Tunnel Gear - Warrior Weapons

[zelld52]

Originally Posted by Solist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Counter counter counter point:
Play an MMORPG exclusively solo, and don't make efforts to play with others that extend beyind what is probably expected.

Huge jump between grouping with others and giving players items and telling them to be your pocket healer. Lot of ground you didn't cover on that logical leap there.

[Goregasmic]

From the other threads like this before, best EC option is the spade. Truncheon relatively distant second. Reaver is probably alright too.

1handers you'd have to calculate hate per minute, proc per minute depending on dex and proc hate. The first 2 are easy but we have no verified numbers for proc hate.

From what I understand Wess and infestation had massive aggro due to having a lot of poison counters but I think all procs got capped at 400 hate. This means wess/infestation probably still proc max hate but it possibly doesn't compensate for inferior ratio anymore, especially for WESS. So better weapons with lesser procs might have overtaken them on the hate charts.

Never seen anyone post any tangible results for this post nerf though. Even less so for EC options. It is very possible something like a SBOZ generates more hate from white damage than a frostbringer.

[PatChapp]

Originally Posted by Goregasmic [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

From the other threads like this before, best EC option is the spade. Truncheon relatively distant second. Reaver is probably alright too.

1handers you'd have to calculate hate per minute, proc per minute depending on dex and proc hate. The first 2 are easy but we have no verified numbers for proc hate.

From what I understand Wess and infestation had massive aggro due to having a lot of poison counters but I think all procs got capped at 400 hate. This means wess/infestation probably still proc max hate but it possibly doesn't compensate for inferior ratio anymore, especially for WESS. So better weapons with lesser procs might have overtaken them on the hate charts.

Never seen anyone post any tangible results for this post nerf though. Even less so for EC options. It is very possible something like a SBOZ generates more hate from white damage than a frostbringer.

Infestation proc doesn't add any hate beyond the minimal dmg,as it isn't a debuff, It use useless for warriors now.
Not sure on wess but should be 400hate proc

[Goregasmic]

Originally Posted by PatChapp [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Infestation proc doesn't add any hate beyond the minimal dmg,as it isn't a debuff, It use useless for warriors now.
Not sure on wess but should be 400hate proc

It isn't a debuff but it is still 3 poison counters and I thought poison counters gave a lot of hate?

Did they change how hate works or just the cap?

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Goregasmic [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

It isn't a debuff but it is still 3 poison counters and I thought poison counters gave a lot of hate?

Did they change how hate works or just the cap?

https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...highlight=Hate

This was the big hate adjustment patch, which dropped at the end of 2022.

While it doesn't talk about poison counters directly, I remember discussions about poison/disease counters being nerfed/bugged hate-wise. People are saying they don't generate hate. I haven't tested it personally.

https://www.project1999.com/forums/s....php?p=3643387

[PatChapp]

They do not generate hate

[PatChapp]

We out feverblades and the vp poison weapons on rogue bots for a decent free offhand now, they do nothing for hate

[WarpathEQ]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...highlight=Hate

This was the big hate adjustment patch, which dropped at the end of 2022.

While it doesn't talk about poison counters directly, I remember discussions about poison/disease counters being nerfed/bugged hate-wise. People are saying they don't generate hate. I haven't tested it personally.

https://www.project1999.com/forums/s....php?p=3643387

Long.Liam seems to have it right in that second link. That aligns with my understanding and experience of how procs and hate amounts work.

I don't think that poison and disease is bugged just that counters themselves don't add hate. My assumption is that it just goes off the white damage as the hate amount for poison and disease spells/procs/DoTs. Which was likely to balance agro for classes that use big damage poison and disease DoTs (i.e. Shaman).

WESS is a bit unique in that its proc contains poison counters but not really tied to any other outcome, the proc is basically the same exact thing as the bio orb effect, but with some extra poison counters. Any easy test would be compare the hate of the WESS proc to a bio orb click. I bet the hate amount is 100% the same.

Really that means the issue with the WESS isn't a low hate proc, its still an very high hate proc, just has a shitty ratio/high delay compare to other weapons with relatively strong hate procs leading to overall less hate and DPS leading to this item falling out of favor with the tank community.

[Goregasmic]

Originally Posted by DeathsSilkyMist [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

https://www.project1999.com/forums/s...highlight=Hate

This was the big hate adjustment patch, which dropped at the end of 2022.

While it doesn't talk about poison counters directly, I remember discussions about poison/disease counters being nerfed/bugged hate-wise. People are saying they don't generate hate. I haven't tested it personally.

https://www.project1999.com/forums/s....php?p=3643387

Yeah I read that, both the patch and the supposedly buggy poison/disease counters. Nothing super informative in the end. Seems like we'll never know until someone tests it out and that seems like a painstaking process.

WESS is a bit unique in that its proc contains poison counters but not really tied to any other outcome, the proc is basically the same exact thing as the bio orb effect, but with some extra poison counters. Any easy test would be compare the hate of the WESS proc to a bio orb click. I bet the hate amount is 100% the same.

Maybe im dumb but it seems hard to isolate a proc value from swing hate noise. You'd have to account for hate done in real time or be lucky and proc on the first swing.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by WarpathEQ [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I don't think that poison and disease is bugged just that counters themselves don't add hate.

Poison/disease counters did generate hate on P99 before. That is why Infestation was a highly sought after Warrior weapon for years. You may not have seen that since you joined in 2023. After the 2022 patch I linked previously, people stopped using weapons that relied on poison/disease counters like Infestation. Raid Warriors usually have a good understanding/feel for their weapon hate. So I believe people when they say poison/disease counter hate changed. I just haven't tested it myself.