Game Mechanics: Melee PVP Buff During Classic

[Technique]

Originally Posted by heartbrand [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Test a skarlon sword vs a WS. They do the exact same DMG.

Originally Posted by nilbog [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Since epics are now live, these should have been updated. Live on pvp as of now.

• Max skill level for tradeskills is 250, up from 200.
• Two Handed weapons receive a delay bonus.
• Monk Weight is 14 for lvls 1-54, 18 for lvls 55-59, and 22 for lvl 60s

Either you tested them prior to this or you weren't comparing min/max hits for both weapons.

[Pudge]

I did this the day after the patch, just because the bonus seemed miniscule:

Originally Posted by Pudge [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Hi, a 60 warrior hitting a sitting 58 sk with:

oggok cleaver (44/60): 277 damage

weighted axe (45/150): 312 damage

should this be the way that damage bonus works? seems like a really weak increase in damage, for being over twice the delay. the extra 90 delay yielded only 35 damage. actually even less than 35 damage because the axe has 1 higher damage than cleaver. so... working as intended? or no? about 1 damage per 3 delay

[Latege]

That seems just about what it should be based on the code.

	else if (RuleI(Combat,TwoHandedDmgBonus) == 2)
	{
		if (Weapon->Delay <= 27)
			return (GetLevel() - 22) / 3; // Just 1h bonus + 1.
		
		int32 base;
		if (GetLevel() > 50)
			base = ((GetLevel() - 7) / 3);
		else
			base = ((GetLevel() - 25) / 2);

		if (Weapon->Delay <= 39)
			return base;
		else if (Weapon->Delay <= 42)
			return base + 1;
		else if (Weapon->Delay <= 44)
			return base + 3;
		else
			return base + (Weapon->Delay - 31)/3;
	}

I don't know if it rounds up or down, but Oggok Cleaver should have a 20.66 damage bonus, and Weighted Axe should be 57.33. If it rounds all the numbers down before adding then it will be 20 vs 56 or so.

[Pudge]

Based on the code above it looks to me like the bonus on a level 60 with an oggok cleaver should be:

Base: ((GetLevel(60) - 7) / 3) =
______________________ 53/3 = 17.666

Final: return base + (Weapon->Delay - 31)/3 =
_______________________ 17.666 + (60 - 31)/3 =
____________________________ 17.666 + 9.666 = 27.333

And for a weighted axe should be:

Base: ((GetLevel(60) - 7) / 3) =
______________________ 53/3 = 17.666

Final: return base + (Weapon->Delay - 31)/3 =
______________________ 17.666 + (150 - 31)/3 =
___________________________ 17.666 + 39.666 = 57.333

That is a difference of exactly 30. The difference in my test was 35, but the regular damage of the weighted axe is 1 point higher, so I'm guessing that's what accounts for it (without having the code in front of me, I bet the basic calc for max damage is 5*damage).

So.. 2h damage bonus working as intended! (Unless something changed since may 2013. I know my numbers are old.)

[Technique]

base is an integer and I'm guessing the second expression is coerced to an int, so damage bonus for the cleaver and axe would be 26 and 56, respectively.

At any rate, the problem with melee isn't 2hander damage (it's accurate to the era) or frequency of max hits (they're not), it's the base hit chance, independent of all other factors, which is simply too high.

[Buhbuh]

Agree, hit rate massive, AC fix should help the rest.

[Nirgon]

Sitting damage wasn't right at least in PvE.

Sitting targets I believe are guaranteed to be hit atm, not necessarily for max.

That needs to change to be a max hit for a sitting target being hit in both pvp/pve.

[Technique]

It's already correct, in PvP anyway.

Originally Posted by Rogean [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Alecta: Attacks on sitting defenders will now hit for your normal maximum hit instead of the theoretical maximum for your damage table.

[Burgerking]

Originally Posted by Crazycloud [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Haynar,

I'm a OG PVPer from live. The hit rate and hitting for max is both messed up.

I'm a paladin. I can have rogues take me from 100% to 40% within seconds getting hit for max hits with no misses.

On live i was a ranger I would run to a corner wall turn my back against it and have rogues hit me and have my DS do eat them alive. If i would try that here I would die duo to how glitchy max hits are and no misses.

EXACTLY I played Sullon as a shaman fought Ruin rogues(BIS gear that made kunark shit laughable)

Never was hit like this, in the 5 seconds I go for Bane of Nife I've already lost 1200-1500 without even a disc being blown. I have 900 AC on a shaman that's about as high as my class can get and I'm getting torn apart like I'm wearing paper.

Melee hit box about 50% larger than it was on live.
Melee hit rate set far too high
Melee dmg set far too high
Melee pushback causing spell interruption is like 75% more than it was on live a hasted rogue or warrior rocking one handers can shut down every spell.

All my spells are over 5 seconds making my class almost unplayable vs melee's currently. Not gonna lie PvP is not a lot of fun right now.

[Potus]

Originally Posted by Burgerking [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

EXACTLY I played Sullon as a shaman fought Ruin rogues(BIS gear that made kunark shit laughable)

Never was hit like this, in the 5 seconds I go for Bane of Nife I've already lost 1200-1500 without even a disc being blown. I have 900 AC on a shaman that's about as high as my class can get and I'm getting torn apart like I'm wearing paper.

Melee hit box about 50% larger than it was on live.
Melee hit rate set far too high
Melee dmg set far too high
Melee pushback causing spell interruption is like 75% more than it was on live a hasted rogue or warrior rocking one handers can shut down every spell.

All my spells are over 5 seconds making my class almost unplayable vs melee's currently. Not gonna lie PvP is not a lot of fun right now.

Yeah it's not accurate for the period. Melees should not be shredding casters so easily right now. That's end game Velious, with guys decked out in primal velium and fully buffed, with +100HP items in every slot and laughing at casters doing 2/3 dmg still on their spells.