Consider Project 2002

[Torven]

Originally Posted by apio [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Secrets, I am pretty sure Hogg was talking about this quote, and not Torven's code in general.
...
I too am kind of disappointed by the behavior in this thread, seeing as we have been nothing but non confrontational since we started our own server

Well since you guys still don't seem to know what I'm talking about, I'll quote two posts from your forums:

Originally Posted by mario

Walls in mistmoore are not acting as line of sight barriers to assist additional nearby mobs. I'm not sure if you know this but just letting you chaps know that when within the castle, the walls do not prevent aggro from bouncing

Originally Posted by Boragar

This is fixed, so the castle should be playeable after reboot. We had what we have dubbed "torven-mode" going on in there. Where mob assist radii were set to beyond obnoxious levels to recreate some kind of hard mode that never existed.

I would also classify this as something less than cordial.

Your first p2002 thread was also full of 'TAKP devs are all in Destiny and there is GM favoritism' posts, along with comments like 'if you want loot handed to you on a silver platter, play on TAKP' or 'unlike other servers...'

Of course now that you have launched a server using our work, you want to act more respectful. Don't think we have forgotten posts like these.

[Secrets]

You will be hard pressed to find many (unprovoked) messages like this from our staff:

Yes - instead you'll get blatant lies about content and what you've actually done. Hint: you've done a few quest scripts and modified a few NPC stats to make your game what you think is right. I'm okay with that, but don't call the base work your own, that's just insensitive as fuck to my team.

The bottom line is, P2002 is closed source at this moment. That means any speculation you might hear about our server is just that, speculation. None of the TAK staff has ever played on our box (except for Secrets, who came online in one of the first days warping around and openly using hacks until he got banned, something I guess he feels he is entitled to, working on the netcode? I don't know) so they quite frankly have no idea what they are talking about when they are criticizing our progress and content quality

It is not speculation. You took advantage of an open source project and threw their development team under the bus that made your server possible by claiming their work as your own. Just because you are 'closed source' doesn't mean it gives you an excuse to claim everything you have done as yours. Much like I can't claim that TAK wouldn't be possible without a lot of the work Harakiri and Yeahlight did on EQClassic/Trilogy as most of the structures were used as a starting point for the Mac client before I dumped the protocol from the client itself.

When you start saying that you can do a better job than us, it becomes something personal. So here's something personal back:

Shut the fuck up. No one cares. This isn't a competition and you are hurting the remnants of the EQMac community by splintering into p2002. Your server is what I was trying to avoid when I started this project; 'holier than thou' attitudes and competition instead of sharing code and content with each other. You're only hurting the players by doing this.

You cannot argue against this; you are refusing to give back to the open source project because you want to be 'the best' and this is going to bite the players in the ass in the end if they truly do like your server more than ours - you are removing the option for people to play where they please by closed sourcing your project, which was my only request with the project, is that you keep it open sourced, as you have quoted me saying, so people can choose where to play. What happens if your GM team is corrupt and someone wants to make their own P2002? Shit ain't happening because of you.

If someone says, "You can have this for free and I expect nothing but your contributions in return" and you say "I am not giving you anything back, thanks for the free stuff", does that put you in the wrong? Yes.

You won't see P2002 GMs saying what I say because they don't have the balls to say it on a public forum; they'd rather talk about people behind their back and laugh privately, 'oh, look, Secrets posted another rant about our server, haha, how funny is that? look how mad Secrets is getting!' - You are cowards and attention seekers, and I find that despicable.

Requesting move to R&F.

[Secrets]

Just realized how much guilt I have for posting the above... disregard what I posted, arguing is pointless I suppose. I'm posting out of anger and I really shouldn't be posting right now. Running on little to no sleep and getting upset over something so trivial is pointless.

[Barkingturtle]

Honestly, none of you have done a great job representing your respective servers in this thread. I guess this Apio guy is at least remaining mostly calm. Personally, I'm gonna keep playing exclusively on Red because it feels like a more positive community than p2002 or TAK. This thread is my first impression of both -- I ain't alone in my assessment, I'm sure.

In the future, before you post your bitchy nerd-rants, I simply suggest you ask yourselves, "What would Nilbog do?" That dude is all class, all the time. Like Jesus but with more credibility.

[Laugher]

Originally Posted by Barkingturtle [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

"What would Nilbog do?" That dude is all class, all the time. Like Jesus but with more credibility.

Wwnd hehehe

[apio]

Oh I do not deny I was making a ruckus before on TAK, that was because I was merely a player at that point, and our guild and myself were being treated like 2nd class citizens on the server (despite making up 80% of it's population at that point) simply because we were not casual players.

I could go on and on about how I appealed my ban and other than some lengthy post by Speedz that was full of lies and slander and didn't contain a single shred of evidence of my "commited crimes" and even though I gave Zarwayne access to my forum account to go through my PM history such evidence never surfaced.

BUT

I have since realized that there is more than enough room for 2 projects that stop at PoP, and that it gives BOTH casual and "hardcore" players a chance to each realize their own play style - Both servers existing serves both servers, and we can help each other out.

Additionally I think starting a dick swinging contest on the forums doesn't server P2002 or TAK, and I have stated this many many times in this thread.


If you want to bring up the past, let us please air ALL the dirty laundry and not just the part that makes Project 2002 look bad. But instead, I say: let bygones be bygones, and let us have a dialogue and stop this misinformation/smear campaign

This goes out to both sides


PS:

It is not speculation. You took advantage of an open source project and threw their development team under the bus that made your server possible by claiming their work as your own. Just because you are 'closed source' doesn't mean it gives you an excuse to claim everything you have done as yours. Much like I can't claim that TAK wouldn't be possible without a lot of the work Harakiri and Yeahlight did on EQClassic/Trilogy as most of the structures were used as a starting point for the Mac client before I dumped the protocol from the client itself

More lies and slander. We have in the past and will in the future keep crediting the TAK team for their dedication and work, and we have NEVER, I repeat, NEVER claimed any of your work as our own. We actually helped you get the database to where you had it when we split off, so that is another point to consider, and we are still actively contributing a lot of stuff to TAK. Just 2 weeks ago we shared ALL the Kunark Epic Scripts.


You didn't hate on our project when you were still trying to take credit for it, Secrets, please try to remember that. There is links to the post on rerolled in this very thread

[BossThunderace]

Originally Posted by Secrets [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

look how mad Secrets is getting!

Classic

[BossThunderace]

Originally Posted by apio [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I say: let bygones be bygones, and let us have a dialogue and stop this misinformation/smear campaign

This goes out to both sides

^^^

Happy Saturday [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Lorian]

I recommend a beer or two! [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[Sketched]

Is P2002 totally closed source? I am pretty sure TAKP is open, minus the cheat protection. That is a fairly important detail. Much nicer to play and contribute somewhere open, but that is just me