Staff of Temperate Flux and Rod of Insidious Glamour Should not be useable on move

[Awsten_Tx]

------------------------------
June 15, 2000 8:00 am
------------------------------

*Patch Day*

Hello everyone,

Over the past few weeks, a portion of the EQ team has been working on
The Hole, in preparation of its release in the near future. Even so, a
number of changes and additions were made in today's patch. Most of the
changes are in regards to quests:

- The "Fleshy Orb" quest has been completed
- We've received word that "Fabian" has been spotted somewhere on
Norrath.
- Froglok Foragers and Hunters should been seen more regularly.
- Lord Grimrot should be seen more frequently.
- Skill in tailoring is no longer required to craft The Robe of the
Lost Circle.

A few items have also been changed this week:

- The Robe of the Lost Circle has been enhanced.
- The Staff of Temperate Flux and the Rod of Insidious Glamour now have
a short casting time associated with their activatable effect (See
Below).
- The Gunthak Harpoon is again NORENT, meaning that it will disappear
when you log off (See Below.)


*Casting Times on Staff and Rod*

We received word a few weeks ago that some people were using these
items to "spam" other players with their spell-effect messages, causing
them to disconnect. Though /ignore will allow you to filter out text
messages caused by people on your /ignore list, it will not allow you
to filter out spell-effect messages for spells cast upon you.

The short casting time should prevent the problems associated with the
targetable and activatable effect on these weapons, however you will
have to stand still to use them now.

The 2 items need to have a short cast time added to them so you must stand still to use.

[Kinien]

I only see this posted on two wikis where folks can edit the notes. Is there a credible source for these notes?

[Kinien]

Interesting, can see it here https://everquest.allakhazam.com/history/patches-2000-1.html

[Awsten_Tx]

ah damn sorry meant to include the citation link
thanks for posting it

[CrazyPro]

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

[Darver]

Was this eventually changed back? Several comments on the staff page from Allakhazam from back in 2001 - 2003 mention that it's instant cast at that point.

https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=57&p=2#comments

[Awsten_Tx]

https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/quest.html?quest=459&p=3#comments


Staff of Temperate Flux
Quote
Reply
#Jul 25 2000 at 4:57 AMRating: Decent
Anonymous
Anonymous
-This quest is pretty hard to complete. At lvl 29 I have all the pieces except the Heart of Fire which drops off the Inferno Wizard(Not Warlock). SolA is a pain in the butt to navigate through. Goblin Wizards amd Shaman can see through invis and the Gnomes in the castle wont help you when your in trouble. Heart of Ice from Permafrost was easy(Invis look for thier casting message find one alone and RootBomb), Lambent Stone for the the Staff was a sinch(Hehe, just got to Rathe mountains and buy it from a merchant), I had to enlist the help of a group to kill the Stone skellis and Died here a couple times:( but I got it. I am told that the staff can be used from your inventory slot like JBoots. Every little bit helps in the fight against resists, it also give you something to do before dropping the Target that your tanks are fighting, too bad you gotta stop to cast it now.

[Awsten_Tx]

Was this eventually changed back? Several comments on the staff page from Allakhazam from back in 2001 - 2003 mention that it's instant cast at that point.

https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=57&p=2#comments

People used the term instant, not like we do, back then.

[Awsten_Tx]

It seemed "instant" in that it took .25 seconds to so to go through, but it wasnt so "instant" you could run while clicking...

[Awsten_Tx]

I was always so concerned with the archery nerf i didnt bother to go snooping about this "kite meta" we have in p99. People didnt kite like that back in the day, and I wasnt sure why it was a thing here... turns out this is why.

[Darver]

Comment from June 01, 2001 says

"ALLRIGHT - i've grown ill of all the misinformed folks out there... please allow me to explain why this item is one of the most useful items a wizard can have (yes i stated this in an earlier reply but i want it right up top in bold )...

1) The effect lowers fire and ice resists by 6 - zap yourself with it and you will see this to be true... any debuff that doesnt require your mana, and doesnt even require you to be still (you can use the effect while running, it wont be interrupted, it has zero cast time) - IS INVALUABLE"

The person specifically states you can use it while running.

Also, this comment from Sept 18, 2003 says:

"JMTC. This staff is probably the most used item in the wizard ******** How so? Well.. at 65 I still use it to pull mobs while on the run. It is instant cast which makes all the difference in the world since you can "run by" pull. You dont have to stop. You just right click from inventory and the mob chases you. Very nice when you are on horseback etc.. and stopping just means a slow restart to a run, or you are in a hot spot with other nasty mobs and stopping to cast some agro getting spell will just put you in harms way longer than is good for you."

They also mention you can run while pulling, meaning it's instant.

Additionally, the patch notes don't say how long the cast time is. Can we find any evidence that this actually ever went through, considering comments after that date still talk about it being instant? Or can we find patch notes after this that state it was reverted to instant?

[Darver]

Another post on our forums on this:

https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?p=3119216&utm

[CrazyPro]

Can we find any evidence that this actually ever went through, considering comments after that date still talk about it being instant? Or can we find patch notes after this that state it was reverted to instant?


https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/quest.html?quest=459&p=3#m15124

Staff of Temperate Flux
#Jul 25 2000 at 4:57 AM
Anonymous
Anonymous
-This quest is pretty hard to complete. At lvl 29 I have all the pieces except the Heart of Fire which drops off the Inferno Wizard(Not Warlock). SolA is a pain in the butt to navigate through. Goblin Wizards amd Shaman can see through invis and the Gnomes in the castle wont help you when your in trouble. Heart of Ice from Permafrost was easy(Invis look for thier casting message find one alone and RootBomb), Lambent Stone for the the Staff was a sinch(Hehe, just got to Rathe mountains and buy it from a merchant), I had to enlist the help of a group to kill the Stone skellis and Died here a couple times:( but I got it. I am told that the staff can be used from your inventory slot like JBoots. Every little bit helps in the fight against resists, it also give you something to do before dropping the Target that your tanks are fighting, too bad you gotta stop to cast it now.

It was probably changed to 0.01 seconds or something like that, like the dain hammer.

[sammoHung]

It was instant cast and could be cast on the move:

Source: I used it to gather and quad wyverns in CS in late 2001.

[Awsten_Tx]

I dont know, seems like some "trust me bro" post from individual players.

Patch notes seem pretty clear, as well as player comments about having to stop to use it.

I looked forward up to 2003 and didnt find any patch notes reverting the change.

I am curious if that quad kiting guide was written after that fact, being unaware of the flux staff changing to have a small cast time.

[sammoHung]

I dont know, seems like some "trust me bro" post from individual players.

Patch notes seem pretty clear, as well as player comments about having to stop to use it.

I looked forward up to 2003 and didnt find any patch notes reverting the change.

I am curious if that quad kiting guide was written after that fact, being unaware of the flux staff changing to have a small cast time.

Meanwhile, you used a non-existent patch as your original source.

Here is the list of patch notes I found for June 2000

JUNE 6, 2000:
-Some new spells are available for the hybrid classes. Check your Kunark spell vendors.
-Due to the fact that the looting rules were changed on Tallon Zek post-production, we've decided to allow characters on both servers a one-time character-move. Registration for the move will open at 6:00pm PDT on Friday, June 9th, 2000, on both servers, and will be open through 12:00pm PDT on Monday, June 12th, 2000. You can register for the move by executing the "/movelog yes" command during the registration window. There is no limit to the number of people that we will allow to move between Tallon and Vallon Zek, so there is no reason to rush to enter the command.

JUNE 15, 2000:
-The Chat and Login server components are now completely separate, meaning that players will no longer have difficulty logging in due to an excess of people in the chat server.

JUNE 22, 2000:
-We are pleased to announce the opening of The Hole, a high-level dungeon on the continent of Odus. The Hole is a complementary addition to EverQuest, available to all subscribers regardless of their Kunark status. The files necessary to enter The Hole are available via the "Optional Patch" button at the bottom of the patch program interface. The files are quite large (about 9MB total), so if the download is going slowly, you may want to postpone downloading the files until later. As mentioned above, The Hole is a high-level dungeon, designed to support characters starting at about level 40. It should be regarded as extremely dangerous. As a note, jumping in The Hole from Paineel is NO LONGER A SHORTCUT TO TOXXULIA FOREST. The GMs will not recover corpses for people who fall, or jump, or attempt to levitate into The Hole.
-As we announced earlier this week, due to the number of people specifying interest in "coin-only" loot on Vallon Zek, versus those wishing to retain item-loot, we have implemented "coin-only" looting rules for PvP combat on Vallon Zek.
Previously, players had to be resurrected within two hours after death in order to receive any experience back as part of the resurrection. Due to the increased size and difficulty associated with Kunark zones, we've raised this limit from two hours to three. This should assist players and make it easier for them to obtain an experience-returning resurrection within the time limit.
-We noticed few weeks ago that it is common practice to use NPCs to open locked doors rather than by using the services of someone that is able to pick locks. In order to protect and increase the value of the abilities of the lock-picking classes, NPCs have gained the ability to walk through locked doors without opening them.
-Over the past couple of weeks, we've received more and more reports of these dragons being bested by smaller and smaller groups of higher-level (high 50s) adventurers. As we've always felt that Dragons should be special encounters that require a large number of people, we were left with some choices. One choice available to us was to increase the power of the dragons to a level where the level 60 folks would find them challenging. This would have the disadvantage of forever placing them out-of-reach for those who did not buy Kunark, and place them further out-of-reach for those who did, but are just now approaching the levels where they could go on Dragon raids. Another possible solution was to make the dragons flee (depop) when engaged by a more powerful group of people. This would have the undesired effect of allowing some people to deny others the experience of fighting a dragon. Instead of raising the bar as mentioned above, we've instead decided that dragons, or at least these two dragons, should have the magical ability to pick their own fights. Players of level 53 or above will now encounter some difficulty when attempting to assist in combat with these dragons. This should help 40s and low 50-level characters with their chances to encounter a dragon without worry of getting forced out by much higher level players. In addition, it also has the added effect of creating a natural progression from the younger dragons of Antonica to the elder and more formidable dragons of Kunark.

JUNE 29, 2000:
-Many new recipes for the "Make Poison" skill are now in game. Features include: Several new poison books, stackable components, new suspensions, some purchasable components, and players now have the ability to purchase vials. Please check your vendors.

[Darver]

But either it reverted or that comment was wrong. Plus, there is nothing clear, that I've found yet, saying it has a definitive cast time number. This could have been something added in, then taken right back out 2 weeks later, possibly after public backlash or unintended consequences. The question is when.

Not that it matters, we have a comment from June 2001, which is before the end of Velious, stating clearly that you can cast it while running. This is probably our best evidence for how it acted in the actual timeline unless we can find something else. So, worst case this would affect a new server that is still progressing through the natural game play where an undetermined cast time is added between June 15th 2000 and sometime on or before June 1st 2001.

[Awsten_Tx]

Meanwhile, you used a non-existent patch as your original source.

Here is the list of patch notes I found for June 2000

lolwut?

https://www.eqarchives.com/patch/view/2000-06-15-1

[Darver]

The patch notes appear on allakhazam also, and they appear to be legit

https://everquest.allakhazam.com/history/patches-2000-1.html

[Kinien]

Was this eventually changed back? Several comments on the staff page from Allakhazam from back in 2001 - 2003 mention that it's instant cast at that point.

https://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/item.html?item=57&p=2#comments

Very likely

[Awsten_Tx]

But either it reverted or that comment was wrong. Plus, there is nothing clear, that I've found yet, saying it has a definitive cast time number. This could have been something added in, then taken right back out 2 weeks later, possibly after public backlash or unintended consequences. The question is when.

Not that it matters, we have a comment from June 2001, which is before the end of Velious, stating clearly that you can cast it while running. This is probably our best evidence for how it acted in the actual timeline unless we can find something else. So, worst case this would affect a new server that is still progressing through the natural game play where an undetermined cast time is added between June 15th 2000 and sometime on or before June 1st 2001.

I dunno, i tend to trust patch notes pretty heavily over the "trust me bro" comments. Course its also possible you could still 1 click it on the move but on subsequent clicks it got interupted. Who knows. But its pretty clear it isnt behaving like it was on live back in the day.

[Awsten_Tx]

Gonna do some testing with dain hammer this evening.

[CrazyPro]

Gonna do some testing with dain hammer this evening.

dain hammer is listed as 0.12 cast time on TAKP/Quarm

[Boomlaor]

It was instant cast and could be cast on the move:

Source: I used it to gather and quad wyverns in CS in late 2001.

Second this. I played a wizard main from 2001 through 2006, including quadding wyverns, raptors, suits in WL, flies in Plane of Disease, and the lvl 68 dudes in Plane of Fire. I used flux staff 100% of the time both for pulling mobs as well as to determine when I was at max casting range to stop and cast my snare/next nuke. This was 100% clickable on the run. Can't speak to Rod of Insidious Glamour, but Flux staff was.

[Boomlaor]

Some in era evidence:

https://www.graffes.com/forums/showthread.php?3461-How-amp-Where-to-Quad-Levels-34-45-By-Bicrius-of-Luclin

“ - 6. Pulling WITH a staff of temperal flux: Use the same as is stated above, but cast your SoTF on the run to aggro them, and use it as a gadge for casting distance for when you're going to cast Bonds of Force or Circle of Force.”

[Kinien]

Definitely word of mouth type of call out here, but...guildmate shared this with me. I obviously don't have patch note proof.

"I was a main wizard on live, I remember them making the change and reverting it after there was an uproar from players.
It was like a week I think, wasn't long before they reversed course."

[Duik]

I was wiz on Prexus, it was insta-cast for me.
Its a trust me bro post though because I stopped playing him before 2001. No proof though.
The patch advertized change and revert after player complaints sounds legit.

[Awsten_Tx]

There is 0 evidence it was reverted. It might of been usable on and "instant basis" every second. But was not spammable to the point it caused people to crash, I found another patch note similar which indicates fixes for other instant items like dark cloak of sky, or cloak of thorns.

[CrazyPro]

There is 0 evidence it was reverted. It might of been usable on and "instant basis" every second. But was not spammable to the point it caused people to crash, I found another patch note similar which indicates fixes for other instant items like dark cloak of sky, or cloak of thorns.

https://web.archive.org/web/20010921170350/http://pub23.ezboard.com/fgraffeswizardcompilationfrm20.showMessageRange?to picID=13.topic&start=21&stop=33

Kelvyn Telarian
Forum Wizard
(4/10/01 10:18:09 pm)
Re: sola wizard spawns...
Regarding quadding in CS, some important things to keep in mind so you don't die again:

1. Practice pulling 1 wyvern only down the cliffs to the sand, then kill using Pillar--use flux staff to ping distance as described by fasty earlier--this way you should never have to keep turning around and looking at the mobs--just watch a Dru kite sometime, you will see what I mean.

2. Do NOT run with the mobs through and around the Othimir--when you kill some before the others of your four, you may end up with like only 3 mobs due to resists or whatever--that 4th hit is gonna hit an Othmir then they will swarm--if that ever happens, run out into the water (you should be levitating) and gate.

3. ALWAYS have gate up--the second you port into CS, swap it out and mem gate or you will be very bummed.

4. Always pull either in the sand right up along the cliffs, which has no Othmir at all and a nice little straight alleyway for quadding, or out on the far edges of the beach (opposite end of the Bulthar of course), and cut across the water, lining them up to nuke just as they exit--this latter meathod is an interesting and fun technique.

5. It is best to hover while levitating about 6-10 feet below the wyverns--this usually avoids any agro from Drakes--if you actually go UP on the cliff top to pull, the Drakes are much more likely to become aware of you. Once you are in hover position, and have double checked that you have 3 or 4 juicy Wyverns all lined up on the cliff above, just run and ping with flux staff--hit F8 to target, hotkey flux, run on to the next one, then make a hard turn straight out from the cliff towards the water. This will give you time to set up the Atol's or BoF since the Wyverns aren't levitating and you are. You will see them fall down the cliff face while you run striaght out. As they approch you, move left and right along the beach to bunch them up, then apply snare and yer off!

NOTE: I started with just 1 mob till I had exactly what I wanted to do down. Then added 1 more, then one more till I was very smooth in each. And I still die from time to time :-)

Good Luck, it is a nice place to quad.


Kel, 53, Veeshan

-

https://dbsanfte.github.io/eq-archives/newsgroups/alt.games.everquest-msg-32972.txt

2001-08-15

To be honest, at this point the SoTF is so useful when solo'ing, I'd
equip it instead of the SotW. Remember, it's not just the debuff
abilty (which is so tiny as to not be noticable), it lets you judge
the range of your nukes, so you know when to stop running and start
blasting.

-

https://dbsanfte.github.io/eq-archives/newsgroups/alt.games.everquest-msg-24686.txt

2001-07-24

My Wizard
pulls with the right-click effect on my Staff of Temperate Flux (if I
decide to pull instead of fight in the water...see below). I get the
goblin targeted, and then swim up. When I get far enough up to see
the surface of the lake, I invoke the right-click effect (aren't items
that work while running or swimming great?), break through the
surface, and run to the shore (jboots active, of course), using the
right-click on the Staff to tell when I'm getting too far ahead, so I
can stop to let the goblin catch up a little.

It was definitely reverted.

[Awsten_Tx]

https://web.archive.org/web/20010921170350/http://pub23.ezboard.com/fgraffeswizardcompilationfrm20.showMessageRange?to picID=13.topic&start=21&stop=33



-

https://dbsanfte.github.io/eq-archives/newsgroups/alt.games.everquest-msg-32972.txt

2001-08-15



-

https://dbsanfte.github.io/eq-archives/newsgroups/alt.games.everquest-msg-24686.txt

2001-07-24



It was definitely reverted.

Did some testing, Dain hammer is useable on the run, though it isnt spammable. could generally get 2 MAYBE 3 cast in per second.

Also found this January 20, 2000 Patch Note:

- Casting times have been implemented on several activatable items.
This was done to correct issues that could arise from people
chain-casting these items.

https://www.eqarchives.com/patch/view/2000-01-20-1

Temperate flux needs its micro time added.

[Defo]

Staff was spammable. As others have said, it was used not only to pull, but also to test spell range.

You'd pull a mob and spam Staff until it said Your target is out of range, that's how you knew to stop and start casting the quad spell.

I was also a wizard player from 2000-2004. I quadded many, many mobs using this method.

[Awsten_Tx]

Staff was spammable. As others have said, it was used not only to pull, but also to test spell range.

You'd pull a mob and spam Staff until it said Your target is out of range, that's how you knew to stop and start casting the quad spell.

I was also a wizard player from 2000-2004. I quadded many, many mobs using this method.

Cool show me logs, video, or screenshots even of casting faster than a dain hammer.

Otherwise the trust me bro argument has 0 merit.

[Defo]

Cool show me logs, video, or screenshots even of casting faster than a dain hammer.

Otherwise the trust me bro argument has 0 merit.

And your half-baked pulling forum posts with NONE having players complaining about casting time on the staff?


To be honest, at this point the SoTF is so useful when solo'ing, I'd
equip it instead of the SotW. Remember, it's not just the debuff
abilty (which is so tiny as to not be noticable), it lets you judge
the range of your nukes, so you know when to stop running and start
blasting.

Whatever crusade your on: you're incorrect. You have no evidence, either. You claim it wasn't reverted, but you have 4 players here who claim to have played wizards and they all state it was instant and spammable.

I trust the other 3, over you.

Unsubbed. Don't bother responding to me.

[Awsten_Tx]

Sorry patch notes and current evidence > trust me bro

As i said you can use the dian hammer on the move, just cant spam it 5 times a second. Which is in line with the patch notes

[Awsten_Tx]

Also its worth noting, checking range is possible with literally ANY spell. The benefit of the clicky item is that it didnt have a long spell time requiring you to interupt to immediately check again.

So while I understand it was useable on the run, and understand wizards used it to check range once every half to full second, it was NOT spammable 4 to 5 times a second.

[Awsten_Tx]

Looks like Testing with dain hammer yielded a maximum of 2.2 clicks per second on the move.

[Danth]

Note also that yaulp (which has a sort-of-lengthy .5 cast time) can quite often successfully cast whilst running. Depends mostly on things like server ticks and latency. This would be true of any spell or item with a sufficiently fast cast time, and the faster the spell, the easier it gets. .1 may as well be instant as far as anyone should care in this regard, although less rapidly spammable than a true instant spell. Real purpose of this change was to prevent someone running a turbo button to spam 100X a second or some such. Could be the cast time was briefly longer then soon reduced. Not all such changes are well-documented.

[drakleon99]

So I played a wizard during Live, and leveled up specifically during the velious era. (There's a reason I can never look at those cobalt scar wyrvyns again).

Flux staff was absolutely usable on the run as I would use it every day to tag my 4 wyrvyns for my quad kites as anyone else would remember who playing a wizard during this era.

Using this line:

- Casting times have been implemented on several activatable items.
This was done to correct issues that could arise from people
chain-casting these items.

Is definitely disingenuous as you are claiming this particular item that nearly everyone is saying was always instant was one of the ones changed when plenty of other instant items like Jboots were not. According to your logic, this patch note changed those too along with my Bracer of the Hidden or my Drums of the Beast. I think it would be best not to make assumptions intended to change established item mechanics on a guess or worse, due to a raiding motive.

[Baugi]

Found some Velious era spamming of (presumably) flux staff -

eqlog_20_Etha.txt:[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Etha.txt:[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Etha.txt:[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Etha.txt:[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Etha.txt:[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
------------------------------
eqlog_20_Etha.txt:[Thu Jul 05 20:05:27 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Etha.txt:[Thu Jul 05 20:05:27 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Etha.txt:[Thu Jul 05 20:05:27 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Etha.txt:[Thu Jul 05 20:05:27 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
------------------------------
eqlog_20_Etha.txt:[Thu Jul 05 20:05:28 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Etha.txt:[Thu Jul 05 20:05:28 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Etha.txt:[Thu Jul 05 20:05:28 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Etha.txt:[Thu Jul 05 20:05:28 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Etha.txt:[Thu Jul 05 20:05:28 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
------------------------------
eqlog_20_Nina.txt:[Mon Aug 06 00:44:05 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Nina.txt:[Mon Aug 06 00:44:05 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Nina.txt:[Mon Aug 06 00:44:05 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Nina.txt:[Mon Aug 06 00:44:05 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Nina.txt:[Mon Aug 06 00:44:05 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Nina.txt:[Mon Aug 06 00:44:05 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Nina.txt:[Mon Aug 06 00:44:05 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
------------------------------
eqlog_20_Nina.txt:[Mon Aug 06 00:44:06 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Nina.txt:[Mon Aug 06 00:44:06 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Nina.txt:[Mon Aug 06 00:44:06 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Nina.txt:[Mon Aug 06 00:44:06 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Nina.txt:[Mon Aug 06 00:44:06 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Nina.txt:[Mon Aug 06 00:44:06 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
------------------------------
eqlog_20_Nina.txt:[Mon Aug 06 00:44:07 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Nina.txt:[Mon Aug 06 00:44:07 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Nina.txt:[Mon Aug 06 00:44:07 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
eqlog_20_Nina.txt:[Mon Aug 06 00:44:07 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.

Also a guide complaining about being spammed with one during a GM event in early Luclin -

eqlog021602.txt:4449:[Sat Feb 16 22:30:11 2002] Icebalm tells the group, 'got a wizard with a stupid temperate flux staff spamming me'

[drakleon99]

Found some Velious era spamming of (presumably) flux staff -



Also a guide complaining about being spammed with one during a GM event in early Luclin -

Yup - that's way more than 2 or 3 a second max you can get with items like the dain hammer, which pretty uniquely has that .1s cast time.

[Awsten_Tx]

Yah, im sensing some fuckery is afoot... But

[Mon Jul 02 00:50:37 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:50:39 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:50:39 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:50:40 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:50:40 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:50:41 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:50:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:50:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:50:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:50:43 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:50:43 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:50:44 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:50:45 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:39 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:39 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:40 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:40 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:41 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:41 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:41 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
All of these entries are 1 or 2 per second.

[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.

There as a shaman in this group as well casting Malaisment so probably explains it. Or very likely a slight server lag since there are no text reports for the next second...
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:44 2001] Geneshami begins to cast a spell.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:46 2001] Yath says, 'whoooo'

Also, Skippy and Brahamamamma were dual wizards in the group fighting blizzard spiders...
[Mon Aug 06 00:43:51 2001] Brahamamamma says, 'do u have staff of temp flux yet Skippy?'

[Mon Aug 06 00:44:05 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Aug 06 00:44:05 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Aug 06 00:44:05 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Aug 06 00:44:05 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Aug 06 00:44:05 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Aug 06 00:44:05 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Aug 06 00:44:05 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
Divided by 2 is 3 per second.

[Mon Aug 06 00:44:06 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Aug 06 00:44:06 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Aug 06 00:44:06 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Aug 06 00:44:06 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Aug 06 00:44:06 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Aug 06 00:44:06 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
Divided by 2 is 3 per second

[Mon Aug 06 00:44:07 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Aug 06 00:44:07 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Aug 06 00:44:07 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Aug 06 00:44:07 2001] A blizzard spider looks uncomfortable.

Divided by 2 is 2 per second.

Thank you very much for the citation, it was massively helpful in proving my point!

[Wayward]

[Mon Aug 06 00:44:05 2001] Awsten_Tx performs mental gymnastics. It is pathetic.

[Wayward]

You say people didn't kite like that, but they most certainly did. Many people here have said that's how they did it on their wizards, by spamming the flux staff.

PS: I have no dog in the fight, I don't raid and don't plan on it. I also didn't play a wizard back then, but nonetheless it's pretty telling of your personality that you refuse to admit you were mistaken in the face of many claims to the contrary.

[Awsten_Tx]

I dunno. I have found nothing but evidence that supports the patch notes.

If yall want to make personal attacks, I guess that just helps the cause?

I actually laughed a bit when I realized the 1 log excerpt actually was reflecting 2 wizards using their flux staff.

From what I've gathered the max Cast per second seems to be 3 or less.

[WarpathEQ]

Cherry picking evidence of someone casting something at the speed you've decided is the appropriate speed isn't valid evidence.

If there was really a delay in the item and someone was spamming it as fast as possible you would also see evidence of the key strokes returning errors, no different than if you try and spam any item that has a cast time. Anyone can cast anything slower than the allowed speed as in 99.99% of cases the use of the item doesn't improve just because you click it faster.

There has been plenty of evidence both in quotes and logs that has been posted here that was in era and supports the mechanics working identical to how they currently do on P99.

#ThreadClosed

[Awsten_Tx]

Cherry picking evidence of someone casting something at the speed you've decided is the appropriate speed isn't valid evidence.

If there was really a delay in the item and someone was spamming it as fast as possible you would also see evidence of the key strokes returning errors, no different than if you try and spam any item that has a cast time. Anyone can cast anything slower than the allowed speed as in 99.99% of cases the use of the item doesn't improve just because you click it faster.

There has been plenty of evidence both in quotes and logs that has been posted here that was in era and supports the mechanics working identical to how they currently do on P99.

#ThreadClosed
odd statement from someone without a dog in the hunt?

Anyways find me evidence im wrong and Ill concede it, otherwise this continues to be on a path to get corrected.

Cheers!

edit* its worth mentioning since you brought it up. "You can't use that command right now..." is a local text notification, it does not go out to other people.

[WarpathEQ]

odd statement from someone without a dog in the hunt?

Anyways find me evidence im wrong and Ill concede it, otherwise this continues to be on a path to get corrected.

Cheers!

edit* its worth mentioning since you brought it up. "You can't use that command right now..." is a local text notification, it does not go out to other people.

The evidence is all posted above. In the same files you unsuccessfully tried to cherry pick from.

It does all make sense now that you're confirmed Gluwen, typical behavior. Sorry you don't have because of flux staff mechanics.

Its a good thing we have log files directly from the wizard spamming the flux staffs showing the uncapped speed and 0 input errors. Nice try though.

[Awsten_Tx]

The evidence is all posted above. In the same files you unsuccessfully tried to cherry pick from.

It does all make sense now that you're confirmed Gluwen, typical behavior. Sorry you don't have because of flux staff mechanics.

Its a good thing we have log files directly from the wizard spamming the flux staffs showing the uncapped speed and 0 input errors. Nice try though.

the log files are from a druid grouped with the wizard... Anything else i can clarify for you?

Also my forum name literally matching my discord name, I dont think it was ever any secret who I was (am?). I dunno /shrug.

[Baugi]

There as a shaman in this group as well casting Malaisment so probably explains it. Or very likely a slight server lag since there are no text reports for the next second...


No shaman cast, or skipped second or second wizard in this one -

Edit: Just realized you mean the second after is skipped, but that's not how server lag works. The messages would be bunched up after a gap, not before.

[Mon Jul 02 00:52:17 2001] Reethon tells the group, 'I am feigning off an enthralled bulthar.'
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:17 2001] Reethon says, 'WARNING, Monk feigning off an enthralled bulthar.'
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:20 2001] Yath tells the group, 'damn right.'
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:23 2001] Reethon tells the group, 'hahah'
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:24 2001] an enthralled bulthar was hit by non-melee for 5 points of damage.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:25 2001] An enthralled bulthar was pierced by thorns.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:25 2001] An enthralled bulthar gores YOU for 107 points of damage.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:33 2001] an enthralled bulthar was hit by non-melee for 5 points of damage.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:33 2001] An enthralled bulthar was pierced by thorns.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:33 2001] An enthralled bulthar gores YOU for 49 points of damage.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:37 2001] Brahamamamma begins to cast a spell.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:39 2001] An enthralled bulthar staggers from a blow to the head.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:39 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:39 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:40 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:40 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:41 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:41 2001] an enthralled bulthar was hit by non-melee for 5 points of damage.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:41 2001] An enthralled bulthar was pierced by thorns.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:41 2001] An enthralled bulthar gores YOU for 107 points of damage.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:41 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:41 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:44 2001] Geneshami begins to cast a spell.

...

[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] Players on EverQuest:
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] ---------------------------
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [54 Disciple] Reethon (Human) <Order of Reverence>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [ANONYMOUS] Brahamamamma <Phoenix Crusaders>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [58 Beguiler] Ikabod (High Elf) <The Grey Legion>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [ANONYMOUS] Aeawen [DRUID]
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [60 Crusader] Ajoo (High Elf) <The Grey Legion>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [57 Templar] Purity (High Elf) <The Grey Legion>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [54 Minstrel] Karah (Wood Elf) <The Grey Legion>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [52 Disciple] Yath (Human) <United Norrath Coalition>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [54 Mystic] Geneshami (Barbarian) <Order of Reverence>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [51 Champion] Gimme (Ogre) <United Norrath Coalition>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [53 Champion] Macleod (Barbarian) <The Grey Legion>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [ANONYMOUS] Etha <United Norrath Coalition> [DRUID]
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] There are 12 players in Siren's Grotto.

Also, Nina is a warrior for what it's worth. I didn't make any effort to separate the logs.

The lowest in-era ping I can recall seeing is ~275ms so it would've been difficult to cast more than ~5 times a second for that reason. I'm not sure what you're looking for at this point. A clear delineation between 5 and 3 times a second?

[Wayward]

No shaman cast, or skipped second or second wizard in this one -

Edit: Just realized you mean the second after is skipped, but that's not how server lag works. The messages would be bunched up after a gap, not before.



Also, Nina is a warrior for what it's worth. I didn't make any effort to separate the logs.

The lowest in-era ping I can recall seeing is ~275ms so it would've been difficult to cast more than ~5 times a second for that reason. I'm not sure what you're looking for at this point. A clear delineation between 5 and 3 times a second?

He's grasping at straws to try and get a well-known classic mechanic changed - because the mechanic is being used to win Vulak's from his guild.

It's a pathetic attempt, from a pathetic person to try and get nilbog to change something that will benefit his guild.

Everybody who owned a flux staff from the Sol Ro temple era of classic and onwards knows it was instant cast, usable on the run, and spammable. And it was not changed. Multiple people have corroborated this, and then Gluwen asked for logs to prove it:

When logs were given to prove it, he claimed he was still right. There is no proving this pathetic man-child wrong. He will die on this hill.

[Awsten_Tx]

He's grasping at straws to try and get a well-known classic mechanic changed - because the mechanic is being used to win Vulak's from his guild.

It's a pathetic attempt, from a pathetic person to try and get nilbog to change something that will benefit his guild.

Everybody who owned a flux staff from the Sol Ro temple era of classic and onwards knows it was instant cast, usable on the run, and spammable. And it was not changed. Multiple people have corroborated this, and then Gluwen asked for logs to prove it:

When logs were given to prove it, he claimed he was still right. There is no proving this pathetic man-child wrong. He will die on this hill.
save your personal attacks and go relax. this discussion is about maintaining the integrity of the classic experience. Not some vendetta related to guild politics.

[feniin]

https://web.archive.org/web/20011117102004/http://www.angelfire.com/or2/Wizards/wizstrat.html


In the flux staff link, it has the following:

Using the Staff

The Staff of Temperate Flux can be used while moving, and has no casting time to use, it is instant. Further, it has a very quick reset time, allowing you to run around clicking this and affecting your target. This helps to negate the problem with resistances, because if they resist it not only cost you no mana, but very little time either. It also has a slight aggro effect, which makes the monsters notice and be upset at you. Further, it has exactly the same range as your normal DD spells (shorter than bolt).

Knowing all this, you can determine a few little uses for the staff that it wasn't built for. Sorry, but to be able to compete and excel as a Wizard, you have to be creative and work every angle. Incidentally, this staff used to have an unintended side effect where it would remove fire damage shields when clicked on. Verant removed that, however, and it does not act this way any more.

One primary use is to check your range on a creature. The range of the staff is exactly the same as your blasts, which means it will tell you exactly when a monster is in or out of range. This is a good way check how far you are from a monster you are kiting, and it also lets you know if that monster is close enough to shoot or not when its running up. This use in kiting has another effect, it constantly aggros the monster to keep it on your tail, and it also makes it fairly clear you aren't running from the monster nor unaware of it. That red squiggly glow is a good sign you are fighting the monster and well aware of its existence.

Speaking of Aggro, the staff has a low aggro effect that builds as you use it over and over. Since this is so fast, you can actually get monsters mad at you (and not, for example, the enchanter trying to mes or the cleric who is trying to heal) by using the staff and no mana. It also works to pull with, a fairly simple system. When you see the monster, you click on the staff, and if its in range, the monster will run at you without using any mana up.

There are a few other little uses of the staff, if you experiment with it enough you can learn how it works. Basically its a toy that doesn't do anything it was supposed to but being the Master Seeker of Knowledge you can get better use out of.

https://www.graffes.com/forums/showthread.php?1462-Revision-to-temp-flux-staff&p=36507&viewfull=1#post36507
Try expanding your role as a wizard sometime. Need to burn something fast, clicking the staff to remove spell delay drastically increases how quickly you can chain nuke (although jboots will do the same thing). Yes, normally chain nuking is bad, but when trying to hit a gating or chealing mob with draught of jiva it is invaluable. Need to pull with a low aggro, instant casting spell that doesn't force you to stop running - click your staff.

https://www.graffes.com/forums/showthread.php?1405-Balance&p=35112&viewfull=1#post35112
Maybe an Exploit : there is a way to immeidately recover after casting a spell. In other words, 0 sec recovery.
After casting a spell, use any right clickable item to eliminate delay. I will nuke, right click (hotkeyed) jboots or staff of flux and BANG My spells repop right away and I chain cast. Very nice exploit against a biased system.
NOTE: there is a problem with harvest repopping when it isn't ready if harvest is placed in the First Spell Gem slot.
-Aleolin Darkmoon
41st Wizard of Prexus

https://www.graffes.com/forums/showthread.php?6361-Why-Can-t-I-Take-Out-A-Same-Level-Tank&p=132070&viewfull=1#post132070
I try testing MR with my Temp flux staff to see if it's low, since it's insta and free. Usually 20-50 clicks before it gets through. Main points:

[Awsten_Tx]

but 10 clicks of your staff will pull any mob on you in a few seconds...

Sometimes, the plots write themselves

[feniin]

but 10 clicks of your staff will pull any mob on you in a few seconds...

Sometimes, the plots write themselves
:confused:

You do realize most computers in era were not capable of the level of spam clicking we're able to do on modern machines, right? I was running at a solid 5-10 FPS if I was lucky.

[drakleon99]

It's no use arguing with someone who is going to refuse to look at any of this overwhelming evidence from a dozen people. His usual MO is to just wear people out, even when wrong.

[Duik]

If this is really about the guild losing to flux staff pull shenanegans got some, ohh i dunno. Some flux staff pull shenanegans of their own?
Metas change. Roll wiff it boys.

If not. Please ignore.

Also. Wiz on live. Used flux staff. But only have "trust me bro" proof. I also only had 56k modem for much of it soo i prolly never could unleash the full power of that DeathStar.

[Rygar]

Also. Wiz on live. Used flux staff. But only have "trust me bro" proof.

I believe him, yo. I don't know why, but I do.

[WarpathEQ]

save your personal attacks and go relax. this discussion is about maintaining the integrity of the classic experience. Not some vendetta related to guild politics.

Your continued disingenuous interactions with the server both in this thread and other formats suggest otherwise.

[Wayward]

save your personal attacks and go relax. this discussion is about maintaining the integrity of the classic experience. Not some vendetta related to guild politics.

No, your impetus for starting this discussion is that another guild, that is not yours, is using the Flux strategy to reliably win Vulaks (and other targets).

Absolutely far-fetched to think that you randomly saw the original link you posted and thought, "Oh, that's weird - let me bring this up for consideration to make the server more classic."

And much more realistically you saw the post you linked and thought, "HA! A way that I can help to stop <Competition> from using flux staff to win targets from <My Guild>"

How do I know? Because despite everyone in this post giving either anecdotal proof, or showing logs (something you requested) of the mechanics of this staff as it was in 2001, or linking to archived forum posts showing that it was INSTANT and not 0.1 cast time - you refuse to accept the facts.

Pathetic.

[Kirdan]

Gluwen is very much wrong about flux staff, changing it would be unclassic. This has nothing to do with guilds, Wayward Rando.

[baakss]

but 10 clicks of your staff will pull any mob on you in a few seconds...

Sometimes, the plots write themselves

On Quarm and TAKP it generates basically no aggro, so this isn't a problem. Have you considered looking into that if this bothers you?

The instant cast thing actually has been hashed out here before. Have you read through all these?

https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=409094&highlight=flux

https://www.project1999.com/forums/showthread.php?t=356658&highlight=flux

One of these posts included logs showing you could spam the hell out of it:

[Wed Nov 14 02:01:45 2001] a skeleton scowls at you, ready to attack -- You could probably win this fight.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:46 2001] A skeleton tries to hit YOU, but misses!
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:46 2001] A skeleton tries to bash YOU, but misses!
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:47 2001] A skeleton tries to hit YOU, but misses!
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:47 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:49 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:49 2001] A skeleton tries to hit YOU, but misses!
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:49 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:49 2001] You can't use that command right now...
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:49 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:50 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:50 2001] A skeleton tries to hit YOU, but misses!
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:50 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:50 2001] Your target resisted the LowerElement spell.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:50 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:51 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:51 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:51 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:51 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:51 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:52 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:52 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:52 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:52 2001] A skeleton tries to hit YOU, but misses!
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:52 2001] Your target resisted the LowerElement spell.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:52 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:53 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:53 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:53 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:53 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:53 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:54 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:54 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:55 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:55 2001] You were hit by non-melee for 6 dmg.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:55 2001] YOU were injured by falling.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:55 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:55 2001] You can't use that command right now...
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:55 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:55 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:55 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:56 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:56 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:56 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.

[baakss]

I was always so concerned with the archery nerf i didnt bother to go snooping about this "kite meta" we have in p99. People didnt kite like that back in the day, and I wasnt sure why it was a thing here... turns out this is why.

Huh? For kiting a mob any high aggro spell would've worked in era. P99 has some P99-specific mechanics that necessitate flux staff, such as Vulak - Guard aggro share. There would have been no reason to need to do this on live because that mechanic didn't even exist.

On live and in era, the reasons we didn't do these massive kites is:


We had no voice comms.

We played on potatoes and had to stare at the wall or else we went LD.

We had no competition for these mobs.


When you consider the above it's simply better to be as safe as possible. It had nothing to do with flux staff being instant or not.

[Rygar]

[Wed Nov 14 02:01:45 2001] a skeleton scowls at you, ready to attack -- You could probably win this fight.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:46 2001] A skeleton tries to hit YOU, but misses!
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:46 2001] A skeleton tries to bash YOU, but misses!
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:47 2001] A skeleton tries to hit YOU, but misses!
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:47 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:49 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:49 2001] A skeleton tries to hit YOU, but misses!
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:49 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:49 2001] You can't use that command right now...
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:49 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:50 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:50 2001] A skeleton tries to hit YOU, but misses!
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:50 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:50 2001] Your target resisted the LowerElement spell.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:50 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:51 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:51 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:51 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:51 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:51 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:52 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:52 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:52 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:52 2001] A skeleton tries to hit YOU, but misses!
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:52 2001] Your target resisted the LowerElement spell.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:52 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:53 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:53 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:53 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:53 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:53 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:54 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:54 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:55 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:55 2001] You were hit by non-melee for 6 dmg.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:55 2001] YOU were injured by falling.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:55 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:55 2001] You can't use that command right now...
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:55 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:55 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:55 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:56 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:56 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.
[Wed Nov 14 02:01:56 2001] A skeleton looks uncomfortable.

This is the only compelling evidence there was a slight cast time, but I am not convinced it was enough to stop from running while casting in era. As folks have stated, slight movement would not always completely interrupt a spell. Maybe the cast time helped the client/server limit the input received or something (I'm no expert in that realm, just spit-balling)

[Hideousclaw]

This is the only compelling evidence there was a slight cast time, but I am not convinced it was enough to stop from running while casting in era. As folks have stated, slight movement would not always completely interrupt a spell. Maybe the cast time helped the client/server limit the input received or something (I'm no expert in that realm, just spit-balling)

For what its worth this is 3 days ago on P99. Even here there is interrupts from rapid clicking. So that could just be a symptom of the same condition, just rapidly pressing and syncing between server client or whatever. I don't really buy the evidence implying it has a small cast time more than just this being the result of rapidly pressing it

[Fri May 01 10:10:19 2026] Velcra`Dron looks uncomfortable.
[Fri May 01 10:10:19 2026] Your target resisted the LowerElement spell.
[Fri May 01 10:10:19 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Fri May 01 10:10:19 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Fri May 01 10:10:19 2026] Your target resisted the LowerElement spell.
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] Your target resisted the LowerElement spell.
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] Velcra`Dron looks uncomfortable.
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] Velcra`Dron looks uncomfortable.

[Duik]

3 resists 3 success.
For that small sample

[Awsten_Tx]

I have read through everything and posted a week ago that it likely has a cast time similar to dainnhammer. Can still use on the move but limits it to between 2 and 3 cast per second.

[Awsten_Tx]

For what its worth this is 3 days ago on P99. Even here there is interrupts from rapid clicking. So that could just be a symptom of the same condition, just rapidly pressing and syncing between server client or whatever. I don't really buy the evidence implying it has a small cast time more than just this being the result of rapidly pressing it

[Fri May 01 10:10:19 2026] Velcra`Dron looks uncomfortable.
[Fri May 01 10:10:19 2026] Your target resisted the LowerElement spell.
[Fri May 01 10:10:19 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Fri May 01 10:10:19 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Fri May 01 10:10:19 2026] Your target resisted the LowerElement spell.
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] Your target resisted the LowerElement spell.
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] Velcra`Dron looks uncomfortable.
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] Velcra`Dron looks uncomfortable.

Fyi those aren't spell interrupts.

[Kinien]

For what its worth this is 3 days ago on P99. Even here there is interrupts from rapid clicking. So that could just be a symptom of the same condition, just rapidly pressing and syncing between server client or whatever. I don't really buy the evidence implying it has a small cast time more than just this being the result of rapidly pressing it

[Fri May 01 10:10:19 2026] Velcra`Dron looks uncomfortable.
[Fri May 01 10:10:19 2026] Your target resisted the LowerElement spell.
[Fri May 01 10:10:19 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Fri May 01 10:10:19 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Fri May 01 10:10:19 2026] Your target resisted the LowerElement spell.
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] Your target resisted the LowerElement spell.
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] Velcra`Dron looks uncomfortable.
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Fri May 01 10:10:20 2026] Velcra`Dron looks uncomfortable.

I get this all the time on my manastone, if i spam it too quickly I get "You can't use that command right now..."

[feniin]

I have read through everything and posted a week ago that it likely has a cast time similar to dainnhammer. Can still use on the move but limits it to between 2 and 3 cast per second.

I feel like you're just deliberately ignoring the logs and in-era evidence because you can't accept being wrong about this. Good thing nilbog can read and doesn't need your grandstanding.

[Wayward]

I feel like you're just deliberately ignoring the logs and in-era evidence because you can't accept being wrong about this. Good thing nilbog can read and doesn't need your grandstanding.

For real... Literally everyone in this post is telling him he's wrong and providing evidence of the fact, but he keeps saying "Yep that proves it's got a 0.1 cast time."

I wish I had the same type of brain as Gluwen, I bet his detachment from objective truth helps him to stay happy regardless of circumstance. He can probably just reason anything away and imagine a reality where he is infallible.

[baakss]

This is the only compelling evidence there was a slight cast time, but I am not convinced it was enough to stop from running while casting in era. As folks have stated, slight movement would not always completely interrupt a spell. Maybe the cast time helped the client/server limit the input received or something (I'm no expert in that realm, just spit-balling)


Not sure what this is referencing, but seems relevant. Bottom comment says no cast time.

https://groups.google.com/g/alt.games.everquest/c/IljRo03VoaM/m/QvMEUxnEgFwJ

Aug 15, 2001, 12:09:13 PM

>So if this is a complete Nerf, then we Wizzys have a choice +10 int (Staff
>of the Wheel) or Elemental Resistance and debuff ability...

To be honest, at this point the SoTF is so useful when solo'ing, I'd
equip it instead of the SotW. Remember, it's not just the debuff
abilty (which is so tiny as to not be noticable), it lets you judge
the range of your nukes, so you know when to stop running and start
blasting.

The only real killer nerf they could give this thing would be to give
it a casting time. Then, yeah, I'd be pretty pissed.


In here they reference flux staff on the run (luclin era) -- fun thread regardless because it contains AE logs for future reference:

https://groups.google.com/g/alt.games.everquest/c/3f2Kip2WcjM/m/VntYeIqZPgAJ

Depends on environment. I like how quickly a good wizard can tag a bunch
of mobs on the run with the Flux staff



Out of era, but seems to reference flux staff aggro kiting:

https://groups.google.com/g/alt.games.everquest/c/E9f1ly9lP0M/m/hc4o1u2wzKsJ

>Oh and Im too lazy to look up his name, but stay the hell away from
>the mob that drops the weapon that procs divine aura. He is
>unsnarable, so difficult to kite, and seems to be invincible most of
>the time. (And if I recall, continues to attack while invincible).
>Maybe a Wizard can mana burn him or something...I have no idea how you
>are supposed to kill him, and we stopped trying after the first two
>wipes.

He has (90% of the time) a Divine Aura proccing hammer as weapon. And
yes as a npc he can still attack while DAed. As long as he's not
hitting (and thus proccing) you can damage him. Normally we use a
kiter and loads of ranged damage to take him down. Wizzie with a flux
staff is great as kiter.

[Awsten_Tx]

I feel like you're just deliberately ignoring the logs and in-era evidence because you can't accept being wrong about this. Good thing nilbog can read and doesn't need your grandstanding.

You mean the logs citing 6 cast a second that turned out to be 2 wizards?

That also had a whole slew of logs showing 2 cast per seconds that were conveniently excluded
...

Or the number of people claiming "truth me bro" that dont even know logs mechanics.

But by all means, continue the personal attacks. I am sure that will prove your case.

[Vivitron]

You mean the logs citing 6 cast a second that turned out to be 2 wizards?

You just claimed you reviewed baakss links which include nov 2001 logs showing ~5 fluxes/second from a single wizard, so maybe those logs?

[Awsten_Tx]

You just claimed you reviewed baakss links which include nov 2001 logs showing ~5 fluxes/second from a single wizard, so maybe those logs?

how do you know they are from a single wizard? there is a shaman in the group casting malaisement. This is the kinda "trust me bro" garbage that goes on. Previously it was 6 cast per second when, oh wait, there were 2 wizards in the area.

there isnt an ounce of viable evidence the current function is classic. On the other hand we have 2 different patch notes, and heaps of logs, that show it should of been clickable about 2 or 3 times a second. no more.

[Wayward]

how do you know they are from a single wizard? there is a shaman in the group casting malaisement. This is the kinda "trust me bro" garbage that goes on. Previously it was 6 cast per second when, oh wait, there were 2 wizards in the area.

there isnt an ounce of viable evidence the current function is classic. On the other hand we have 2 different patch notes, and heaps of logs, that show it should of been clickable about 2 or 3 times a second. no more.

Where the hell did you come up with this angle that there was a shaman casting malaisement? That's a wild assumption, that the poster, who was the one who offered the logs, said was incorrect.

You are an idiot. You have proved to everyone here as much. Continue digging your hole, and continue doubling down. Moron.

[Awsten_Tx]

Where the hell did you come up with this angle that there was a shaman casting malaisement? That's a wild assumption, that the poster, who was the one who offered the logs, said was incorrect.

You are an idiot. You have proved to everyone here as much. Continue digging your hole, and continue doubling down. Moron.

Well there was a shaman in the group repeatedly casting it leading up to it /shrug. By all means, continue the personal attacks.

[Vivitron]

how do you know they are from a single wizard? there is a shaman in the group casting malaisement.

There's no shaman or even a group mentioned. The guy completes the quest, gates to bind, tests his new staff. https://www.project1999.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3518634&postcount=3

I agree the patch note is strong evidence that something was changed about the staff, but the logs support it being possible to flux 5x/second post patch, the forum posts support it being able to be cast while running post patch, the lack of forum posts complaining about a nerf (with one exception: a player without the staff, who was working on the quest when the patch was released) despite presence of forum posts highly praising it suggests that if there was a nerf it wasn't impactful. People who played wizards in era remember it being instant.

Your conclusion that it should work like the dain hammer is contradicted by the lack of a "Your Staff of Temperate Flux begins to glow." log message, which would be present if it worked like the dain hammer.

[Awsten_Tx]

There's no shaman or even a group mentioned. The guy completes the quest, gates to bind, tests his new staff. https://www.project1999.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3518634&postcount=3

I agree the patch note is strong evidence that something was changed about the staff, but the logs support it being possible to flux 5x/second post patch, the forum posts support it being able to be cast while running post patch, the lack of forum posts complaining about a nerf (with one exception: a player without the staff, who was working on the quest when the patch was released) despite presence of forum posts highly praising it suggests that if there was a nerf it wasn't impactful. People who played wizards in era remember it being instant.

Your conclusion that it should work like the dain hammer is contradicted by the lack of a "Your Staff of Temperate Flux begins to glow." log message, which would be present if it worked like the dain hammer.

Id be lying if I said I believe McVoy's log copy paste are genuine.

For 1 they have no citation, no log file, just a copy paste with no frame of reference before or after.

For 2. I struggle to hit 5 cast on P99. On top of that I get 4 or 5 "you cannot use that command right now" message per second when I do.

I find it hard to believe he was achieving that without those command losses.

I also find it doubtful he preserved his logs, then decided to use them as evidence, without posting g them.

He also happens to be the only individual producing logs from his PoV. No other log citation is from the wizard itself. They are all 3rd party observers. And every single other log reference, supports my theory.

[feniin]

Id be lying if I said I believe McVoy's log copy paste are genuine.

For 1 they have no citation, no log file, just a copy paste with no frame of reference before or after.

For 2. I struggle to hit 5 cast on P99. On top of that I get 4 or 5 "you cannot use that command right now" message per second when I do.

I find it hard to believe he was achieving that without those command losses.

I also find it doubtful he preserved his logs, then decided to use them as evidence, without posting g them.

He also happens to be the only individual producing logs from his PoV. No other log citation is from the wizard itself. They are all 3rd party observers. And every single other log reference, supports my theory.
Are you the cops? :confused: You've stated your case, man. Let the goblin sort it out.

[baakss]

how do you know they are from a single wizard? there is a shaman in the group casting malaisement. This is the kinda "trust me bro" garbage that goes on. Previously it was 6 cast per second when, oh wait, there were 2 wizards in the area.

there isnt an ounce of viable evidence the current function is classic. On the other hand we have 2 different patch notes, and heaps of logs, that show it should of been clickable about 2 or 3 times a second. no more.


You realize the how do you know's go both ways right?

How do you know that a log of a wizard hitting a target 3x per second is the theoretical maximum, and not just someone on a 56k modem with AOL dial-up with an entry level eMachine slow-spamming to avoid finger fatigue on their 1998 heavy, uncomfortable mechanical keyboard?

I find the idea that every log that has more than 3x hits per second to be a multiwizard scenario to be kind of farfetched. For what purpose would 2+ wizards be spamming the same target in each of those logs? That would seem like it should be the exception, rather than the assumed norm.

[Baugi]

I also find it doubtful he preserved his logs, then decided to use them as evidence, without posting g them.

Widely sharing your logs is obviously a privacy concern. He already mentioned providing them to the developers 3+ years ago so the final arbiters have what they need for authentication.

Skepticism is healthy. Attacking someone's credibility solely for providing evidence that doesn't fit your theory is not.

For 2. I struggle to hit 5 cast on P99. On top of that I get 4 or 5 "you cannot use that command right now" message per second when I do.

That seems perfectly consistent with all the logs provided? Again, it's ping based. Try pulling your connection mid-cast of a spell.

[Awsten_Tx]

Widely sharing your logs is obviously a privacy concern. He already mentioned providing them to the developers 3+ years ago so the final arbiters have what they need for authentication.

Skepticism is healthy. Attacking someone's credibility solely for providing evidence that doesn't fit your theory is not.



That seems perfectly consistent with all the logs provided? Again, it's ping based. Try pulling your connection mid-cast of a spell.

I provided reference for a patch note that indicates something isnt quite right with a mechanic. In fact I provided 2 patch notes indicating the same function of all activateable instant clicks had the same universal spell cast time to slow down the "spam".

Noone has refuted it with actual evidence, in fact when someone thought they had a gotcha of actual logs, it turned out to be untrue and supported my theory.

And in today's P99 client when i have a ping of 60ish, i struggle to hit 5 cast per second which generally includes a "you can't use" command between each attempt...

[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:30 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:30 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:30 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:30 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:30 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:30 2026] You feel uncomfortable.

His logs arent consistent with today's P99 client so I doubt they are accurate for 2001...

I understand the staff functionality is pretty heavily engrained in P99 culture, but its just not accurate.

With the short cast time indicated on the patch notes, you would still be able to use on the move, you would still be able to quickly check range (even though you can do this with literally every spell since range checks happen first), and you would still get 2 to 3 clicks per second in. However you wouldnt be able to click 4 to 5 times per second.

[feniin]

I provided reference for a patch note that indicates something isnt quite right with a mechanic. In fact I provided 2 patch notes indicating the same function of all activateable instant clicks had the same universal spell cast time to slow down the "spam".

Noone has refuted it with actual evidence, in fact when someone thought they had a gotcha of actual logs, it turned out to be untrue and supported my theory.

And in today's P99 client when i have a ping of 60ish, i struggle to hit 5 cast per second which generally includes a "you can't use" command between each attempt...

[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:29 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:30 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:30 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:30 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:30 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:30 2026] You can't use that command right now...
[Tue Apr 28 10:46:30 2026] You feel uncomfortable.

His logs arent consistent with today's P99 client so I doubt they are accurate for 2001...

I understand the staff functionality is pretty heavily engrained in P99 culture, but its just not accurate.

With the short cast time indicated on the patch notes, you would still be able to use on the move, you would still be able to quickly check range (even though you can do this with literally every spell since range checks happen first), and you would still get 2 to 3 clicks per second in. However you wouldnt be able to click 4 to 5 times per second.

Are you right clicking or pressing a button? Different systems handle that in the client.

[Vivitron]

His logs arent consistent with today's P99 client so I doubt they are accurate for 2001...

The log snippet is consistent with today's p99, though. You've just generated different output by pressing the button faster.

e.g. this is also p99:


[Fri May 08 14:56:45 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Fri May 08 14:56:45 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Fri May 08 14:56:45 2026] Your target resisted the LowerElement spell.
[Fri May 08 14:56:45 2026] You resist the LowerElement spell!
[Fri May 08 14:56:45 2026] Your target resisted the LowerElement spell.
[Fri May 08 14:56:45 2026] You resist the LowerElement spell!
[Fri May 08 14:56:45 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Fri May 08 14:56:46 2026] You feel uncomfortable.
[Fri May 08 14:56:46 2026] Your target resisted the LowerElement spell.
[Fri May 08 14:56:46 2026] You resist the LowerElement spell!
[Fri May 08 14:56:46 2026] Your target resisted the LowerElement spell.
[Fri May 08 14:56:46 2026] You resist the LowerElement spell!
[Fri May 08 14:56:46 2026] You can't use that command right now...


Edit: But, you're not contesting that the fluxes per second in your snippet and the Nov 2001 snippet are different, so what are we even doing at this point?

[Awsten_Tx]

The log snippet is consistent with today's p99, though. You've just generated different output by pressing the button faster.

e.g. this is also p99:



Edit: But, you're not contesting that the fluxes per second in your snippet and the Nov 2001 snippet are different, so what are we even doing at this point?

Thats my point, i am pressing the button or clicking (Both mechanisms produce the same output on my end) and the max i can get through is 5, but more commonly 4.

What I suspect the system does is only allowed 1 action per server confirmation. IE i send a command to "do action" the server has to accept that action and then send it back to me that I did it, before allowing another action.

This means that people with lower pings will be able to complete more actions per second on p99. such as fluxing.

On live, per the patch notes, there was a short cast time, similar to Tri Plated Hammer, you could hit the button as fast as you could, but with the cast time, it clamped it down to 2 or 3 actions per second max.

The entire thread has been vastly productive for drilling down what happened. I would of never thought to test dain hammer as a baseline for the "short cast time" but given its behavior, it seems like basically ALL activateable "instant" effects should behave the same way. Essentially have a short cast time that stops the spam. And the patch notes reflect this.

[Baugi]

Thats my point, i am pressing the button or clicking (Both mechanisms produce the same output on my end) and the max i can get through is 5, but more commonly 4.

What I suspect the system does is only allowed 1 action per server confirmation. IE i send a command to "do action" the server has to accept that action and then send it back to me that I did it, before allowing another action.

This means that people with lower pings will be able to complete more actions per second on p99. such as fluxing.

On live, per the patch notes, there was a short cast time, similar to Tri Plated Hammer, you could hit the button as fast as you could, but with the cast time, it clamped it down to 2 or 3 actions per second max.

The entire thread has been vastly productive for drilling down what happened. I would of never thought to test dain hammer as a baseline for the "short cast time" but given its behavior, it seems like basically ALL activateable "instant" effects should behave the same way. Essentially have a short cast time that stops the spam. And the patch notes reflect this.

In-era description claiming you can't use Hackle Hammer while moving, which is at odds with the already cited descriptions of using flux staff while running -

Effect Details: Cast time of 0 seconds (but it can't be cast while moving). The buff adds: +26 ac +150 hp +20 MR

Probably worth noting that the client-side check can reasonably be assumed classic, but movement interrupts are server-side and emulated.

At the risk of beating a dead horse, you still have credible in-era logs showing 4-5 casts of the flux staff in a second that you haven't been able to address. There's nothing sans patch note to indicate the behavior isn't classic. Patch notes were frequently misleading and never comprehensive.

[Vivitron]

Thats my point, i am pressing the button or clicking (Both mechanisms produce the same output on my end) and the max i can get through is 5, but more commonly 4.

This puts the flux rate on p99 at a rate consistent with the limited live logs, so perhaps I am still missing the point.

On live, per the patch notes, there was a short cast time, similar to Tri Plated Hammer, you could hit the button as fast as you could, but with the cast time, it clamped it down to 2 or 3 actions per second max.

The entire thread has been vastly productive for drilling down what happened. I would of never thought to test dain hammer as a baseline for the "short cast time" but given its behavior, it seems like basically ALL activateable "instant" effects should behave the same way. Essentially have a short cast time that stops the spam. And the patch notes reflect this.

Hopefully the devs have an in-era log of a dain hammer click to confirm, but no exceptions have been raised to the rule that non-instant clicks (like the dain hammer) have a "Your <item> begins to glow." message but instant clicks do not.

The lack of this message in the log history for the flux staff is yet another piece of evidence that the flux staff remained instant and did not work like the dain hammer.

[Awsten_Tx]

This puts the flux rate on p99 at a rate consistent with the limited live logs, so perhaps I am still missing the point.



Hopefully the devs have an in-era log of a dain hammer click to confirm, but no exceptions have been raised to the rule that non-instant clicks (like the dain hammer) have a "Your <item> begins to glow." message but instant clicks do not.

The lack of this message in the log history for the flux staff is yet another piece of evidence that the flux staff remained instant and did not work like the dain hammer.

Again, i have not seen log files from the perspective of the wizard. And also, none of the logs I have reviewed (from other party perspectives) are consistent with P99 click rates. the 1 instance in 1 log that shows 5 clicks per second, just so happens to be missing a full second of log entries AFTER the log messages and that is with a shaman casting malaisment. So from my standpoint, the logs provided thus far show a pretty consistent 2 or 3 clicks max input.

[Vivitron]

Again, i have not seen log files from the perspective of the wizard. And also, none of the logs I have reviewed (from other party perspectives) are consistent with P99 click rates. the 1 instance in 1 log that shows 5 clicks per second, just so happens to be missing a full second of log entries AFTER the log messages and that is with a shaman casting malaisment. So from my standpoint, the logs provided thus far show a pretty consistent 2 or 3 clicks max input.

We've been over this. The logs from the wizard's perspective with no shaman mentioned show ~5/second: https://www.project1999.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3518634&postcount=3

[Awsten_Tx]

they arent log files, they are a copy pasta. 21 years after the fact, on a thread generated on the exact same topic...

[Baugi]

they arent log files, they are a copy pasta. 21 years after the fact, on a thread generated on the exact same topic...

I feel obligated to reiterate that it's completely inappropriate to claim someone is fabricating evidence when they already provided sources to the developers, but moving on.

For reference -


[Mon Jul 02 00:52:17 2001] Reethon tells the group, 'I am feigning off an enthralled bulthar.'
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:17 2001] Reethon says, 'WARNING, Monk feigning off an enthralled bulthar.'
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:20 2001] Yath tells the group, 'damn right.'
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:23 2001] Reethon tells the group, 'hahah'
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:24 2001] an enthralled bulthar was hit by non-melee for 5 points of damage.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:25 2001] An enthralled bulthar was pierced by thorns.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:25 2001] An enthralled bulthar gores YOU for 107 points of damage.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:33 2001] an enthralled bulthar was hit by non-melee for 5 points of damage.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:33 2001] An enthralled bulthar was pierced by thorns.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:33 2001] An enthralled bulthar gores YOU for 49 points of damage.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:37 2001] Brahamamamma begins to cast a spell.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:39 2001] An enthralled bulthar staggers from a blow to the head.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:39 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:39 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:40 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:40 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:41 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:41 2001] an enthralled bulthar was hit by non-melee for 5 points of damage.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:41 2001] An enthralled bulthar was pierced by thorns.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:41 2001] An enthralled bulthar gores YOU for 107 points of damage.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:41 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:41 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:42 2001] An enthralled bulthar looks uncomfortable.
[Mon Jul 02 00:52:44 2001] Geneshami begins to cast a spell.

...

[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] Players on EverQuest:
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] ---------------------------
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [54 Disciple] Reethon (Human) <Order of Reverence>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [ANONYMOUS] Brahamamamma <Phoenix Crusaders>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [58 Beguiler] Ikabod (High Elf) <The Grey Legion>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [ANONYMOUS] Aeawen [DRUID]
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [60 Crusader] Ajoo (High Elf) <The Grey Legion>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [57 Templar] Purity (High Elf) <The Grey Legion>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [54 Minstrel] Karah (Wood Elf) <The Grey Legion>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [52 Disciple] Yath (Human) <United Norrath Coalition>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [54 Mystic] Geneshami (Barbarian) <Order of Reverence>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [51 Champion] Gimme (Ogre) <United Norrath Coalition>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [53 Champion] Macleod (Barbarian) <The Grey Legion>
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] [ANONYMOUS] Etha <United Norrath Coalition> [DRUID]
[Mon Jul 02 01:55:32 2001] There are 12 players in Siren's Grotto.

the 1 instance in 1 log that shows 5 clicks per second, just so happens to be missing a full second of log entries AFTER the log messages

This is meaningless. One second gaps in events are extremely common, particularly with melee filtered.

and that is with a shaman casting malaisment. So from my standpoint, the logs provided thus far show a pretty consistent 2 or 3 clicks max input.

I already snipped the context for you, the shaman is not casting. Even if he was, that would still leave four casts in that second.

You've also yet to explain several other obvious examples already provided, e.g. -


[Thu Jul 05 20:05:08 2001] Taluil tells the group, 'Tashed sebilite guardian'
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:08 2001] Taluil begins to cast a spell.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:09 2001] Sebilite guardian was pierced by thorns.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:09 2001] Sebilite guardian was pierced by thorns.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:09 2001] Sebilite guardian glances nervously about.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:10 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:14 2001] Taluil tells the group, 'sebilite guardian is being SLOOOOWWWWWWEDDDDDDD!!'
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:14 2001] Taluil begins to cast a spell.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:17 2001] You tell your party, 'Casting Fixation of Ro (debuff) on sebilite guardian!'
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:18 2001] You begin casting Fixation of Ro.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:20 2001] Your target resisted the Fixation of Ro spell.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:20 2001] Iliana begins to cast a spell.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:21 2001] Taluil tells the group, 'sebilite guardian is being SLOOOOWWWWWWEDDDDDDD!!'
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:22 2001] Taluil begins to cast a spell.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:23 2001] Taluil's casting is interrupted!
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:24 2001] Bridgecrusher Scores a critical hit!(49)
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:26 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:26 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:27 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:27 2001] Taluil begins to cast a spell.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:27 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:27 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:27 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:28 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:28 2001] Sebilite guardian is stunned by scintillating colors.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:28 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:28 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:28 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:28 2001] You tell your party, 'Healing Taluil!'
[Thu Jul 05 20:05:28 2001] Sebilite guardian looks uncomfortable.

[Wayward]

Just ignore Awsten_TX, he fuckin sucks.

[Decad]

https://thedruidsgrove.org/archive/eq/t-3108.html


Palarran
07-03-2003, 01:11 AM
Nope, non-wizards can't use the staff of temperate flux.
lucy.fnord.net/item.html?id=6342 (http://lucy.fnord.net/item.html?id=6342)
"Effect: LowerElement (Any Slot/Can Equip, Casting Time: Instant)"
The "Any Slot/Can Equip" bit means it's usable from inventory only by races and classes listed.

Compare Guise of the Deceiver (clickable from inventory by anyone) with Mask of Deception (clickable from inventory only by bards and rogues):
lucy.fnord.net/item.html?id=2469 (http://lucy.fnord.net/item.html?id=2469)
lucy.fnord.net/item.html?id=2472 (http://lucy.fnord.net/item.html?id=2472)