Quillmane spawn

[Croco]

Originally Posted by cd288 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I can't recall the full discussion at the time but wasn't one of the things they said was they weren't sure the original mechanics were classic either, and they wanted to bring back some of that classic "feel" where people weren't entirely sure how the mechanic worked? Maybe the latter is gone now if everyone has figured it out, but that's inevitable

And that's where the project goes off the rails. When you try to enforce a single person's memory of how classic felt. If there was no definitive information how exactly the spawn worked the correct play was to leave it as it had been for 10+ years.

[greenspectre]

Originally Posted by Croco [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

And that's where the project goes off the rails. When you try to enforce a single person's memory of how classic felt. If there was no definitive information how exactly the spawn worked the correct play was to leave it as it had been for 10+ years.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRLeVEuuLXM&t=1396s

Check this video at 18:35 and 20:10 especially. It's literally an interview with the guy who DESIGNED the Quillmane spawn. He says he saw a video where someone said it was "A lioness and an elephant calf" but said that wasn't the actual spawn as it was designed and it was more "Probably just one of the lower level spawns...the variety spawns...and just a percentage off of that...that had all of the lower level spawns in it"

So if anything based on that wording, cyclopes/treants/harriers/avocets shouldn't be included, but I'd say the p99 devs did the best they could when trying to change the mechanics to match what the actual developer best remembers them being. This is as close to definitive information as is possible 20 years later.

[Croco]

Originally Posted by greenspectre [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sRLeVEuuLXM&t=1396s

Check this video at 18:35 and 20:10 especially. It's literally an interview with the guy who DESIGNED the Quillmane spawn. He says he saw a video where someone said it was "A lioness and an elephant calf" but said that wasn't the actual spawn as it was designed and it was more "Probably just one of the lower level spawns...the variety spawns...and just a percentage off of that...that had all of the lower level spawns in it"

So if anything based on that wording, cyclopes/treants/harriers/avocets shouldn't be included, but I'd say the p99 devs did the best they could when trying to change the mechanics to match what the actual developer best remembers them being. This is as close to definitive information as is possible 20 years later.

I've watched the interview. I referenced it early in the thread. "Probably" doing a lot of heavy lifting here. Not saying he doesn't remember since he's the one that actually coded the damn thing but there's nothing to say that he isn't misremembering or thinking of an entirely different named spawn he coded. I'm sure he did a LOT of work on the game.

[cd288]

Originally Posted by Croco [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I've watched the interview. I referenced it early in the thread. "Probably" doing a lot of heavy lifting here. Not saying he doesn't remember since he's the one that actually coded the damn thing but there's nothing to say that he isn't misremembering or thinking of an entirely different named spawn he coded. I'm sure he did a LOT of work on the game.

No offense but this is kind of a BS response. If that's the standard then we might as well ignore every single thing any prior dev or anyone else involved in the game has ever said.

"Well yeah, I know the prior dev said that, but like he MIGHT be misremembering it you never know. So it shouldn't really be considered as evidence."

Come on man

[Croco]

Originally Posted by cd288 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

No offense but this is kind of a BS response. If that's the standard then we might as well ignore every single thing any prior dev or anyone else involved in the game has ever said.

"Well yeah, I know the prior dev said that, but like he MIGHT be misremembering it you never know. So it shouldn't really be considered as evidence."

Come on man

Honestly it's not a bs response. Dude is asking him about a random rare mob that he set up in the game over 20 years ago and the guy isn't that sure about it. The answer he gives is pretty clear he doesn't remember exactly.

[greenspectre]

Originally Posted by Croco [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Honestly it's not a bs response. Dude is asking him about a random rare mob that he set up in the game over 20 years ago and the guy isn't that sure about it. The answer he gives is pretty clear he doesn't remember exactly.

And while he doesn't remember exactly, it's the closest evidence we have. Nothing we have documented even compares, and he did say with certainty that killing lionesses and elephant calves wasn't it. So as a p99 dev I'd say that input is as good as gold.

The fact of the matter is there isn't definitive evidence from player posts circa 1999-2001 that had Quillmane completely nailed down, because Allakhazam and such were in their infancy and the EQ hivemind barely existed. So if the players didn't know, I'd definitely go with what the dev says here.

[cd288]

Originally Posted by greenspectre [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

And while he doesn't remember exactly, it's the closest evidence we have. Nothing we have documented even compares, and he did say with certainty that killing lionesses and elephant calves wasn't it. So as a p99 dev I'd say that input is as good as gold.

The fact of the matter is there isn't definitive evidence from player posts circa 1999-2001 that had Quillmane completely nailed down, because Allakhazam and such were in their infancy and the EQ hivemind barely existed. So if the players didn't know, I'd definitely go with what the dev says here.

This articulated the point I was trying to make much better than my earlier comment

[cd288]

Originally Posted by Croco [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

And that's where the project goes off the rails. When you try to enforce a single person's memory of how classic felt. If there was no definitive information how exactly the spawn worked the correct play was to leave it as it had been for 10+ years.

That's a broader debate that encompasses way more than just QM, although I don't disagree with you entirely. but on QM specifically, as GS just showed they seem to have come as close as they could to figuring it out.

[Ennewi]

Honestly, for blue server, it would be neat if eventually changes like the one to QM came and went, making spawns in the world slightly/significantly different here and there. It happens anyway, but would be cool if it was a more concerted effort, similar to how it is with Lodi and Badain currently, although those could have an even greater range imo.

After one patch Vessel Drozlin is spawning elsewhere in the East Cab sewers. After another, Verina Tomb spawns in one of the private mansions. Different guards in Freeport see invis.

Gore and Sev spawn at new locs. Step outside of KC right after a quake, only to be confronted by angry white dragon blocking the way. Same difference for Sev, only outside of CoM. A classic memorable oh shit experience, even if it isn't true to the classic trilogy to a T. With unexpected changes like those, even longtime BiS players couldn't get too comfortable moving from zone to zone.

[Sadre Spinegnawer]

Originally Posted by Croco [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

And that's where the project goes off the rails. When you try to enforce a single person's memory of how classic felt. If there was no definitive information how exactly the spawn worked the correct play was to leave it as it had been for 10+ years.

Unless they think the goal of the project is to create a classic tlp. So that means only x amounts of months for original, then kunark and the epics, then velious. Have to make sure folks can get their epics in decent numbers by velious?

That is only an issue, and the Quillmane spawn is only an issue, if you are thinking in terms of expansion progression.

And that is why. There. Is. Only. One. Solution.

Not even gonna post it.