P99 Enchanter Strike

[Sorrow*qc]

its funny how all the necros know exactly how the chanters were on live

[baalzy]

Who do you think we had to compete with when they figured out how to charm?

[redghosthunter]

"A small body of determined spirits fired by an unquenchable faith in their mission can alter the course of history."

Mohandas Gandhi

Anyone doubt that people, NEED their C ? I don't ever want to hear another complaint about Charm if you don't take action now....

[Throb]

Originally Posted by Marley [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

. I myself have found if the enchanter charms a mob a few levels lower, charm works great in a group of skilled players. I'm a cleric though, wtf do i know [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Uh, more like 15 levels below you (aka, light blue) and even then I've seen 10 second breaks. If you charm something even close to level 50 now the mana expense to constantly recharm on these fast breaks isn't worth the little bit of DPS the pet does when he isn't trying to rip off your face.

[Humerox]

funny how nobody's ponied up about how OP charm was on raids, and how it trivialized encounters to a ridiculous degree.

not knocking the chanters, god knows I luv 'em, but hey...

just sayin~

[Myrkskog]

Everyone knew how ridiculous it was on raids. Pets in general are OP on raids.

[Throb]

Originally Posted by Humerox [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

funny how nobody's ponied up about how OP charm was on raids, and how it trivialized encounters to a ridiculous degree.

not knocking the chanters, god knows I luv 'em, but hey...

just sayin~

Ponied up? There is no denying an army of charmed pets was way overpowered. Honestly, I think people are misremembering a lot of things regarding classic charm. Lots of enchanters didn't even use it, epsecially on raids. Hell, most necromancers and mages weren't allowed to use pets on raids. People were so completely illogical and unreasonable regarding any pets whatsoever on raids, and that continued well into Luclin and maybe beyond. It only takes a few idiots that can't control their shit to make people flip the fuck out and say enough is enough, no more pets.

However, the enchanters I knew that were good at it and knew their shit, were literally gods in classic. I don't know about your server, but on mine the first classes to solo lower guk (king and ghoul lord) in classic were enchanters and necromancers because of charm. In exp groups with a shaman and enc, the exp flowed even well into POP, until they nerfed it.

Making enchanters take it up the ass like this (and that IS what you're doing) is NOT classic. If you want to nerf charm fine, but let's be reasonable about it.... even if it does not fall in line with classic, someone needs to look at the resist checks and tell me it's not completely fucked up. There is a middle ground here that will let enchanters have some of their deserved power and appease the haters at the same time. Let's get there.

Thanks.

[Rilen]

To harp on a bit of what Throb said. I think most people are misleading themselves in thinking that charm is as it was on live. How many ench did you know with 255 charisma that constantly ran malo/tash on their pets? How many did you know that kept -MR items bagged specifically to give to pets to lower their break chances?

Like many things here, they seem OP'd because everyone knows the name of the game already. On live MANY things simply were not done the way they are here because of a lack of general knowledge of such things. I distinctly remember enchanters doing duo/trio work in Kunark, and I remember when my group of friends first got started in Velious charming giants in the arena. My little collective of friends would have been incapable of doing anything were it not for the ench holding a lieutenant in the arena as a pet.

The reason I remember for charm and pets in general not being as prevalent in the experience scene is that pets ALWAYS took a percentage of exp; even if you did 5 damage or whatever. Also, like Throb said, people had a stigma about people not controlling their pets, or a paranoia about pet pathing that over-rode whatever assistance they might have given on raids.

And to reiterate some of what I said, even after the charm nerfs on live I ran a PLing service for 60+ characters using druid charm as my primary method of xp. This was on a DRUID with approximately 200 charisma, no dire charm. I had no problem keeping pets for 10 minutes to kill 3-5 mobs before the charm broke and then I'd DD/DoT and kill the pet.

As it stands now, between not being able to retrieve items from pets, and the charms seeming to be entirely level based, the charm line for all classes involved is nearly useless. This isn't the way it should be for a character with 255 charisma, malo, and 5-10 levels on the mob being charmed.

It needs to be recognized that while people may not have their own anecdotal evidence of charm being powerful (or any "overused" ability here), 90% of that reason is because this server has MANY players with MUCH higher skill than any of our live servers had. The worst guilds on this server are still 10x better, and more knowledgeable than most of the population of any live server. Most people here flat out play at a higher skill level than what was seen normally on live. We don't all deserve to suffer, or be forced into some niche of mediocrity simply because we know what we're doing or understand how to play the game.

[ziahh]

Originally Posted by Rilen [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

To harp on a bit of what Throb said. I think most people are misleading themselves in thinking that charm is as it was on live. How many ench did you know with 255 charisma that constantly ran malo/tash on their pets? How many did you know that kept -MR items bagged specifically to give to pets to lower their break chances?

Like many things here, they seem OP'd because everyone knows the name of the game already. On live MANY things simply were not done the way they are here because of a lack of general knowledge of such things. I distinctly remember enchanters doing duo/trio work in Kunark, and I remember when my group of friends first got started in Velious charming giants in the arena. My little collective of friends would have been incapable of doing anything were it not for the ench holding a lieutenant in the arena as a pet.

The reason I remember for charm and pets in general not being as prevalent in the experience scene is that pets ALWAYS took a percentage of exp; even if you did 5 damage or whatever. Also, like Throb said, people had a stigma about people not controlling their pets, or a paranoia about pet pathing that over-rode whatever assistance they might have given on raids.

And to reiterate some of what I said, even after the charm nerfs on live I ran a PLing service for 60+ characters using druid charm as my primary method of xp. This was on a DRUID with approximately 200 charisma, no dire charm. I had no problem keeping pets for 10 minutes to kill 3-5 mobs before the charm broke and then I'd DD/DoT and kill the pet.

As it stands now, between not being able to retrieve items from pets, and the charms seeming to be entirely level based, the charm line for all classes involved is nearly useless. This isn't the way it should be for a character with 255 charisma, malo, and 5-10 levels on the mob being charmed.

It needs to be recognized that while people may not have their own anecdotal evidence of charm being powerful (or any "overused" ability here), 90% of that reason is because this server has MANY players with MUCH higher skill than any of our live servers had. The worst guilds on this server are still 10x better, and more knowledgeable than most of the population of any live server. Most people here flat out play at a higher skill level than what was seen normally on live. We don't all deserve to suffer, or be forced into some niche of mediocrity simply because we know what we're doing or understand how to play the game.

yep

[Falisaty]

Originally Posted by Rais [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Charm was never reliable in classic eq. There was hardly ever charmed mobs on raids.

i can prob say the reason it was not reliable in classic was that no ench thought to max out cha and tash + malo the mob. We know so much more because this is an 11 yo game. i don't know why everyone is crying about how all the pet classes are so OP. im sure if we knew back then what we now know EQ would have been different back in 1999.