Shaman - Nec/Sk/? Dungeon Duo

[Fame]

From what I've seen, yet another..

Hi, I started here a few weeks ago and talked a friend into joining too. We're going to be lvling duo with a Shaman/X. From a general stand point, we chose shaman because what we read lead us to believe that the shaman/x is one of the more powerful crawlers. Is that the case? We would like to be able at the endgame, to duo some of the harder/(greedy) camps and kill named mobs.

Do we go Necro or SK? We're both new but have a general understanding of game mechanics, is root-rot goin to be our bread and butter? Would the SK be better here in the long run if not?

Is there a better option? I don't know if we have what it takes for a charm style duo. Not sure if Enc is a no-go, maybe. How is Mage/Nec? On the Nec/Nec I have seen, do the dots stack? Is nec outta the picture for dungeons? Do we throw a druid in the mix? Not min/maxers but we would like to be faster than say a war/clr but the main preference is ease, meaning, less running around, more taking the hits or rooting.


Bottom line, like everyone else here, we want to go deep. In dungeons. Is this the combo for us?

Thanks for any input! Oh and on a side but important note, we would like to be able to eventually twink some melee alts. So any camps that might have the more expensive items that we would want could also be taken into consideration for the duo.



TL;DR
The goal: Duo from 1-60 w/ occasional groups. With the majority of exp coming from dungeon crawls. Shaman/SK or Shaman/Nec or Shaman/X?

[Slave]

I think that Ogre Shaman / Ogre SK is one of the most powerful duos possible in EverQuest. Not only is the SK the most powerful and most effective experience tank, they are superb pullers. The Shaman is viable forever as a healer because Slow line is so wickedly overpowered, and they only continue to increase in power.

For two characters that won't be doing much solo time, and will be supporting each other in groups, you can't really ask for a better duo.

SK attributes: 75 Agility and the rest into Stamina
Shaman attributes: 75 Agility and the rest into Stamina, then a tiny pittance into Wisdom.

[Deverell]

Shaman/necro will be easier much of the way and will do pretty well for most purposes, but there are times when you'll need a real tank. If you want to duo high-end stuff and be as flexible as you can with regards to where you can do, I'd pick SK. It'll also be a lot easier to form groups when you want to, tanks are in short supply while necros aren't a crucial part of any group. You'd level faster with the necro, you'll be able to do more with the SK. There's also much better synergy that way because most of the shaman's power is centered around melee buffs.

[somnia]

I've boxed shaman/monk on live during classic era with excellent results. Monks take damage well enough (especially if shaman has slowed mob) but dish out damage much better than an SK.

Mileage may vary here.

[Wudan]

Shaman & Shadow Knight is the best option here, no doubt about that. You will need SKs tanking skills in the end game.

[webrunner5]

Yeah, but doesn't SK Diease Cloud agro go by by in Velious?? Making a Paladin a better Tank agro wise.

[falkun]

SHM+MNK is stupidly OP combo. Its pretty much the go-to dual box combo (which translates well to 2 players as well). SHM+NEC won't be as tanky, but much more offensive. Where SHM+MNK will be tanking, SHM+NEC will root+rot.

[fischsemmel]

Yep, just here to echo the whole "shaman+monk is best for what you want to do, though shaman+sk will work very well also, and while shaman+necro is pretty powerful it is not going to do as well overall in dungeons."

[godbox]

I think that Ogre Shaman / Ogre SK is one of the most powerful duos possible in EverQuest. Not only is the SK the most powerful and most effective experience tank, they are superb pullers. The Shaman is viable forever as a healer because Slow line is so wickedly overpowered, and they only continue to increase in power.

For two characters that won't be doing much solo time, and will be supporting each other in groups, you can't really ask for a better duo.

SK attributes: 75 Agility and the rest into Stamina
Shaman attributes: 75 Agility and the rest into Stamina, then a tiny pittance into Wisdom.

pretty accurate except for the sham stats http://wiki.project1999.org/index.php/Shaman
read that pretty much explains why wis>sta

You cant go wrong with sta and I wont get into debate over it since both are viable but I got an ogre sham I went with wis I dont regret it at all where my gear is now my sta will be max once I get the last stam buff upgrade and my wis is like 145 I think. I never have mana problems. and sit around 1800hp self buffed atm and about same for mana.
sham gear hp>ac>mana>wis>sta for gear
sta wis rant over

frew things from my experience being that necro/sham/sk are the 3 classes I have so far played extensively here and on live. necro/sham have some overlap of poison and dot spells.

if speed is a factor at all your gonna feel that exp penalty hard the whole way duod with sk over necro from the penalty (which if you are coming from modern mmos do not scoff at it does suck and is super noticable although mitigated if duoing mostly).

I duo with necros more frequently than sks on my sham because (and this wont apply as much 55+ I guess) we can pass mana and or life back and forth to each other at really nice rates whereas with a SK no matter what you do when they oom they oom and they're not damage dealers like necros are so auto attack (while decent with sham buffs) is gonna be unimpressive. Conversely paired with a sham a necro pet should be able to tank any slowed mob (exceptions exist im sure) just fine without an exp penalty and definetly an increased kill rate.

If a mob is rooted which it should be SKs amazing holding abilities go out the window leaving you with waaaay worse FD puller than a monk who does waaaaay worse dmg than a monk. Id take monk/sham over sk or necro tbh it really is broken how well they pair.

[Tuffpuppy]

I vote for Shaman + Monk. With slow, the monk can tank pretty much anything leveling up. Monk brings a lot to the group, and mend can save you if needed. Also if you are planning on staying a while, Monks become super strong in Velious.

[Destan]

I came to p99 from Fippy on live, and I can safely say nothing is a better duo with a Shaman than a monk. My buddy and I were stupidly dominant, offering the best of everything. Buffs, debuffs, heals, pet, amazing dps, and amazing pulling. The SK is a good option as well, but it breaks down to:

SK does less damage, his FD is not as reliable as a monks, and adds a pretty heavy xp penalty to your setup.

The monk tends to be safer, kill faster (faster killing speeds means more xp per hour, less healing required) and until the post-Velious Monk nerf can tank as well if not better in circumstances than a SK.

Monk if you are a min/maxing all-about-efficiency type, SK if it's not a big deal and your buddy prefers that class. You definetly want a melee over a caster, make that haste buff work for you!

[Wotsirb401]

I currently duo Crypt and other high end camps with a shaman. All we do is slow, pet tanks and torpor/dot. Some kills can take a while if they are healers since we have minimal ways to stop it . The upside is we never run out of mana so downtime is based on the player needing to go to the bathroom etc.

[Wudan]

I came to p99 from Fippy on live, and I can safely say nothing is a better duo with a Shaman than a monk. My buddy and I were stupidly dominant, offering the best of everything. Buffs, debuffs, heals, pet, amazing dps, and amazing pulling. The SK is a good option as well, but it breaks down to:

SK does less damage, his FD is not as reliable as a monks, and adds a pretty heavy xp penalty to your setup.

The monk tends to be safer, kill faster (faster killing speeds means more xp per hour, less healing required) and until the post-Velious Monk nerf can tank as well if not better in circumstances than a SK.

Monk if you are a min/maxing all-about-efficiency type, SK if it's not a big deal and your buddy prefers that class. You definetly want a melee over a caster, make that haste buff work for you!

monk will never have the tanking ability of SK. While its all good when fighting regular mobs, it is a different story when pulling high lvl named. SK is better for end game duo with shammy.

tanking ability > dps

[somnia]

monk will never have the tanking ability of SK. While its all good when fighting regular mobs, it is a different story when pulling high lvl named. SK is better for end game duo with shammy.

tanking ability > dps

If it can be slowed then it can probably be killed solo by the shaman. A monk just helps you get there faster.

If it can't be slowed than an SK won't do much good with a shaman healer.

[Wudan]

If it can be slowed then it can probably be killed solo by the shaman. A monk just helps you get there faster.

If it can't be slowed than an SK won't do much good with a shaman healer.

This is simply not true. Slow is nice and helps a lot, but its not everything, especialy when engaging named mobs. Thinking shaman can solo stuff he can slow is just silly. In most cases, shamans cant take damage from high end named dungeon mobs. Also, shaman is not cleric... HoT is cool, but on long named fights shaman will be in pain healing monk.

These guys want to take on named mobs in dungeons, SK is the best option, end of story. More hp, better aggro management, much better tanking abilities.

It does not matter his dmg is lower then monks, what matters is whether he can TANK the mob long enough to kill it. He can certainly do that better then monk.

[Speedling]

This is simply not true. Slow is nice and helps a lot, but its not everything, especialy when engaging named mobs. Thinking shaman can solo stuff he can slow is just silly. In most cases, shamans cant take damage from high end named dungeon mobs. Also, shaman is not cleric... HoT is cool, but on long named fights shaman will be in pain healing monk.

These guys want to take on named mobs in dungeons, SK is the best option, end of story. More hp, better aggro management, much better tanking abilities.

It does not matter his dmg is lower then monks, what matters is whether he can TANK the mob long enough to kill it. He can certainly do that better then monk.

List a name that a sk can tank and a shm can't imo. Shm > sks np.

[falkun]

There is also data parses out there suggesting monk avoidance is on par or better than tank mitigation for damage taken.

[somnia]

There is also data parses out there suggesting monk avoidance is on par or better than tank mitigation for damage taken.

This + I doubt a shaman and SK will be able to duo many mobs that the shaman couldn't solo.

[webrunner5]

A Ogre Shaman that can slow the mob is a hell of a tank and can kill solo pretty much everything high end but raid mobs, even if it summons. No SK is going to do that solo. Slow is one of the best spells in this game for toe to toe killing.

[Wudan]

List a name that a sk can tank and a shm can't imo. Shm > sks np.

reading comprehension ftw

[Wudan]

This + I doubt a shaman and SK will be able to duo many mobs that the shaman couldn't solo.

How about Black Dire, which is part of shaman epic quest? Shaman can't solo it, but he could duo it with SK ... or monk

Just an example....there is many more out there. Pre-PoP pre-aa's shaman can't solo high end named mobs as well as you might have thought...

[tristantio]

SHM/NEC can always heal a necro pet also on a tough mob pull (not to mention NEC can charm against UD).

With FD the nec can lay on an array of dots as well and not worry about agro.

[godbox]

it goes in order of bestiness
sham/nec
sham/monk
sham/biggslick
sham/sk

[Glasken]

+1 for shm+nec.

Fantastic duo. Roting, pet tanking, kiting. It's all good.

[Deverell]

Yeah, but doesn't SK Diease Cloud agro go by by in Velious?? Making a Paladin a better Tank agro wise.

You just use Clinging Darkness by then. It's almost as good and more than enough. Any class with a spammable high-aggro spell can hold aggro from anyone who isn't actively trying to take it. Think of it like this:

You need 100 TPS (threat per second) to hold aggro from anyone who isn't trying to overtake you.

You can generate 400 TPS with DC if you want to.

You can generate 300 TPS with CD if you want to.

(numbers are examples)

Basically, any caster class can effortlessly hold aggro against anybody who isn't trying to out-aggro. Even a wizard could chain snare/stun, and a magician could chain malwhatever.

[godbox]

you dont need to generate agro in a duo since all duos have some form of crowd control in the necro/sham you just root everything and slow then sick pet on em.

SK gets to look more badass than necro (unless they got lich illusion) thats about it as far as the duo benefit you dont need a "tank" for a duo just a way to not take damage/recover life which SK doesnt add anything that a monk can bring. not that tanks arnt important for taking on mobs that a duo wont tackle but if a duo can do it the sk isnt gonna make or break it.

[Broot]

Don't forget to play what's the most fun for you guys. Min / max = monk. But none of the classes you listed are bad at all, just not the tryhardbest.

[godbox]

Don't forget to play what's the most fun for you guys. Min / max = monk. But none of the classes you listed are bad at all, just not the tryhardbest.

qft

and

gear needs to be considered for new players

monks (not sure how they got brought in to sk/necro comparison)= gear dependent to be wtfpwnd although thats severely mitigated by being paired with sham stats/hp/ac/100% weight bags/haste/regen/mr is all the gear youd need as a monk you can get geared on a budget at that point some wus and any combo of 1h and 2hb to keep skills up until you can get an ifs or something

SK = also very gear dependent moreso than monk imo since they will need good weps/shield/armor +hp +mana

necro=not gear dependent at all and even moreso since regen/hp buffs = mana


one final point from me since im bored:
in the sham/sk duo who is doing the damage? is SK just burning through mana and needing to med after everyfight to keep dps up or is sham having to take on doting ontop of slowing so all SK ends up bringing to the table is a way mana inefficient root in the form of agro thats gonna need heals and buffs.

[mwatt]

Although there is a rediculous amount of overlap, an Enchanter might be considered the most useful dungeon companion for a Shaman. The thing that is most missing from a Chanter is some way to heal, which the Shaman provides. With the Chanter you get:

* The best possible CC
* Charmed mob for tanking/dps
* Clarity or C2 (anybody who thinks Canni obviates C2 is wrong)

[tristantio]

Necro also can feed shaman mana while enjoying the chloroplast :D

[Daldaen]

Any duo combo without an Enchanter is wrong with charm being in Pre-Luclin/PoP Charm nerf era.

[Supaskillz]

I vote for sham+monk if you are open to any duo. Sham + sk is my vote if you are determined to be either necro or sk for the duo. I think more often than not you want to just tank the mobs and its better to sk tank than pet tank. The major upside to necro vs sk or monk I think is that if you are just starting here you will not be very gear dependent as a sham or necro but the melee classes are very much so.

[endemictruth]

Yeah, but doesn't SK Diease Cloud agro go by by in Velious?? Making a Paladin a better Tank agro wise.

Psst.... disease cloud is -not- our best aggro spell.

Not even close.

I'll leave it to you to figure out what is.

[Deverell]

Fear :D

[Kevlar]

Although there is a rediculous amount of overlap, an Enchanter might be considered the most useful dungeon companion for a Shaman. The thing that is most missing from a Chanter is some way to heal, which the Shaman provides. With the Chanter you get:

* The best possible CC
* Charmed mob for tanking/dps
* Clarity or C2 (anybody who thinks Canni obviates C2 is wrong)

But then you might as well go druid for the added utility and ensnare. Too much overlap with shm and ench. They are both good classes, just not as good together since they do a lot of the same things.

[fischsemmel]

But then you might as well go druid for the added utility and ensnare. Too much overlap with shm and ench. They are both good classes, just not as good together since they do a lot of the same things.

You be wrong.

The only overlap between the classes are root (oh noes, two classes that can root instead of just one), slow (and shaman slow is way, way better), and haste (and enchanter haste is way, way better).

Enchanter is on pet duty, CC, c2, tash.
Shaman is on pet buff+heal duty, slow, maybe a bit of help rooting, malo on pets and mobs alike, and contributes extra dps with his pet and maybe some dots/clickies.

Super strong combo, yo. I would think it is as strong as a cleric+enchanter, just that you have a stronger pet and a better slow instead of hp buffs, ranged stuns, and CH.

[sabinrf24]

Shaman / Enc is great - some of my best charm duo experiences have been with a good Shaman.

If both characters had infinite mana, there would be some tangible overlap, but with the shaman slowing and healing (and pulling depending on where you are), the Enchanter can focus on charm, root, tash, CC, haste, etc.

Also, Shaman with C/C2 paired with Canni is exceptionally efficient to have around.

-Jahno

[Autotune]

Shaman + Necro is the better choice. You have a ton more possibilities with this combo than a shaman with a SK or Monk.

The kill curve for doing some names will be higher than doing it with an SK or Monk, but necro and shaman team is less dependent on gear than the other 2 combos.

If you want the greatest potential, go with Shaman and Necro. If you want an easier time with not many things to worry about, go with Shaman + SK or even Shaman + Monk.


if it was just between the Monk and SK, I would go with with the SK. Personal preference tbh, but they definitely have more possibilities on what you can do with an SK compared with a Monk.

Monk and Shaman is probably the easiest combination to get the hang of, but also somewhat limited on what you can and can't do.

Monk will definitely shine more in velious unless they get totally screwed up.

BTW, on the note about Shaman + Enchanter. While that combo is good for grinding, it isn't so great for doing the higher end named mobs. Shaman's can't use Torpor on charmed pets and most of the time Enchanters don't want to be getting wacked by high end named mobs. It's definitely viable but far more risky than Shaman + Necro.