Dictate/Rapture has no aggro component ?

[Viscere]

Right now if you either Dictate or Rapture a mob in a train, the mob will become your pet and the rest of the train will ignore you.

There is no aggro component to both spells, it's a dank technique to basically single pull a mob out of a train, you don't have to bother with dirty/clean tag.

Is this classic?

[Lothisu]

Right now if you either Dictate or Rapture a mob in a train, the mob will become your pet and the rest of the train will ignore you.

There is no aggro component to both spells, it's a dank technique to basically single pull a mob out of a train, you don't have to bother with dirty/clean tag.

Is this classic?

Yes I remember this mechanic on Live, we used it a lot in Sebilis.

[Zuranthium]

It would be classic if you used a non-charm spell to do that, assuming you cast from far enough away. If you use charm, the train should start attacking the pet.

In classic, if the only aggro a person has is the initial aggro of running in a MOB's range, the MOB will switch to another person if the other person gets in melee range of the MOB. Casting on a single MOB in a train from a safe distance only aggros that 1 MOB. But casting Charm on a MOB would mean it is now an opponent within melee range, and therefore the train would turn on the pet.

[Viscere]

Awaiting Loramin's expert opinion

[Duik]

What Zuranthium says makes sense. I never went to Sebilis on live so i dunno about that.

[Prismaticshop]

It would be classic if you used a non-charm spell to do that, assuming you cast from far enough away. If you use charm, the train should start attacking the pet.

In classic, if the only aggro a person has is the initial aggro of running in a MOB's range, the MOB will switch to another person if the other person gets in melee range of the MOB. Casting on a single MOB in a train from a safe distance only aggros that 1 MOB. But casting Charm on a MOB would mean it is now an opponent within melee range, and therefore the train would turn on the pet.

do you have any logs, evidence of this?

Nilbog / Loramin work based on evidence

cheers

[Zuranthium]

do you have any logs, evidence of this?

There's ample logs of people training each other during classic using the method of running MOBs into their melee range.

It's also been known for an entire decade now the specifics of how it's all supposed to work - https://www.eqemulator.org/forums/showthread.php?t=39819

[Vivitron]

There's ample logs of people training each other during classic using the method of running MOBs into their melee range.

It's also been known for an entire decade now the specifics of how it's all supposed to work - https://www.eqemulator.org/forums/showthread.php?t=39819

It only applies to some NPCs, your source says:

After the NPC is aggro, it will stop checking its aggro radius.

Some NPCs continuously (endlessly) check for players in melee range (not full aggro range) to add to their hate lists even after aggroing on a player. (usually undead)

This used to be much more common in the classic world before Sony revamped all the zones. It's still common in Kunark, undead NPCs, fearplane, and other places. Players who first-aggro NPCs this way will still get the 20 or 25 hate applied when they aggro. The result of NPCs having this ability is that you can train them on to people who did not touch them by running over people if you have very little hate on the NPC. This is very much classic behavior. (see Fansy the bard)

[Zuranthium]

It only applies to some NPCs, your source says:

It applies to pretty much everything in classic. They literally talk about that in what you quoted. It's something that apparently became less common in later expansions and got applied to old world zones much later in EQ's timeline when they changed the graphics of those zones (aka, made them look worse with the "new age" graphics).

[nilbog]

In the OP, it says

Dictate or Rapture a mob in a trainSo, in this example, someone, lets call it a monk, aggros 20 npcs.
Someone else charms an npc in that train.

Should the npcs have more hate vs the puller than social aggro vs a charmed pet (which admittedly is probably not working correctly).

[Zuranthium]

So, in this example, someone, lets call it a monk, aggros 20 npcs.
Someone else charms an npc in that train.

Should the npcs have more hate vs the puller than social aggro vs a charmed pet (which admittedly is probably not working correctly).

The charmed pet is supposed to have more aggro because it's in melee range. Anyone who gets in melee range of an NPC should be added to that NPC's hate list (assuming they are KOS), and the amount of extra hate caused by being in melee range should automatically cause a train to hit that person, unless the puller put a bunch of extra aggro on all those NPC's.

BTW, is there any specific programming difficulty on p99 to change the resist rates of Lulls and other spells to their classic values that have been reported?

[Viscere]

Well, so then this should be fixed?

there is no way Dictate/rapture should have absolutely 0 aggro component like they have right now, irrespective of hate generation?

[Zuranthium]

Well, so then this should be fixed?

there is no way Dictate/rapture should have absolutely 0 aggro component like they have right now, irrespective of hate generation?

If you cast a non-Charm, non-AoE spell on a MOB in train, from outside melee range, you're supposed to be able to single pull it.

Casting a spell (or using a ranged attack) on a MOB in a train gives you 100 hate on all those MOBs (assuming they are all social with each other). But the puller already has 120 hate at minimum, from getting initial aggro. The single target spell you cast only adds that extra amount of hate to that one MOB (aka, cast a 50 point damage spell on the MOB, you now have 150 hate).

[Viscere]

If you cast a non-Charm, non-AoE spell on a MOB in train, from outside melee range, you're supposed to be able to single pull it.

Casting a spell (or using a ranged attack) on a MOB in a train gives you 100 hate on all those MOBs (assuming they are all social with each other). But the puller already has 120 hate at minimum, from getting initial aggro. The single target spell you cast only adds that extra amount of hate to that one MOB (aka, cast a 50 point damage spell on the MOB, you now have 150 hate).

well, it definitely needs a fix then mate

[Goregasmic]

Yeah I remember pulling singles from KC trains on my wizard, which always confused me that I didn't get on the aggro table of the rest of the train due to social aggro from that spell landing. IIRC this doesn't work here.

On here the whole "train passing close to you" without interacting is odd because you never really know if you got on the aggro list or not. Sometimes you're safe and sometimes they all come back for you. I thought all mobs checked for aggro every tick but apparently not.

[zelld52]

Seems like it's the same as a dirty tag with standard tactics ie: Thin Boned Wand, Wand of Frostbolts - maybe leash range is a factor?

This is a tactic that has been used for ages, in my experience. Unless the mobs leash, when the person with initial aggro dies or zones, the train should come for you - are you saying that the kiter can zone and the train wont go after the mob?