Velious Solo/Duo Challenge Official Thread (and Trio/Group)

[Goregasmic]

Originally Posted by zelld52 [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

I havent seen many people soloing WW dragons since they disallowed the exploit of tanking them in the water - the 6 necks, anyway

Never done them yet but there's a couple 4s that seem not too hard but the 5s AEs seem brutal on mobs with that much HP.

[Zuranthium]

We'll need to get an official confirmation on if it's allowed or not, and then discuss from there. Water jumping to stop water-only MOBs from being able to keep attacking is another thing everyone uses, but I can't see that being considered punishable.

Originally Posted by Tewaz [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

[pacify attempt, rooted dragons, boxing, IP lockouts]

What are you talking about "pacify attempt"? That spell will simply not work at all in any area of high level MOBs. The other things you wrote are irrelevant to solo challenges. You've now made 5 posts with 0 contribution.

Originally Posted by Goregasmic [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

This is most likely why the old challenge died, it was literally the first tier of the challenge and like half of the classes can't handle it

That's not how it's designed here. By including a wide variety of MOBs and accounting for the logistics of fighting in an area, without using pull help and cheat items, it allows many more possible paths. God tier rank (but not individual kills) will of course still be out of reach for most classes but that's okay, because at the very upper end we're trying to see the peak of what someone can do solo regardless of class.

If non-classic lull is allowed then it forces everything to be centered around it and kills the variety of what can be considered challenging. Why would we want that? It would just be a big waste of everyone's time anyway, since it's going to get changed.

Originally Posted by Goregasmic [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

then it basically become a gear/rng contest at higher levels.

That's inherently what solo challenges are, unless you're doing a SFF challenge (which vastly favors casters over melee, and still involves RNG). You need to have great gear to do difficult things as a melee and any class needs to not get resisted too much on spells/procs that are needed to do the encounter. Many things that are possible to do solo/duo are a matter of repeating the engage until things line up properly. It's all a matter of time expenditure, once you've figured out the method of tackling a specific piece of content.

[Zuranthium]

The official ruling on using water to avoid Dragon AoE's is "There’s been some back and forth about whether or not it’s actually an exploit, but ultimately we tell people not to. Do people still do it? Yeah, probably. Are we actively watching and hunting them down? Nope."

I guess to be safe, it should not be allowed for the challenge. In which case, what do we think about these ratings for the WW Dragons:

SOLO MASTER: Yeldema , Myga , Sivar

SOLO GRANDMASTER: Makala , Atpaev , Yal , Honvar , Gafala , Vraptin , Vitaela , Pantrilla , Linbrak , Onava , Mazi , Hechaeva , Glati , Crial , Gangel

SOLO GOD: Uiliak , Esorpa of the Ring , Bratavar , Amcilla , Quoza , Nintal , Bufa , Ionat , Neordla , Ayillish , Entariz , Kar Sapara , Travala

DUO GOD: Von , Karkona , Derasinal , Draazak , Rak Sapara , Zil Sapara , Del Sapara , Tranala

TRIO GOD: Mav Sapara , Jen Sapara , Mraaka

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Bravatar is a 4+ Dragon. It shouldn't be on the same tier as Ayillish or Ionat. Bravatar is like Hechaeva, so Bravatar should be on the same tier as Hechaeva.

[Zuranthium]

Loot is irrelevant to how strong a MOB is. Going by current info, Bravatar hits harder than Ayillish and Ionat. Definitely deserves to be in the same category as them if the info is correct (hopefully these challenges will help to get everything fully correct on the wiki).

[Danth]

Bratavar is weaker and has less health than Ayillish. On favorable occasions I've tanked Bratavar through (paired with the wife's shaman) without even needing an outside heal. However I would only rate Ayillish in particular as only about a half-tier higher than the basic +4's. Neordla tends to be a little tougher than Ayillish despite having equivalent "on paper" stats....for whatever reason it hits the upper end of its range more often. Entariz (sp?) is a bit tougher due to a stronger AE and Ionat is more dangerous than any of the above when not water-cheezing it due to silence AE.

Glati can be annoying because it's a gater...if fought at spawn it's basically on par with most of the above though. Cargalia can also be a jerk since it has the same nasty AE the other Vox-lookalike roamers have but it's also a shaman.

[DeathsSilkyMist]

Originally Posted by Zuranthium [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Loot is irrelevant to how strong a MOB is. Going by current info, Bravatar hits harder than Ayillish and Ionat. Definitely deserves to be in the same category as them if the info is correct (hopefully these challenges will help to get everything fully correct on the wiki).

I've fought Hechaeva and Bratavar many times, and I have videos. I have fought Ayillish and Ionat many times too.

Bratavar is not as hard as Ayillish and Ionat. You can check out my videos. I am not sure why you are refusing to take advice from players who have actually fought these mobs.

https://youtu.be/igpbLuNe0ls?feature=shared - Bratavar - Fight is from ~8 minute mark to ~21 minute mark to get Bratavar running. 13 minutes total. Max hit is 219.

https://youtu.be/uEgFcImQ9XU?feature=shared - Hechaeva - Fight is from ~ 1 minute 30 mark to ~13 minute mark to get Hechaeva running. 12 minutes total. Max hit is 219.

https://youtu.be/oPxeOVuX0G8?feature=shared - Ionat - Fight is from ~2 minute 30 mark to ~22 minute 30 mark to get Ionat running. 20 minutes total. Max hit is 237.

All 3 fights were using the same DPS strategy. The wiki is just wrong about bratavar. He doesn't hit for 300.

[Zuranthium]

I skipped Cargalia on the list it seems! Should be in Duo God.

Originally Posted by Danth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Ionat is more dangerous than any of the above when not water-cheezing it due to silence AE.

A user on wiki says they soloed Ionat without using water tanking, although I'm not sure if they used consumables to achieve it. Didn't sound like it, but how often does the silence land in your experience?

Originally Posted by Danth [You must be logged in to view images. Log in or Register.]

Glati can be annoying because it's a gater...if fought at spawn it's basically on par with most of the above though.

Do you think Glati should be moved to God tier rather than Grandmaster? If the info is correct he has far less HP than Ayillish, although a 500 point breath rather than 250, plus the shaman spells. Can see that deserving to be in the same tier.

[Danth]

Ionat is annoying for the wife and I since we're in middle-tier gear with unremarkable resists. Someone with NTOV type resists on gear would probably shrug it off. Since the challenge can't account for gear, probably best to leave it where it's at. That's why the tiers have multiple monsters after all, gives players some ability to customize it to their own specific needs.

Uiliak is IIRC basically the exact same as the other "standard +4's." Most of them are cut-and-pastes of each other 'cept for model and resist type on AE (fire or cold). The Phara Dar lookalikes (Bufa and I think Nintal) hit for 300's instead of the usual low 200's for the +4's, but they don't hit max all that much and aren't really a special problem--same general tier just slightly harder within the tier. Roaming Vox lookalikes (Von, Cargalia, any of the Saparas) are hard due to nasty AE but you accounted for that.

Ayillish is hard to classify: Either harder than any of the basic plus 4's or weaker than anything else in its tier. It *barely* out damages the nest +4's (hence why it's such a popular target--easiest +6) and the main difference is a longer fight. It's even a trivial pull. I suppose this is why each tier requires miltiple distinct kills. Entariz is equivalent to Ayillish except with a 400 AE instead of 250. Players with high resist gear would find them equivalent and Entariz is the second-most-solo'd of the +6's. Entariz and Ionat can be tricky to pull due to close proximity to each other and Sontalak but once pulled normal rules apply.

I don't recall ever having pulled Travala...if I have I don't remember it. It's a quest mob and not much reason to pull it normally. It's red to 60 and mostly it's an annoying roamer you have to watch out for. Red to 60 makes me wonder if it belongs in the same tier as a relative weakling like Ayillish, but OTOH maybe Trav's weak for its level too. I have to defer to others' judgement on that one.

It's been a long time since I pulled Glati--more fuss than he's worth so he's usually ignored--but my recollection is the fight was hardly different than the normal plus 4's ignoring the gate (ie, fight it at spawn). Mainly it just dispells a lot and heals a bit. I don't recall the breath AE being an issue. It's harder than the nest +4's but weaker than stuff like Entariz or Ionat. If it were me I'd leave that one in the weaker tier just understanding it as a "tough" mob for the weaker tier.

[Zuranthium]

Has anyone ever seen "Nyga" in Western Wastes? It's supposed to be a Level 53 Dragon. Either hasn't been put in game on p99 or the wiki doesn't have it listed.

I also see a historical post that says Nintal is supposed to have a stronger breath attack than the standard 250 point one, anyone know the specifics of that in game right now?