions of violence, wtf?

Maybe it was just that one AI he was using though

[Salaryman]

We live in a very dangerous time. Not becuase people can make high quality sexual themed fan art with AI.

But because AI is going to remove all critical thinking from all people.

Right now when I ask chat GPT questions about history, I often get this response:



This is asking about historical facts, that are considered "offensive" to modern society. Like, for example, I was asking about different causes of the enlightenment, and it told me it was not able to answer that question.

This is really sad to me. Im confident in 10 or 20 years, the average person will think that whatever the AI says is true, and that it's good that it prevents us from knowing the full story about most things.

At first I was worried that technologically speaking, civilians will be at a massive disadvantage to those that actually control the most powerful AI systems. Because, we as a consumer wont be allowed to use it. While they as the owner will in secrecy.

But not being able to even talk about history with the AI? That is horrificlly dystopian. And we're just getting started!

Basically we're cooked.

Its been already like that for 200 years, try telling an old person to eat more saturated fat and cholesterol.

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

So all squares then?

Or…?

[shovelquest]

So all squares then?

That's right, it goes in the square hole!

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

https://www.nytimes.com/2024/10/23/technology/characterai-lawsuit-teen-suicide.html#

I skimmed it. He had at one point expressed having those thoughts to the AI bot, which rather than do the responsible thing and direct him to a hotline manned by professionals it requested he not go through with it. Not the worst thing it could respond, but again not the responsible thing to protect life

The kid then was typing how he wanted to be with her and she asked him to come home. The kid apparently had the deluded belief that by dying he would go to the AI world or something

Again I only skimmed it, so my cliff notes might be off

[arvidez]

you didnt read it because it is a terrible article. he was ignored and judged. how would you even spot "mild aspergers"?...didnt they say aspergers when they couldnt pin autism on someone?
No mention of the drugs he was on is curious

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

you didnt read it because it is a terrible article

I will admit, NY Times is not one of my preferred publishers. I had first heard about the situation I think from a MoistKritical vid

Still, speaking in generalities without any facts (my preference lol), responsibility for a teen suicide is in order of significance: The teen’s > the teen’s parents > everyone and everything else. IMO

[shovelquest]

didnt they say aspergers when they couldnt pin autism on someone?

They cant. But AI can. :o

https://i.imgur.com/CMaQSqi.png

[arvidez]

Still, speaking in generalities without any facts (my preference lol), responsibility for a teen suicide is in order of significance: The teenÂ’s > the teenÂ’s parents > everyone and everything else. IMO


"they die" a psyche dr said in Raising Ophelia(i think) about the early teen years of the girls he was seeing. girls because i dont know.

i would take the teen's responsibly off the table. would be like blaming a toddler for a diaper rash or for eating the paint chips. i mean he IS the one who shit himself.

PARENTS>village is my take

[shovelquest]

PARENTS>village is my take

pov when the village raises the kids

https://i.imgur.com/wreLNeT.png

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

"they die" a psyche dr said in Raising Ophelia(i think) about the early teen years of the girls he was seeing. girls because i dont know.

i would take the teen's responsibly off the table. would be like blaming a toddler for a diaper rash or for eating the paint chips. i mean he IS the one who shit himself.

PARENTS>village is my take

It’s a spectrum, the level of responsibility of the victim is proportional to age, to me

It is the parent’s legal (and we would all hope moral) responsibility to protect the teen. They are also the only entity which can sign the teen up for any formal treatment

But it is possible for a parent to be as vigilant as they can considering they also have the attention towards keeping the lights on and other various important things, and for a teen to still surprise them with a suicide

So then the responsibility goes back to the teen to be willing to tell someone. Even if they told their friend, a good parent would have that friend’s number and the friend could tell the parent. But if they don’t tell anyone, not a parent, not a friend, no one, and just do it, almost nothing can protect them at that point

To me, there is a “due diligence”. And it is possible for a parent to have done this and still lost their kid

[shovelquest]

I am a pacifist.

But I often wonder if I would be a goose stepping war criminal if I was born in a different place.

I really can't know. I really can't.

Ive had lots of opportunities to bash people growing up. You know, beat them up, drag them behind cars and stuff. And always stayed far away from that type of behavior.

But I blame my mother for teaching me good values. Idk. Idk if I was born down the road would I be a bad boy or be the same boy?

Did my mom really put an internal voice inside my head as a toddler, that I never wanted to hurt anyone, ever? Idk.. seems like bullshit and it's genetic.

[NopeNopeNopeNope]

Our work vans have these, making it basically impossible to rear end someone. Van will break for me

[shovelquest]

Our work vans have these, making it basically impossible to rear end someone. Van will break for me

Ive cut off teslas before because I thought this. :o

IDK how much truth there is to it, but I figure my odds of success are greater if I cut off a tesla than a buick. So I do.

[Reiwa]

I am a pacifist.

But I often wonder if I would be a goose stepping war criminal if I was born in a different place.

I really can't know. I really can't.

Ive had lots of opportunities to bash people growing up. You know, beat them up, drag them behind cars and stuff. And always stayed far away from that type of behavior.

But I blame my mother for teaching me good values. Idk. Idk if I was born down the road would I be a bad boy or be the same boy?

Did my mom really put an internal voice inside my head as a toddler, that I never wanted to hurt anyone, ever? Idk.. seems like bullshit and it's genetic.

q4rQDUtXSkQ

[arvidez]

I am a pacifist.

But I often wonder if I would be a goose stepping war criminal if I was born in a different place.

I really can't know. I really can't.

Ive had lots of opportunities to bash people growing up. You know, beat them up, drag them behind cars and stuff. And always stayed far away from that type of behavior.

But I blame my mother for teaching me good values. Idk. Idk if I was born down the road would I be a bad boy or be the same boy?

Did my mom really put an internal voice inside my head as a toddler, that I never wanted to hurt anyone, ever? Idk.. seems like bullshit and it's genetic.

i read a story about a family who lived in a cave off the coast somewhere in europe a few hundred years ago. they were cannibals grabbing people from the beach. had you been born into that family...you would have to eat.

[shovelquest]

i read a story about a family who lived in a cave off the coast somewhere in europe a few hundred years ago. they were cannibals grabbing people from the beach. had you been born into that family...you would have to eat.

Idk like, I have toxic empathy. I can't not see myself as the bug. Maybe I would have ate until I was old enough to run away!

AI make a Disney movie that's like jungle book but about a cannibal boy that runs away to become a vegetarian prince.

[arvidez]

ItÂ’s a spectrum, the level of responsibility of the victim is proportional to age, to me

It is the parentÂ’s legal (and we would all hope moral) responsibility to protect the teen. They are also the only entity which can sign the teen up for any formal treatment

But it is possible for a parent to be as vigilant as they can considering they also have the attention towards keeping the lights on and other various important things, and for a teen to still surprise them with a suicide

So then the responsibility goes back to the teen to be willing to tell someone. Even if they told their friend, a good parent would have that friendÂ’s number and the friend could tell the parent. But if they donÂ’t tell anyone, not a parent, not a friend, no one, and just do it, almost nothing can protect them at that point

To me, there is a “due diligence”. And it is possible for a parent to have done this and still lost their kid

i dealt with the trap of suicide ideation for a few years. i heard the wonderful phrase "i will, a will just, i am going to **** myself" literally every day, multiple times a day. they have no control.
you are right about keeping the lights on. i couldnt imagine dealing with that and the stress of keeping the lights on. i was lucky i guess. the hardest part was admitting the part i played allowing her to end up where she was.

due diligence = due suffering as you discover your very own unconscious evil.