Should not be able to complete epics before 45

[Nirgon]

Starting evidence:

http://thedruidsgrove.org/archive/eq/t-2458.html

At 44 I got a response about 'proving myself to the cause' or something like that. Did some muffins and bat wings, came back, and got 'too young for this task'. Tried at 45, still got the 'too young' message. At 46 he started resonding normally.

So ~ my assumptions were that the first message I got about proving dedication were a faction issue, the second about being too young was a level issue.

Sounds like it has indeed been changed -- all my turn ins so far have been fine at level 47. :)


I know for a fact that the wizard epic mob, Camin, would not accept the note until you were at least lvl 45.

There's more elsewhere on this. I'll add to it as I am able to find it.

Note: If you ever saw someone running around with epics before this on live, they were delvled/sac'd after obtaining it.

[Sundawg]

I have a level 15 monk on EQmac with monk epic. I am sure I could of done it at level one. Not sure about the other epics.

[Bamzal Sherbet]

i recall shaman epic being cocked blocked at the boot quest until a high lvl like 46 or even 50/51

[Nirgon]

Well if someone can do the druid epic at lvl 15 there, that will invalidate EQ mac as being a good source for this one.

Same deal with wizard.

[heartbrand]

Here's a random comment from allakhazam dunno how accurate:


Cannot begin until Level 50
QuoteReply
# Jul 27 2011 at 4:09 PM Rating: Decent
AudacityoftheFeralkin
*
76 posts
You CANNOT get your Ragebringer until level 50. You can still get the items...but don't bother with any of the dialogues/turn-ins until level 50. I wasted an hour running around Catacombs trying to find Malka to begin it, just to have her tell me to take a hike. (Level 46)

[heartbrand]

Here's a post from EQMAC:

Illicit
Post subject: Re: Rogue Epic - Is it worth it?
PostPosted: Thu Nov 24, 2011 5:51 pm
Offline
Member

Joined: Mon Feb 06, 2006 7:37 am
Posts: 159
Location: New York City
Darco,

You need to be 50 to start the quest, though technically a level 50+ toon can summon Stanos for you, but it's touch & go as to whether a sub-50 toon can complete the handins (I've heard he'll eat handins from under-levelled toons). Just get to 50 if you want to be safe.

The General has dropped ONE Quill that I know of on AK, so start farming robes early and often instead.

You'll need the General's Pouch, JDD, and Quill to complete the quest. Little else really matters. A reliable walkthrough I've used can be found HERE. I start with the pickpocketing of notes, and go from there.

Hope that helps.

http://www.eqmac.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=10887

[heartbrand]

this one seems to imply sub 50:

Post subject: Re: Rogue Epic - Is it worth it?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 25, 2012 2:57 am
Offline
Member

Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2011 10:48 am
Posts: 34
Illicit wrote:
Darco,

You need to be 50 to start the quest, though technically a level 50+ toon can summon Stanos for you, but it's touch & go as to whether a sub-50 toon can complete the handins (I've heard he'll eat handins from under-levelled toons). Just get to 50 if you want to be safe.

The General has dropped ONE Quill that I know of on AK, so start farming robes early and often instead.

You'll need the General's Pouch, JDD, and Quill to complete the quest. Little else really matters. A reliable walkthrough I've used can be found HERE. I start with the pickpocketing of notes, and go from there.

Hope that helps.


I did this PC side Pre-Luclin on my Rogue and was using Ragebringer at 48. I started working on the quest at 40 (pickpocketing the items, etc). I might have had it sooner, but leveled on my way to finish the quest. Of course, that was PC side, but it was an era before the time EQMac is frozen in.

[heartbrand]

http://www.thesafehouse.org/forums//archive/index.php?t-8890.html

this oen from the safehouse says definitely doesnt work under 50:

"EZ_mythren
12-07-03, 08:28 PM
Searched for it, but haven't seen anything that deals with it - maybe I searched wrong. I'm curious as to the level requirement to get Ragebringer.

I've seen it confirmed for level 50, but has it been tried lower? Can anyone *confirm* you have to be 50, or could you possibly do it at 46 (when you can enter Hate to get the book). Has anyone actually ever heard of a 46-49 Rogue trying it and NOT receiving Ragebringer?

Any help here would be hot - I'd like to nab mine as soon as possible .

Thanks in advance!
Turlo
12-07-03, 08:41 PM
Yes, it has been done in the past, and yes, the items will get eaten. You may be able to do some of the prep work for it, but I strongly advice against doing the final turn in, and any crutial earlier turn in, until you are 50.
EZ_mythren
12-07-03, 09:25 PM
Alright, thanks - I won't give it a shot until 50 then .
Yalum
12-07-03, 09:36 PM
You must be 50, as so must anyone you are MQ'ing with. I've seen Kedge robes eaten in the past because of that.
EZ_kraxin01
12-10-03, 07:20 AM
Weird, you should have told me level 47 rogue that before he successfully got his Ragebringer.
EZ_Vumyan Onion
12-11-03, 05:10 AM
I believe you can do the last turn in as a mq pre-50, but I wouldn't risk it.
EZ_AsturiasAurora
12-11-03, 06:05 AM
I think in all epics, there have been instances where they have succeeded in getting their epics at levels less than 50. But honestly, is it really that much of a deal to get those 3-4 levels and just hit 50 to make sure? It's not like levelling is hard these days...

If you follow the quest through, from start to finish, WITHOUT and MQ's, then you will HAVE to be 50 to initiate the dialogue with a number of the NPCs.

If you bend the rules a bit and MQ the items, it just depends on which NPCs you may MQ with; some of them will steal 'eat' the items if both the MQ'ers involved are not 50.

Just play it safe and just get those last few levels you need to ding 50 and do it without all the risks.
12-11-03, 09:25 AM
Hey no reason to get snippy.

If he wants to use the ragebringer for 15 levels instead of 12 levels and get even more tired of not being able to find a replacement, then more power to him.

It really isn't worth the hassle to MQ just to avoid leveling to 50, especially with how fast leveling is now. The time spent working around the level limits through MQ would be more than if you just leveled and did it.

-L"

[heartbrand]

A lot of contradictory statements, it seems that all the parts leading up to final turn in cannot be done sub 50, but yet the final turn in can.

[SamwiseRed]

i remember rogues getting epics and deleveling on rz because they couldnt get them til 46+. just memory and no evidence to back that up.

[Ele]

http://www.eqclerics.org/forums/showthread.php?t=13813

Thread above includes a quote about Shaman getting epic at level 5.

Also includes evidence that clerics could get at 47, but not click until 50+. Off to the research mobile!

01-07-2003, 12:20 PM #38
Saarem
Founder of BCC



Join Date: Mar 2000
Location: Dublin
Posts: 3,832


Shamans can do their epics at level 5 (rather easy actually, only require a MQ tear from fear), wonder why the game dont allow them to use a 1.6k dot at level 5 .

[Nirgon]

K well I got the wizard one covered.

I'm sure the rest could be different but that was the consensus at the time.

[SamwiseRed]

http://i.imgur.com/yFgki.jpg

decided to do a little research because the way I remember it, anyone with a rogue epic before 50 was deleveled. this is only one post but maybe Nirgon is on to something. read last line.

[SamwiseRed]

other quotes on rogue epic making me think its 50+ only.

"Getting your Ragebringer is fairly easy, guilded or unguilded, i got mine as soon as i hit 50"

"You CANNOT get your Ragebringer until level 50. You can still get the items...but don't bother with any of the dialogues/turn-ins until level 50. I wasted an hour running around Catacombs trying to find Malka to begin it, just to have her tell me to take a hike. (Level 46)"

all and more in http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/quest.html?quest=765

also on eq mac forums
"You need to be 50 to start the quest, though technically a level 50+ toon can summon Stanos for you, but it's touch & go as to whether a sub-50 toon can complete the handins (I've heard he'll eat handins from under-levelled toons). Just get to 50 if you want to be safe."
http://www.eqmac.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=1&t=10887

lastly I just want to say its pretty obvious things like rogue epics werent intended to be twink gear for a lvl 10 rogue alt.

[Yinikren]

I support this simply to stop all the damn rogue twinks from running around.

Also, Stanos ate my handin on live at 49.

[Nirgon]

On to something aka knows what the deal is

[SirAlvarex]

Sounds to me like *the person who does the first hand in* needs to be 50+. After that, the quest has been started and it doesn't matter the level of the person completing it.

Atleast that's the pattern I've seen from these posts.

[Nirgon]

Does that mean the person doing the first hand in on a quest item must also only meet the appropriate faction level? Don't think so. Else, Velious quest armoring would be a joke.

[Krysttal]

I can tell you during velious my husband and I MQed the Monk epic on my lvl 2 monk. It was pretty funny while leveling.
The proc did not work until 45, but i was able to wear it just fine.

[Nirgon]

Somewhere out there is a post for the wizard epic NPCs giving you the cold shoulder until 45/46.

Faction for every quest I can think of has to be maxed on the final turn in and many parts weren't repeatable.

Another fun fact, is the turn in should pretty much 0 out your true spirit faction. Meaning, it puts it at a level that none of the npcs will deal with you any more but not attack you. Right now, I think you can just repeat whatever pieces you want here for items.

[Nirgon]

Faction required from Arantir:

http://s24.postimg.org/gwgawxabp/Arantir.jpg

My recollection of the wizard epic was for each part of it, you had to have exactly the faction from the previous quest steps. Trying to repeat old steps or immediately turn in the staves would leave you empty handed after turn in.

At the end of the quest, you were reset back to default starting value.

AKA no redoing parts of the quest again for the items.

[khanable]

http://web.archive.org/web/20011122043252/http://www.everlore.com/items/items.asp?mode=show&IID=225499&pg=1&sortby=4

Regarding the Ragebringer Quest: You can begin collecting soe of the items early on but none of the NPCs will talk to you and no reward for turning anything in will be given until you are Level 50 (minimum).


http://web.archive.org/web/20011122042639/http://www.everlore.com/items/items.asp?mode=show&IID=225499&pg=1&sortby=3

OOps sorry got my Ragebringer a while ago...

It's pretty sweet.. max backstab at 52 is 453 Damage... that was with resist gear on and not my STR gear

OK You cannot do your epic before lvl 50.
Renux takes about 2 groups of 6 player to do and general about 3-4 to make sure everything goes well... I had to do the sidequest for the quill since that darn General did not drop it.

Anything else I could say?
Oh yeah, Good Luck

May Tunare bless you

Redfalcon Lerouge
Rake of Tunare
SotG
Tallon Zek

http://www.thesafehouse.org/forums/showthread.php?p=394740

RAGEBRINGER QUEST WALKTHROUGH

(MUST be level 50 to talk to all major quest NPCs and have them respond with the quest info and to be able to be rewarded with turn-ins, even the side quests)

[diplo]

I have a level 15 monk on EQmac with monk epic. I am sure I could of done it at level one. Not sure about the other epics.

This. There was a thread somewhere that has proof that was resolved under petitions that got it fixed.

[nilbog]

Still willing to change any of these to required level, more faction, etc based on research.

Ragebringer.. does everyone agree you shouldn't be able to trade with Stanos until 50?


Research and the nerfs will come.

[Nirgon]

I'm completely on board with the Stanos change and wizard epic was at least 45. A 44 could not talk to Camin in Erudin or do anything further.

I'm sure parts of the shaman epic are doable at a lower level, as well as Soul Fire. But the major parts are at least 45 in every instance I knew on live.

Each step of the epic required a certain faction. I could not talk to Camin in Erudin after finishing my epic, as the negative hit to True Spirit makes you enable to do the quest again.

Melvyn, a bard on RZ, destroyed his epic and it *had* to be restored by a GM otherwise he could never get one again.

(Yes, I know 46 is planar entrance but 45 was common place for the epics)

[Ele]

Dug deep on EQclerics, couldn't find anyone completing the epic before 49, which doesn't mean it wasn't possible. People were able to work their way through the quest at 45/46 with turn ins. Did not see any posts discussing rejection or eaten items based on levels.

[Ele]

January 2001 Safehouse walkthrough
http://www.thesafehouse.org/forums/showthread.php?t=2867

RAGEBRINGER QUEST WALKTHROUGH

(MUST be level 50 to talk to all major quest NPCs and have them respond with the quest info and to be able to be rewarded with turn-ins, even the side quests)

December 2001 walkthrough linked on the Safehouse
http://web.archive.org/web/20011213051912/http://matt.waggoner.com/ragebringer.html#rundown

Other Notes

Most NPCs in the quest will not speak to you if you are level 49 or below. You may still acquire some of the components for the quest, but wait on handing them in until you are level 50 or higher.

Interesting quote from alternative walkthrough
General V`ghera, up until spring of 2001, used to *ALWAYS* drop a Cazic Quill, which meant that you didn't have to collect the robes, either! Now, he only drops it rarely (about 1 in 10 is the commonly-tossed around figure), so if you're lucky you won't need to collect the robes, but most people do.

2004 thread
http://www.thesafehouse.org/forums/showthread.php?t=6777

Does anyone know if we can get our epic pre 50?? I'm pretty sure the answer is no. So far I've gotten everything I need, but I dont wanna try for anything just in case I loose it all....

You have to be 50 to do the hand in.

Some of the NPCs wont respond to you before 50.

you can pick the 2 pages before 50. i got them at 47. both in less than 10 mins. all else you need to be 50.

[getsome]

http://tancidtherogue.com/ragebringer.html

Getting Ragebringer Before Level 50

Generally speaking, the epic quests were designed to be done by characters who were level 50+; in almost all cases, you have to be level 46 or higher to do the quest at all, since for some quests, there are NODROP pieces that come from the Planes (and you have to be 46+ to even zone into the Planes). Some of the epics' NPCs will deal with you if you are below 50, but many will not -- according to William Jackson, Stanos Herkanor will scoff at you if you give him the torn parchment pieces before level 50. (I've had multiple people send in that bit of info.) Whether this is true of all the rogue epic mobs, I don't know, but it seems to be true of Stanos, and since you hand in the final three items to Stanos, he probably won't reward you with Ragebringer if you aren't level 50. But then, maybe he will... who's willing to try? :)


4.General V`ghera, up until spring of 2001, used to *ALWAYS* drop a Cazic Quill, which meant that you didn't have to collect the robes, either! Now, he only drops it rarely (about 1 in 10 is the commonly-tossed around figure), so if you're lucky you won't need to collect the robes, but most people do.

[Myth]

I remember Jeb not speaking to my enchanter until I was 50. If you handed in the seal it was the same line of speech. Something along the lines of killing more fire beetles.

[Legend]

just make epics mq, easy solution put a level requirment (easier to code) on all epic weapons.

Lvl 6 monk in east common with his epic... pretty lame imho

[Nirgon]

Epic quests bout to require an epic quest

[Ele]

Early parts of the shaman epic, at least, appear to be doable before 45/46. Several people in this thread discuss getting through the shield at 29 and 33:

http://web.archive.org/web/20010716205623/http://forums.castersrealm.com/cgi-bin/eq/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=46&t=000145


Also seems there was an issue Pre-Velious(?) about inflating faction too high to cause the quest NPCs to not allow you to advance or repeat steps.
http://web.archive.org/web/20010716210846/http://forums.castersrealm.com/cgi-bin/eq/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=46&t=000216

They fixed the too-good faction problem several months ago.

[Ele]

Enchanters:

July 2001
http://web.archive.org/web/20010709183338/http://forums.castersrealm.com/cgi-bin/eq/ultimatebb.cgi?ubb=get_topic&f=17&t=000507

I'm having trouble getting started on this thing.
When I talk with Stofo or Reania they tell me "that my skills are not enough" or something like it. I'm 47th level. Shouldn't that be high enough to start the first phase of the quest?

Monks start theirs at 1st level.

I have heard about everything from 45 to 52, but I got this message up until when I ding'd 50. The stofo would talk to me.

Since you have the walkthrough, you can start earlier, but the earliest that stofo will talk to you is level 50.
This means that the earliest you can complete it, is level 50.

[Calabee]

wut about all the low levels that already got epiced, are they gonna get ''blue diamoned'' until they are of level, or?

[Legend]

should put a "level requirment on all epic items" would be very very easy to code

go through the epic item list for all classes

put required lvl 50

every epic will become un equipped and the char with the item will not be able to equip it till their 50th lvl

[Legend]

lvl 6 monk in east commons with epic fists... pretty classic

[pasi]

Ignoring epics for a second, when did we first see any form of level-restricted turn ins on EQlive? I'm not even sure that this mechanic even existed until Luclin/PoP. I think a lot of people claiming epics could not be done back then are confusing NPCs talking with the actual turn in.

EQ Mac:
100k is good for such an easy epic. I recently did a full MQ of a monk epic to a level 7 monk (he's now level 30 and still can't click, what a gyp)!

Also live:
You are wrong, just come to Tunare and as Xianzu to to log on his level 1 Epic 1.0'd monk. So I am talking from personal experience here.


Here is a thread from 2003 on monkly-business
http://www.monkly-business.net/forums/showthread.php?t=8028

the lowest lvl monk ive seen with his epic was 38. pissed me off heh
The lvl caps are just for the text, but if you got all the items you can turn in and MQ etc.

I've been trying to find the thread on innoruuk.yuku but we had someone epic a level 20 shaman in Shadows of Luclin.

From Samanna:

Note: There is no level restriction for the shaman epic quest. However, you do have to be level 46 to enter the Plane of Fear to get the tear. One can get around this by just having another shaman turn in the tear for them and then looting the scale (keep in mind that only a shaman can turn in the tear). If you are doing this, make sure you have maxed out your True Spirit faction beforehand using the above method.


Still willing to change any of these to required level, more faction, etc based on research.

Ragebringer.. does everyone agree you shouldn't be able to trade with Stanos until 50?


Research and the nerfs will come.

No.
EQMac:
You need to be 50 to start the quest, though technically a level 50+ toon can summon Stanos for you, but it's touch & go as to whether a sub-50 toon can complete the handins (I've heard he'll eat handins from under-levelled toons). Just get to 50 if you want to be safe.


followed by the next post

was using Ragebringer at 48.


Now I highlighted the name Xianzu earlier. He's a guy who was known for having a bunch of level 1s with epic 1.0s. Here's a post from him:

Other than the Berserker & Beastlord epics, none of the others had a hard coded level that you had to be, in order to do them. Some like Druid & Ranger have faction req's lessened once you hit a certain level though. Though in order to do this, one had to get someone to multi-quest the drops from the planes. If you don't multi-quest then the min level is 46 to complete most of them. But you can start doing the sub quests at most any level.

https://forums.station.sony.com/eq/index.php?threads/the-epic-project.3340/

[pasi]

So shaman and monk epic are off the list.

Here goes cleric:

http://everquest.allakhazam.com/db/classes.html?class=7&mid=114255067242451765

completed mine at 36

A friend of mine on Antonius Bayle successfully finished the cleric 1.0 at level 8. (MAJOR help and farming from his level 75 SK and 75 Druid/Beastloard trio)

So it can be done, if you have the patience =)

The Avatar of Water will not take the turn in until 35, that is lowest you can be for the Cleric Epic ( the effect cannot be used until 50 )

A bit of conflicting info here!

EQCleric.com:
Last I knew, you can do all the work and the turn-ins and get your epic at any level, but the clicky doesn't click until you're 50

Is there a minimum level required to do this quest?

Nope, but you can't use the clickie until 46 or 51 I believe. I dont' remember exactly. For fun we completed the epic for a friend of mine's 33 cleric. So it can be done any level, but you have to be a certain level to actually use it. Hope that helps.

If you have people willing to help you through it, you can get and equip it at lvl 1 (unless they changed something within the last year [post date 2006] or so). You won't be able to click the effect until 50 or 51 though.

EQclerics.org
Post Date 6/06/01
I did it at 34

Ok, so my enchanter did. Multiquested the boring camps all the way up to ragefire (including handing in the pearl) for a guild cleric. (both goblins spawned 2x in a row on my quest, so I had an extra set of items)

Another interesting post about 'why people say level 50 is the minimum level for epics.
http://www.eqclerics.org/forums/showthread.php?t=3409

It comes from the fact that the quest givers (when everyone bothered to talk to them to figure out the quests) would not talk to anyone under level 50.

[pasi]

Sort of late, didn't intend to be posting so much so it's a bit disorganized.

There's a metric fuckton more information suggesting that epics can be MQd, but I don't want to spam this thread even more. I'm mostly looking into the 4 epics that realistically see play on low levels here, but there are posts on other epics being done at low levels.

On a side note, I think a lot of you are giving way too much credit to the programming of the game during this era. I quested a monk epic on my SK for the fuck of it. I think we're confusing the minimum level to talk to an NPC versus a turn-in here.

But anyhow, unlike Cleric/Monk/Shaman there's a lot of conflicting information about the rogue epic.

http://www.thesafehouse.org/forums//archive/index.php?t-8890.html

I've seen it confirmed for level 50, but has it been tried lower? Can anyone *confirm* you have to be 50, or could you possibly do it at 46 (when you can enter Hate to get the book). Has anyone actually ever heard of a 46-49 Rogue trying it and NOT receiving Ragebringer?

Yes, it has been done in the past, and yes, the items will get eaten. You may be able to do some of the prep work for it, but I strongly advice against doing the final turn in, and any crutial earlier turn in, until you are 50.

Weird, you should have told me level 47 rogue that before he successfully got his Ragebringer.

I believe you can do the last turn in as a mq pre-50, but I wouldn't risk it.

If you follow the quest through, from start to finish, WITHOUT and MQ's, then you will HAVE to be 50 to initiate the dialogue with a number of the NPCs.

If you bend the rules a bit and MQ the items, it just depends on which NPCs you may MQ with; some of them will steal 'eat' the items if both the MQ'ers involved are not 50.

Anyhow, I'll further look into rogue epic and try to turn in one on live or something in the near future. It'd be preferable to try it on EQmac, but I don't have characters there.

[Nirgon]

Pasi you can spam and I will read

[pasi]

So, I spent the entire day on live doing the rogue epic on a level 1. It's sort of a bitch because Tani and Founy have 3 billion HP and are completely MR, so I had batphone in some of the resident uberguild's DPS.

Basically, the Cazic Quill and the Final Turn-In do not work on a level 1 rogue on live. This could have been changed in the 13 years, but this is how it works on live currently.

The MQ worked for a KoS SK with invis to allow turn in, but when the level 1 indifferent rogue turned in, the NPC gave the item back and said he had no need of this.

http://i44.tinypic.com/wb6qdu.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/vsp8x2.jpg

http://i41.tinypic.com/30jic9e.jpg

http://i40.tinypic.com/2556qf5.jpg

Always gotta pitch P1999.

http://i40.tinypic.com/29c870k.jpg

I forgot Stanos summons the entire fucking zone.

http://i39.tinypic.com/2rmqgbo.jpg

Master of the CoS Turn-in (Quill)

http://i43.tinypic.com/28bv8gg.jpg

Ready to turn in on level 1.

http://i43.tinypic.com/nxsua0.jpg

Nope.

http://i43.tinypic.com/jfw8xw.jpg

So, I gave the JDD to my SK. CoS turned it in worked. I tried to turn in just the Pouch on the Rogue. Nope - wouldn't take.

[Nirgon]

The prosecution rests. A+ job dude.

Final turn ins also should need max faction and then final turn in resets lower than starting true spirit to prevent a redo.

http://www.gifsforum.com/images/gif/i%27m%20out%20of%20here/grand/kramer_is_out_gif.gif

[Stinkum]

A+ work to R. Kelly

/clap

[dabrixmgp]

lvl 6 monk in east commons with epic fists... pretty classic


have done celestial fists for quite a few level 1s for lols on Live. Monk epic is a joke. Max level does the entire thing and level 1 loots the demon fangs and does final turn in and BAM free epic.

[Nirgon]

Bump.

Notice my evidence of the 50+ without required faction (Faction required from Arantir:


) and Pasi's work proving no pre lvl 50 rogue epix.

[pasi]

I've got everything on live for a monk epic ready to go except for the RotLC.

Been killing 'a drake' phs for 4 or 5 hours now and haven't seen Brother Z, let alone Bro Z with a robe.

[Mateo]

The recommended way to complete wizard epic back in the day was to have invisibility cast on you during the final turn in in sol ro temple. I had invisibility cast on me with trade open and turned in, and got epic. I'm not sure where this "required faction" is coming from.

[Nirgon]

50+, each step along the way requires appropriate faction gained from the previous step.

Most steps should not be repeatable.

[Mateo]

But they don't I just said that. You can be invisible and indifferent to truespirit and receive wizard epic.

[Nirgon]

Given Pasi has shown using circlet of shadow worked for him turning in rogue epic, I should kindly stfu about it. But I'd still maintain during its era you needed the equivalent "maximum" from completing the quest for the final hand in, with each step requiring the exact or higher amount of faction resulting from the step before it.

Unsure if Nilbog needs us to do every epic turn in before he considers patching.

[Ele]

Given Pasi has shown using circlet of shadow worked for him turning in rogue epic, I should kindly stfu about it. But I'd still maintain during its era you needed the equivalent "maximum" from completing the quest for the final hand in, with each step requiring the exact or higher amount of faction resulting from the step before it.

Unsure if Nilbog needs us to do every epic turn in before he considers patching.

Which ones do you think require certain levels of faction besides indifferent?

The only quests that build faction throughout the quest are:

True Spirit: Shadow Knight, Shaman, Wizard

Even then SK's would open trade windows and get invis before clicking trade to achieve indifferent level faction.

[Nirgon]

@Ele : I *believe* all of them are intended to do all the steps in order etc as I've said.

Sadly, so much is unreachable now, even by the way back machine :(

Classic posts during this era didn't exactly have a lot of people (if really any) experimenting with their epic hand ins using invis or being a different class. Especially the final turn ins.

I'd settle on what live has now because its certainly better than lvl 1s running around with epics :P. It is also easier to bang these out on live by a mile than doing them on EQMac and I believe they should differ very little regarding the final turn in. With epics not being purchasable for lvl 1 alts, I suspect this may alleviate the "buy your epic" market and mobs being camped for sale.

Pending what Nilbog would want to get this content (his favorito department, mine's mechanics!) resolved.. we may need to join forces with Pasi to finish the live epics.

[Ele]

At the very least it was recognized, publicly, in early Velious that Ragefire was farmable via Gimblox and chaining off a Natasha, meaning that anyone could do the Cleric epic just for pearls.

http://www.eqclerics.org/forums/showthread.php?t=2686&highlight=multiquest+epic

[cyryllis]

Not all epics required specific faction from previously completed parts of the epic. You could always skip the beginning of the enchanter epic and for rogue I know you can skip the side quests and whatnot.

[pasi]

I'd settle on what live has now because its certainly better than lvl 1s running around with epics :P. It is also easier to bang these out on live by a mile than doing them on EQMac and I believe they should differ very little regarding the final turn in. With epics not being purchasable for lvl 1 alts, I suspect this may alleviate the "buy your epic" market and mobs being camped for sale.

Pending what Nilbog would want to get this content (his favorito department, mine's mechanics!) resolved.. we may need to join forces with Pasi to finish the live epics.

I'm finishing the monk epic to see if EQlive added a minimum level to epic. I've seen a lot of posts with conflicting data on when/if this was ever added.

What I do know is that monk epic is one of the epics that we have a shit load of data suggesting it was doable at level 1 in Velious. It's also completable at any level on EQMac. If the monk epic isn't doable at level 1 on live, I don't think the rogue epic evidence that I posted is valid.

[Nirgon]

Yeah lot of people do think its doable at lvl 1.

I read the shaman thread saying obtainable at 46, clickable at 50.

The cleric epic does still require a *gasp* hand in though by the "skipper".

[pasi]

http://i44.tinypic.com/23vxkpy.jpg

http://www.eqmac.com/forums/viewtopic.php?f=13&t=7693&p=89532


By shitloads of data, I mean this and about a dozen other posts saying the same thing.

[Nirgon]

Well so much for consistency on Verant's end. Woof!

[pasi]

http://i43.tinypic.com/24vnxao.jpg

http://i40.tinypic.com/6945ts.jpg

So, I was able to do every turn-in for the monk epic on live with the exception of the final turn-in. We know this turn-in is possible on EQMac, so this invalidates the data that I previously provided on the rogue epic.

There's a lot of previous posts on class forums about being able to acquire epics on live at any level (read one of my earlier posts on this thread).

I've read about a blanket patch for epic minimum levels. Unfortunately, there really isn't any agreement on when this happened. Some people claimed it was when they changed it so you could no longer do the BST epic at level 1. I've seen some claims of 2003. I've also seen claims of people completing epics at low levels all the way until 2012. Most of the posts I've read indicated this cap would have been in the 2003-2006 range.

What we do know is that many epics can be done at any level on EQMac (2002). There is tons of evidence that suggests that shaman, monk, and cleric epics can be done at any level. Those epics are 3 of the 4 epic's that are sold to low levels on this server. The other epic is rogue which doesn't have a ton of supporting evidence either way.

In my opinion (if you care), I would think that none of the epics have a minimum level in Kunark. It makes no sense for them to launch a handful of epic quests in Kunark with a minimum level while the others do not have said minimum level. Furthermore, the BST epic was originally doable at level 1 even during PoP (should be lots of evidence for this - heres one http://www.erollisimarr.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12831). Why they would have had no minimum level for an epic quest released later down the road makes no sense unless none of the quests had a minimum initially.

The correct course of action would be to try to do the rogue epic on EQMac and see from there. Unfortunately, I don't have the means to do this.

TLDR = I think the minimum level on epics wasn't a thing for the duration of this server.

[Nirgon]

K so..

Certain parts require faction, level or both, but not necessarily the final turn in and they are different for each epic.

http://i.imgur.com/c32pf.gif

I'll just leave this alone then!

Researching all of this would be the most epic bug research post of all.

[Nirgon]

I wish that screenshot I linked a bit back had him try the turn in as a lvl 60 with indifferent faction instead of apprehensive :P

[Lammy]

I was relatively at the forefront of the Rogue epic quest as we were all figuring it out. I do vaguely remember other rogues (not yet 50) mentioning they couldn't get certain things turned in. The details are a blur now, but whether or not you could MQ around that, I'm not sure... because not everyone and their brother were trying to MQ newbs their epics like they're doing on P99.

I do remember the mechanics being intended to prevent anyone under 50 from getting the rogue 1.0

[Atlis]

Verant didn't use foresight to think people would do "epic" quests, involving death touch mini-bosses in level restricted zones, for characters incapable of even entering the zones, so never applied level restrictions. Sort of like how they didn't anticipate shadow knights bind-rushing Lhranc in City of Mist.

Does P99 want to fix a design bug so that epics work as intended, or leave this "bug" since epics are working as designed? I'd love P99 to fix things Verant never got around to fixing, but I'm new here.

On a side note, I'm surprised the exp from 8th Coldain Ring and epic didn't ding that monk to level 2.

[Ele]

Verant didn't use foresight to think people would do "epic" quests, involving death touch mini-bosses in level restricted zones, for characters incapable of even entering the zones, so never applied level restrictions. Sort of like how they didn't anticipate shadow knights bind-rushing Lhranc in City of Mist.

Does P99 want to fix a design bug so that epics work as intended, or leave this "bug" since epics are working as designed? I'd love P99 to fix things Verant never got around to fixing, but I'm new here.

On a side note, I'm surprised the exp from 8th Coldain Ring and epic didn't ding that monk to level 2.

Something about a limit on quest exp to 11% of your current level. This was implemented recently on P99. Before then you could get a level 1 cleric to level 8 with the final epic turn ins.

[Atlis]

That makes sense. They may have removed that from Live, or not added that restriction to the Quest system. I think you ding level 2 just by talking to the NPCs for the Kobold Skull Charm in the tutorial zone.