Wrath of Nature missing snare effect.

[M.Bison]

Druid epic click is supposed to have a snare that stacks with root as well as a dot, it was removed in 2002 in luclin.

2002-09-04 11:33 Removed Slot 2: Decrease Movement by 11% (L1) to 62% (L52)

http://lucy.allakhazam.com/spellhist...26&source=Live

[Nirgon]

Valid

[kanras]

Fixed, pending update.

[Fountree]

.

[M.Bison]

Dot and snare off the epic and all roots should stack w/o any complication

[Fountree]

After patch, the snare effect of Wrath of Nature is not stacking with root as intended. This renders it virtually worthless. Is there any indication or info saying that the snare component of wrath of nature did NOT stack with root on epic release? Because there is a load of information confirming that the snare and dot components of wrath of nature stacked with root on live. Here's one early example I could find, doing more research later today:

From Allakhazam:

# Feb 08 2002 at 2:25 AM Rating: Excellent
Lenore

"Recently acquired mine, YAY me.
I love the snare and DoT it has. I notice the HP of mobs do drop quicker when rooted. And, I amazed myself when I decided to melee the mob when he was near death and on the run. I hit him for 70 points of damage.
Was rather cool to see me hit harder than 33 with my Runed Falchion, but to see hits in the 50's, 60's, and then an even 70, blew my mind. Made my partner laugh when I said I was a Battledruid. He is a Paladin, and he says he will let me do all the work now. hehe."

[Fountree]

If you look above, Minyin said in his OP that the snare, which was missing before, should stack with root. I mean, what would be the utility of a 9.0 second cast time snare if it didn't stack with root? Plus, the running damage of the snare severely decreases the effect's damage (55 to 36)

[M.Bison]

=(

[kanras]

Wrath of Nature had snare effect in same effect slot as all roots. Root blocked/overwrote all snares due to them sharing an effect type prior to 01/09/2001, thus you couldn't stack epic and root.

[M.Bison]

thus you couldn't stack epic and root.

Thus epic dot will only ever do 66% of its total damage in a solo situation?

[http://home.comcast.net/~aviendha/druid_epic.html] seems to imply epic snare effect stacking with root

[http://thedruidsgrove.org/archive/eq/t-3744.html] - also implies the snare stacking with root.
(Milesgond - "why would you want snare removed on epic??"
1. the dot could then be used on unsnarable mobs
2. the level 29 ensnare lasts longer anyway
3. the epic would be resisted less often
4. you could root-dot without fear of snare wearing off
) He is pointing out that you could not Ensnare a NPC that had Wrath of Nature on it, but you could root them (with the added hassle of Wrath of Nature only being a 3min snare, you would have to watch out for WoN breaks before root breaks.)

[kanras]

Well, unless you're animal fear kiting or charming, yes. I'm not claiming it makes sense from a design perspective, that's just what we know about the relationship between spells that modify movement speed.

[Daldaen]

Without a charmed pet yes.

[kanras]

Minyin, that druidsgrove post is a year and a half after the root/snare stacking change.

[Daldaen]

Well... Actually...

http://home.comcast.net/~aviendha/druid_epic.html

It is nice in that it costs no mana, and the DoT cast from this weapon stacks with ALL OTHER SPELLS in the game (yes, even ALL other druid DoTs). And the snare effect is even stackable with root, so when your root wears off, the mob is still snared. Anyway, that's just my two coppers. You may very well find yourself welcome in many groups becaues of the pleasant way you sprinkle leaves atop your party-members' heads. (unless you're a halfling!)

The way this is written it is as though it was unique in its ability to stack with root. Using "even stackable with root". The problem is there is no time period on the site.

[Ele]

The earliest entry the wayback machine has for that site is October 2003 :(

http://web.archive.org/web/20031015090945/http://home.comcast.net/~aviendha/druid_epic.html

[Xanthias]

Didn't the snare/root stacking issues end before epics?
iirc that was a goof that only lasted a month

[Fountree]

Ok, lets say youre right about snare overwriting root until 1/09/2001 (any evidence of this would be appreciated). Thats only a few months after epics were released. But anyway, if we consider that maybe, just maybe the epic didnt stack with root...it was only the case for a short while. Want to just give the druids the benefit of the doubt considering what a pain it is getting it on this server? Lolz

[Deanob]

I know for a fact that there was never an issue with snare/root stack on the druid epic from release.
I believe the snare and root stack problem was solved before hand.

Either way this epic is 100% useless I don't remember it being like this on live.

[Zapatos]

epics were released September 19, 2000 http://everquest.allakhazam.com/history/patches-2000-2.html

"The first Druid epic (1.0) was obtained on the Mithanial Marr server by Sobe Silvertree of the guild Afterlife."
Wednesday November 15, 2000 (just weeks before velious came out)
http://www.afterlifeguild.org/template.cgi?page=index_jun_dec00

January 9, 2001 3:00 am
*Root and Snare*
Root-type spells and "snare" type spells now use a separate spell
effect. http://everquest.allakhazam.com/history/patches-2001-1.html

That's a stupidly small window to be able to find any real evidence (or evidence thereof). But just since this thread is missing links to work off of I decided to post that. I'll try to help look when I've got more free time.

[Fountree]

IMO not enough info available atm to validate the new changes to the effect.

[Deanob]

IMO not enough info available atm to validate the new changes to the effect.

Either way... were boned until next patch which could be months away.

[Daldaen]

In the mean time send all Pods of Seawater and Pulsating Green Stones to Daldaen!

[Aquelin]

http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=38415&page=11

As shown by posts in other threads, the dot damage nerf is here to stay for the stated lifespan of the server. The root/snare not stacking will be removed a little bit after velious.

If the mechanics are slated to stay the way they are currently, well, :(.

[Deanob]

http://www.project1999.org/forums/showthread.php?t=38415&page=11



If the mechanics are slated to stay the way they are currently, well, :(.

Not a relevant post.
The Druid epic was a dot that had a snare effect. It was never a snare with a dot effect.
It was a different mechanism completely.

Bottom line is on live it never got overwritten by Root. Period.

[Aquelin]

Not a relevant post.
The Druid epic was a dot that had a snare effect. It was never a snare with a dot effect.
It was a different mechanism completely.

Bottom line is on live it never got overwritten by Root. Period.

Not disagreeing with you, only going off of kanras' post claiming that it shared the same snare effect slot for root and thus adhering to the same root/snare mechanics that are already in place. If it's going to stay that way until Velious is released here, then that is quite unfortunate for epic druids. Hopefully more evidence can be brought forth to show this was not the case on live.

[Aquelin]

epics were released September 19, 2000 http://everquest.allakhazam.com/history/patches-2000-2.html

"The first Druid epic (1.0) was obtained on the Mithanial Marr server by Sobe Silvertree of the guild Afterlife."
Wednesday November 15, 2000 (just weeks before velious came out)
http://www.afterlifeguild.org/template.cgi?page=index_jun_dec00

January 9, 2001 3:00 am
*Root and Snare*
Root-type spells and "snare" type spells now use a separate spell
effect. http://everquest.allakhazam.com/history/patches-2001-1.html

That's a stupidly small window to be able to find any real evidence (or evidence thereof). But just since this thread is missing links to work off of I decided to post that. I'll try to help look when I've got more free time.

Bump. Can we get any insight as to whether this will be changed soon (next patch perhaps?) according to timeline, and not shortly after velious as quoted in the other post?

[Fountree]

Bump on this thread. Fact is, druids on live only had a 1-2 month window TOPS where epic click didn't stack with root. We may be looking at a full year where this isn't implemented on P99 according to what Kanras has said previous. If we're truly going to wait until after velious to implement a change on Wrath of Nature because it's being lumped in with all other root/snare stack issues (not really evidence the epic was affected by this mechanic), then druids here are getting the short end of the stick. I mean, I can live with it I guess, and bumping mainly in hopes someone can find/add some additional evidence to shed more light on this!

[Daldaen]

Bump on this thread. Fact is, druids on live only had a 1-2 month window TOPS where epic click didn't stack with root. We may be looking at a full year where this isn't implemented on P99 according to what Kanras has said previous. If we're truly going to wait until after velious to implement a change on Wrath of Nature because it's being lumped in with all other root/snare stack issues (not really evidence the epic was affected by this mechanic), then druids here are getting the short end of the stick. I mean, I can live with it I guess, and bumping mainly in hopes someone can find/add some additional evidence to shed more light on this!

This...

In the mean time send all Pods of Seawater and Pulsating Green Stones to Daldaen!

And this also please.

[Happyfeet]

Bump on this thread. Fact is, druids on live only had a 1-2 month window TOPS where epic click didn't stack with root. We may be looking at a full year where this isn't implemented on P99 according to what Kanras has said previous. If we're truly going to wait until after velious to implement a change on Wrath of Nature because it's being lumped in with all other root/snare stack issues (not really evidence the epic was affected by this mechanic), then druids here are getting the short end of the stick. I mean, I can live with it I guess, and bumping mainly in hopes someone can find/add some additional evidence to shed more light on this!

I will agree with this.
I was a druid on live with an epic (I got mine before Velious, late Kunark, bc pods were MUCH more rare on live), and I don't remember having problems with it stacking with root. I only remember it not stacking with Necro epic, it overrode snare/darkness lines.

[baub]

Could we also have revamped planes and other cool shit that velious brought, before actually releasing velious?

[Fountree]

Would you like to show evidence that this change on WoN mechanics happened post-velious Baub? Or do you just want to troll a legitimate bug thread discussion? I believe you'd prefer the latter.

[baub]

Oh sorry, I was under the assumption to get something changed you needed to provide sufficient evidence to support it, rather than just crying and pleading "BUT I REMEMBERS"

[Fountree]

Baub I actually agree completely. Problem is, we're talking about a 6-week window on live in 2000-2001 when this was *POSSIBLY* an issue. EQ was moving very fast at the time and there is an absence of information about the mechanics of WoN due to this very short time frame. After scouring the internet, you'll find there's little concrete evidence for anyone's opinion on the matter here, including Kanras's. Therefore, I believe some weight should be given to those who actually obtained and used their leafblower prior to the 1/9/2001 patch and remember how it worked. That is all!

[Johncoffeey]

Bumping.. I remember having druid epic on live aswell.. maybe 1 month before velious came out.. and wasnt a problem at that time for sure.. with root/snare .. but also remember there was a problem with necro's epic / druid epic that woulnt stack.. Not sure if the issue is patched since i havent had luck getting my epic yet.. But if not.. i guess the poor druids who already have it.. have suffered enough.. Make that change :)

[Crazyeye]

Bumping for the year and 3 months anniversary of this thread

Make that change :)

[Nirgon]

You will have to wait for Velious

[kenzar]

Bumping for the year and 3 months anniversary of this thread

You're most welcome Druids of P99. Rest assured your epic is quite classic. No thanks necessary.