Michael Brown

[Toofliss]

Originally Posted by Ephirith [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Don't be like that. Why did he disagree with the celebration? What is the difference between all the other celebrations he bakes cakes for, and that one? It was the gayness.

Do you think it would be okay for him to refuse service to an interracial couple because he disagrees with interracial marriage? You could make the same argument-- he did not refuse service because the groom was black. He refused service because he doesn't think blacks should marry whites. His only issue was the class + the celebration, not necessarily the class itself, right?

This would be illegal under the Civil Rights Act, just as the homo example would be illegal if homosexuality were a protected class.

Do you think he would have refused to bake them a birthday cake for someone? He didn't have an issue with the person, but he did not want to support gay marriage.

If I went into a copy center owned by a gay man/woman and proceeded to request that they make up 500 signs that said "God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve" and the clerk refused to make them -- would you then be ok with him being forced to have the signs printed up for me?

You can't discriminate after all and you can be forced to print up whatever I ask(make) you to do. I think it's a scary idea that they could be compelled to do it.

[iruinedyourday]

Originally Posted by Toofliss [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Do you think he would have refused to bake them a birthday cake for someone? He didn't have an issue with the person, but he did not want to support gay marriage.

If I went into a copy center owned by a gay man/woman and proceeded to request that they make up 500 signs that said "God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve" and the clerk refused to make them -- would you then be ok with him being forced to have the signs printed up for me?

You can't discriminate after all and you can be forced to print up whatever I ask(make) you to do. I think it's a scary idea that they could be compelled to do it.

guys, reality called and said the rights of Americans are under WAY more duress in Ferguson than at the fucking stupid bakery and the imaginary Kinkos.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8zbR824FKpU

[Ephirith]

Originally Posted by Toofliss [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Do you think he would have refused to bake them a birthday cake for someone? He didn't have an issue with the person, but he did not want to support gay marriage.

If I went into a copy center owned by a gay man/woman and proceeded to request that they make up 500 signs that said "God made Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve" and the clerk refused to make them -- would you then be ok with him being forced to have the signs printed up for me?

You can't discriminate after all and you can be forced to print up whatever I ask(make) you to do. I think it's a scary idea that they could be compelled to do it.

I would be okay forcing them to print those signs if it were required by the Civil Rights Act, but I doubt refusal in this circumstance would be discrimination on basis of religion. The copy center finds the speech being printed objectionable, not the religious status of the client.

Turning away a customer because they are Christian = Illegal

Turning away a customer because they want you to print Christian-themed signs you find offensive = Not Illegal.

In the case of the bakery cake, you are turning away the customer specifically because they are gay. Here's why:

When you're making hundreds of other cakes for hundreds of other couples, I don't think it would be difficult to prove that they were being denied because of their status as gays.

The copy center, on the other hand, is not making hundreds of other aggressive, offensive signs for hundreds of other clients. They'd likely also refuse to make signs that say "****** faggots burn in hell" or "All white people should be fucked in their puckered assholes". And they would probably be within the law to do so.

[Toofliss]

Originally Posted by Ephirith [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I would be okay forcing them to print those signs if it were required by the Civil Rights Act, but I doubt refusal in this circumstance would be discrimination on basis of religion. The copy center finds the speech being printed objectionable, not the religious status of the client.

Turning away a customer because they are Christian = Illegal

Turning away a customer because they want you to print Christian-themed signs you find offensive = Not Illegal.

In the case of the bakery cake, you are turning away the customer specifically because they are gay. Here's why:

When you're making hundreds of other cakes for hundreds of other couples, I don't think it would be difficult to prove that they were being denied because of their status as gays.

The copy center, on the other hand, is not making hundreds of other aggressive, offensive signs for hundreds of other clients. They'd likely also refuse to make signs that say "****** faggots burn in hell" or "All white people should be fucked in their puckered assholes". And they would probably be within the law to do so.

You're trying to make a connection that isn't there. I'm not refusing to bake the cake because the person is gay. I'm refusing to bake the cake that celebrates something I don't condone. Just as the Kinkos is not refusing because of my faith, but rather the message - I would refuse because of the content of the message (celebration of gay marriage).

Don't get me wrong, I think it's ridiculous in both cases. Neither scenario should be compelled/forced to do it.