Luclin models...a poll

[Tysus]

Originally Posted by Rasterburn [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Well the point is this: if the Luclin models were enabled, then you could select which models you want and which you do not want, just by going into the Options screen. And that way, everybody is happy.

This, DO WANT THIS.

[Aetherial]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

You think its patronizing of me to make a poll asking people their opinion? Not often do I pull this card, but damn. I can make any poll I want to make, because it's my project, okay? It's about a luxury feature of the end user client... not about game mechanics.

I prefaced the poll the same way I prefaced all the polls in beta.. "This will NOT decide anything." In case you were unaware, voting on polls on the internet does not produce accurate figures. You can register, and vote.. and register and vote.. and register and vote.

If all the polls I have done up until now fully counted, you would be playing on some abomination of a PVP server with 2-10 boxing based on votes from people named xcm234nv and adfa234.

I made this poll as a courtesy to Jereziah.

Can you code some phat lewtz for my newb chanter? [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

kkthnxbye

PS... I don't see the problem. Other people don't have to look at my screen and vice versa. If you don't like the Luclin models turn them off, no harm in implementing them as far as I can see... unless it keeps the devs from something the community feels is more important.

[fwaits]

Whatever the devs decide is fine with me, but it seems odd that the whole point of this server is to re-create the game in it's entirety as it was in that time frame (Classic through Velious) to the best of their ability and then add an option that was not available during that time. That being said I liked some of the Luclin models, but they came out with Luclin, which will never see the light of day here.

[Sarkov]

I want control over how my toon is percieved. One of the major problem with Luclin models is they are tied to the face selection in original models & vice versa. Typically the pairing is really poor... you have a face/appearance you like in one and it looks ghastly in the other.

And lets not forget the most important point...THEY ARE NOT CLASSIC. The only justifiable position for issues like this is to go back to the root of what this server is and has been repped to be... a recreation of the classic EQ experience. A lot of the appeal (and why I've personally been quite successful recruiting others to come and play here) is the purity of the experience. Devs, please don't comrpomise this for the sake of a few malcontents - the poll numbers are overwhelming enough that I hope you guys will respect the wishes of the majority here.

[Rasterburn]

Originally Posted by fwaits [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

the whole point of this server is to re-create the game in it's entirety as it was in that time frame (Classic through Velious) to the best of their ability and then add an option that was not available during that time.

We're already seeing some very significant options which were not available at that time, by virtue of the fact that we're using a 2005 client. Updated and improved ground textures, UI features, etc. The whole "if it wasn't there in 1999, then I don't want it" stance is already moot because of this fact.

Notice that nobody is complaining about having an in-game compass, or improved chat features, or a more logical UI arrangement, or nicer looking zones and buildings. I find that glaring lack of consistency in their attitudes to be rather hypocritical.

And I am further amused by the people who in one post say things like "It's just a cosmetic difference and hence it is unimportant." And then in another post, that same person will say "I want everyone else to see the same character on my screen as I do." Well, wait a minute... if cosmetic differences are "unimportant," then why is there such a concern over what everyone else sees when they look at your toon..? And if cosmetic differences are "unimportant," then why do you care whether or not other players can have the character models that they prefer..? Again... we see irrational and dictatorial hypocrisy from the status quo.

What we are REALLY seeing in this thread is a lot of "I want everyone else to think, see and do things exactly the same way that I do." Uh huh. So much for individuality. Let's all be single-minded, group-thinking sheeple together. No thanks.

Originally Posted by Sarkov [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

And lets not forget the most important point...THEY ARE NOT CLASSIC.

Luclin is every bit as "classic" as Kunark and Velious. Same exact dev team, same exact era, same pre-SOE rule set.

[toddfx]

Why in the name of all that is classic would Luclin models even be considered in the first place much less re-considered in this ancient thread brought back from the graveyard?

[Humerox]

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It's about a luxury feature of the end user client... not about game mechanics.

I don't really care what people see me as, lol. I do think any time spent on unnecessary stuff is a waste...maybe later on down the road when content is pretty much wrapped up? I mean the development team here isn't a room full of paid programmers, lol.

Originally Posted by Rasterburn [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

We're already seeing some very significant options which were not available at that time, by virtue of the fact that we're using a 2005 client. Updated and improved ground textures, UI features, etc. The whole "if it wasn't there in 1999, then I don't want it" stance is already moot because of this fact.

I don't think they CAN tamper with the client. Copyright issue...and before anyone gets all fired up and runs "copyright" in another direction, the EQEMU servers are in a gray area, and the explanation of why they can run them -at least P99 -is pretty good. Tampering with the client is a clear violation...no gray area at all. They'd have to recreate their own client...something that isn't really feasible.

[Sarkov]

Not really... in fact you are making an excellent point in favor of not ever allowing anything the devs can control that wasnt there in classic EQ: people will see one minor deviation and start mentally justifying major leaps of discontinuity.

For my part, if we could completely remove everything that wasnt there in the classic experience, I would be 100% in favor. I suspect you would see a similar majority as you see in this poll in favor of the classic experience on every issue, no matter how small.

Do not confuse policy with technical possibility.

[Rasterburn]

Originally Posted by Sarkov [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Do not confuse policy with technical possibility.

And what you are forgetting are the very reasons for why those things were changed and enhanced, as each successive expansion was released: it was because the overwhelming, VAST majority of players back then were DEMANDING those upgraded models and UI features. Verant didn't go to all of the trouble of making those revisions for shits and giggles. They did it because back in the classic days that everyone is touting here, the majority of EQ players WANTED those changes to be made.

I'll give you a related example that I remember, from back in early 2003...

A lot of old-timers were complaining that they preferred the animations of the original models to those of the Luclin models. As usual, their nostalgia was clouding their common sense. But in an effort to appease everyone, SOE reprogrammed the Luclin models so that they would run and jump more or less the same as the original models did.

One month later, they restored the Luclin animations. Wanna know why..? Because after seeing the difference, most of the players changed their minds and asked to have the Luclin animations put back. The older animations simply looked lousy.

This is why I am suggesting that many of you are suffering from selective memory. I mean no disrespect when I say that, because I'm guilty of doing the same thing sometimes. But I was there, for the whole deal back in the day. And my memory is still fairly sharp, so far as when and why certain changes were made by Verant. In the majority of cases, those changes were made in response to strong and ongoing requests by the larger EQ player base. And that player base probably included many of the people who are posting in this thread. They are conveniently forgetting what we all went through, back in the day.

[fwaits]

Originally Posted by Rasterburn [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

We're already seeing some very significant options which were not available at that time, by virtue of the fact that we're using a 2005 client. Updated and improved ground textures, UI features, etc. The whole "if it wasn't there in 1999, then I don't want it" stance is already moot because of this fact.

Notice that nobody is complaining about having an in-game compass, or improved chat features, or a more logical UI arrangement, or nicer looking zones and buildings. I find that glaring lack of consistency in their attitudes to be rather hypocritical.

And I am further amused by the people who in one post say things like "It's just a cosmetic difference and hence it is unimportant." And then in another post, that same person will say "I want everyone else to see the same character on my screen as I do." Well, wait a minute... if cosmetic differences are "unimportant," then why is there such a concern over what everyone else sees when they look at your toon..? And if cosmetic differences are "unimportant," then why do you care whether or not other players can have the character models that they prefer..? Again... we see irrational and dictatorial hypocrisy from the status quo.

What we are REALLY seeing in this thread is a lot of "I want everyone else to think, see and do things exactly the same way that I do." Uh huh. So much for individuality. Let's all be single-minded, group-thinking sheeple together. No thanks.

Man you are really vehement about having these models aren't you? Anyway, as I said, if it's decided they are allowed then great, I won't cry about it. I gave my opinion on why it makes more sense to not have them. The other items you cited are beyond the devs ability to control so they are not in the same boat as the player models. So why is our opinion so "irrational" and yours is not? Just because it is not yours doesn't make it less valid. And you trying to demean others opinions just makes yours even less substantial because your being an ass about it.

Luclin is every bit as "classic" as Kunark and Velious. Same exact dev team, same exact era, same pre-SOE rule set.

That's great and all, but classic as defined by this server is up to Velious as the devs HERE have stated many times. Same reason you won't see Vah Shir players on Project 1999.